Replace z3ta with Rapture?

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rddionne
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2006/03/11 11:33:47 (permalink)

Replace z3ta with Rapture?

I bought z3ta through Cakewalk last August, but now I'm wondering...

Since Rene joined Cakewalk from rgc:Audio and is developing Rapture will z3ta upgrades end? Is Rapture good enough to replace z3ta in my soft studio? Also, will Rapture be "Receptorized" so I can run it on my Receptor out of the box or will this be done later?

Thanks,
BD
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    lawapa
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    RE: Replace z3ta with Rapture? 2006/03/11 18:43:20 (permalink)
    Some overlap between z3ta and Rapture, but they are different animals. If you like z3ta then rapture will grab ya as well. Both of these come as DXI'S and VST's which I thought you could load into Receptor. But with your comment about "receptorized" maybe I'm wrong on that point?

    Sonar 5- Vegas 6, Pentagon, Z3ta+ ,SFZ+ ,Fm7, Tassman3, Vocator, SoundForge 6, Vsampler 3, Project 5-2, Dimension Pro, Rapture and 2 kick ass DawBox machines:)+)
    #2
    rddionne
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    RE: Replace z3ta with Rapture? 2006/03/12 00:59:34 (permalink)
    Receptor is designed to run VST synths and effects, which takes a load off my PC. The problem is you can't assume any VST will work on the machine. Receptor uses a custom OS and can't run the setup/installer programs that would normally install the software on your PC. There are a couple of web sites (www.kvraudio.com, www.plugorama.com) where you can see VST's that are known to work with no changes, ones that have had custom drivers to help install, and many that are unsupported or untested for Receptor.

    I have successfully moved several softsynths from my PC to Receptor and decided those that won't work will be dropped from my collection (Virsyn Tera is one that doesn't work). Rapture looks great but I won't drop the $$$ unless I know it will work on the Receptor.

    I would volunteer to accept a free copy of Rapture from Cakewalk and test the install on my Receptor. What are my chances on this and who do I contact??
    #3
    b rock
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    RE: Replace z3ta with Rapture? 2006/03/12 11:05:21 (permalink)
    Rapture looks great but I won't drop the $$$ unless I know it will work on the Receptor.
    Here's a generalized answer from someone in the know. It comes from [this thread] below.
    The copy-protected plugins, "premium"/for-sale plugins that you buy at your music store, we have to build installers for, there is no way around that. We tend to be moving away from cross-grade fees, but these costs usually go directly to the developer of the plugins anyway.
    Same as you, Bob. I'd be reluctant to spend $1500 (thereabouts) on a Receptor, another couple hundred on a single premium synth, and possibly more later to "Receptorize" without a concrete assurance of reliable performance and compatibility. There's no punch record in a live setting.
    #4
    lawapa
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    RE: Replace z3ta with Rapture? 2006/03/12 11:55:01 (permalink)
    That sure made Receptor look like not so great a deal at all. If you buy a standalone box to run VST's it should run vst's properly coded. If not, it's not what it's marketed as. By dumping the cost of coversion back on software dev's who see this as a nich market. You end up with a sudo UAD/Powercore. They tell you what you can run. This puts limits on what you can run. I just had the impression it was open ended like the vst spec. So you could take your synths to a gig and play without dragging around a pc.
    #5
    b rock
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    RE: Replace z3ta with Rapture? 2006/03/12 12:40:26 (permalink)
    That sure made Receptor look like not so great a deal at all.
    I don't want to leave the impression that VSTis don't work in Receptor, or that the fees to "Receptorize" wouldn't be nominal, Larry. I just don't know for sure on a synth-by-synth basis. Lots of "freebies" work, but I can only think of a small handful that I would consider for live use. FWIW: Jordan Rudess [Dream Theater] uses z3ta+, and I believe that extends to live use. Of course, we all don't have personal synth-techs, or the ability & resources to carry 100% redundant backup, either.

    It's a great idea. I just don't know if *I'm* ready to do the upkeep & maintenance required to make this a viable & reliable [read: bullet-proof] live option. Just yet. This vague feeling of a "crapshoot" is holding me back. [Here's a list of supported plugins and then some.]

    Back to the original question, though: Is it too soon to ask about the reality of a Rapture Receptor?
    #6
    whitefalcon
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    RE: Replace z3ta with Rapture? 2006/03/12 13:55:12 (permalink)
    I didnt know what you guys were talking about so I found this site
    http://www.museresearch.com/receptor_overview.php
    If you watch the intro demo it says z3ta works on the box, to me i would thing Rapture should work to since its very similiar to Z3ta in some respects.
    If you purchase it at Guitar center then they have a warrenty for a certain time that if it does not work you can bring it back...
    Check out the videos on that site.
    Why would you want to buy this box thought when you could bring a souped up lap top on your tour with a nice midi controller and P5 and do all it does and more
    The controller box has a limit of 16 vsti synths, P5 has no limit so you could have 24 vst synths with the lap top configuration that to me looks like a better scenario.
    Its possible memory could be an issue, perhaps there is something i am not seeing here you are...
    #7
    dougsyo
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    RE: Replace z3ta with Rapture? 2006/03/12 14:58:52 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: whitefalcon

    I didnt know what you guys were talking about so I found this site
    http://www.museresearch.com/receptor_overview.php
    If you watch the intro demo it says z3ta works on the box, to me i would thing Rapture should work to since its very similiar to Z3ta in some respects.

