Rider-First song with new digital Drums

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Cactus Music
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2013/01/16 19:49:46 (permalink)

Rider-First song with new digital Drums

So I thought I'd fight may way through an easy one first. This is my arrangement of an old song you might have heard done by the Dead or Hot Tuna. 

https://soundcloud.com/john-vere/rider

Got to work out how to even out velocity on the kit. I tried the pad sensitivity adjustment which seem to make no difference to the MIDI output. So the snare is up and down like a yo yo. 
Ya I know I can edit it, maybe tomorrow.. Or learn how to hit more evenly... Real drums don't do that. 

Johnny V  
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    The Band19
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/16 20:02:03 (permalink)
    I was hoping this was I know you Rider when I saw the name :-) I used to play in a band that did a lot of Grateful Dead tunes, suffice it to say, this one was always very popular.

    I think your drums sound good! Maybe that ride could use some variation? And the hats.


    The sun has shown on my backdoor... I still remember that afternoon on the balcony in Miami? As do the people on the boardwalk I'm sure.
    post edited by The Band19 - 2013/01/16 20:03:11

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    pentimentosound
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/16 20:22:10 (permalink)
    Congrats John! I'd be pleased with a "first try" . Velocity scaling ? Did you record the midi separately? to experiment with? What kind of digital drums?
        I just got my BFD2 box and picked up an Alesis ControlPad, just to start messing around with that. I am aiming at a DrumKat DK10 or whatever they are at now.... my ears can't take the cymbals anymore.  Michael

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    #3
    Cactus Music
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/16 20:40:56 (permalink)
    Thanks for feedback.. Sunshine on a backdoor>? Hmm I was thinking it was about his house but you could be right... ha ha. 


    Yes the drums need work still, but this was an experiment. 


    post edited by Cactus Music - 2013/01/17 11:57:30

    Johnny V  
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    Cactus Music
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/17 12:01:45 (permalink)
    Michael- The drums are Yamaha DTX 400K, I recorded Via USB to MIDI.  
    My timing is not great so I don't dare record the analog out at this point. 

    I'm using SD 3 for snare and the kit,, TTs-1 for Kick