    The problem is, in a nutshell, installation/registration/authorization/copy protection on the VSTI, not the VSTI itself.

    Anything that uses an installer or VSTI that creates registry keys, prompts for a serial number, calls out to a vendor to license or authenticate, etc may need to have a work-around for Receptor - a "receptorized" installer, for example.

    In z3ta+ as Rene distributed it, the installer was more-or-less a convenience as much as anything. You could probably run the installer on a PC then drag the folder over to the Receptor or however it's done, and it's ready to go.

    If z3ta+ as now distributed by Cakewalk operates as DimPro does - you have to enter a serial number, and you also have to authorize (non-C/R) the VSTI, then it's possible that it's no longer Receptor-compatible. Contact Muse.

    Also, double-check if Guitar Center's return policy covers software. I was told that Sam Ash didn't - and in fact, there was a MIDI keyboard that I bought there and decided to return/exchange, and they asked if there was software bundled with it, because if there was then the package (keyboard + software) was non-returnable.

    Doug
    post edited by dougsyo - 2006/03/12 15:08:03
    #8
    whitefalcon
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    RE: Replace z3ta with Rapture? 2006/03/12 15:09:28 (permalink)
    The problem is, in a nutshell, installation/registration/authorization/copy protection on the VSTI, not the VSTI itself.

    Anything that uses an installer or VSTI that creates registry keys, prompts for a serial number, calls out to a vendor to license or authenticate, etc may need to have a work-around for Receptor - a "receptorized" installer, for example.

    In z3ta+ as Rene distributed it, the installer was more-or-less a convenience as much as anything. You could probably run the installer on a PC then drag the folder over to the Receptor or however it's done, and it's ready to go.

    If z3ta+ as now distributed by Cakewalk operates as DimPro does - you have to enter a serial number, and you also have to authorize (non-C/R) the VSTI, then it's possible that it's no longer Receptor-compatible. Contact Muse.

    Likewise, products protected with Syncrosoft dongles (newer IK and Steinberg VSTI, Korg Legacy Digital, etc) aren't supported on Receptor at the present time.

    Also, double-check if Guitar Center's return policy covers software. I was told that Sam Ash didn't - and in fact, there was a MIDI keyboard that I bought there, and they asked if there was software bundled with it, because if there was then the keyboard was non-returnable.


    If thats the case then Rapture probably would not work on it because of the SN
    Z3ta is still an exe Cakewalk did not modify it at all, I think the installer is even still the same. I noticed this when I purchased it from them and downloaded it.
    I read on the site comparing a laptop to the Receptor saying if you dropped a laptop during a performance you would be hosed, with receptor its more robust was stated there. The truth is dropping either from 3 feet would be disasterous during a live tour. I doubt either would survive that kind of a fall and still work. So I call that a wash.
    I could see if someone did not already have a laptop this could be a less expensive solution for them. But that 16 channel limit would be the deciding factor for me, I have used more then 16 vsti's not live but in studio on some occasions.
    Youre right on software from GC, or anywhere for that matter you buy you keep...
    Thanks for the feedback.
    #9
    AT
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    RE: Replace z3ta with Rapture? 2006/03/12 16:46:05 (permalink)
    Has anyone checked out Coyote R&D? It is receptorish, yet runs on its own. I'm trying to get one to check out . It seems like a perfect compromise between stand alone and subsynth.

    http://www.coyoterd.com/

    https://soundcloud.com/a-pleasure-dome
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    #10
    lawapa
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    RE: Replace z3ta with Rapture? 2006/03/12 19:21:33 (permalink)
    I don't want to leave the impression that VSTis don't work in Receptor


    On my visits to KvR Receptor threads are ever present. And I have no doubt this box while not bulit prof is a valuable asset to working musicians that can not travel their DAW boxes to a gig. That alone would make receptor a most valuable asset. All the big players would in time find porting to this standalone box a necesity simply for the exposure. As you know The threads that start did you know soandso of Tool/NIN uses the z3ta through a receptor? and THAT MY FRIEND SELLS SOFTIES. As I looked over what was supported I knew it was a must get box for the live play set. My humble set up while heavy on the rgcaudio stuff is not a show stopper. And if gigin put the meat and taters on my plate I'd have one tommorrow. I do drool over those toys I don't have ;)+) I did just get my ILONA UF vocal toolkit from Sony loops. And ordered DEMONIC - Voices from hell from Precisionsounds. Some nasty vocal musings.

    Sonar 5- Vegas 6, Pentagon, Z3ta+ ,SFZ+ ,Fm7, Tassman3, Vocator, SoundForge 6, Vsampler 3, Project 5-2, Dimension Pro, Rapture and 2 kick ass DawBox machines:)+)
    #11
    whitefalcon
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    RE: Replace z3ta with Rapture? 2006/03/13 21:45:54 (permalink)
    Has anyone checked out Coyote R&D? It is receptorish, yet runs on its own. I'm trying to get one to check out . It seems like a perfect compromise between stand alone and subsynth.

    This is an interesting hardware box. It utilizes a new concept Midi over network. They made drivers so you could run midi over tcpip and not have to use midi cables, similar to usb connections in a different format.
    They claim to get rid of the need for the computer but exactly how I am not sure, you have to be able to configure and open your programs. But it looks similar to the other program.
    Thanks for contributing this
    #12
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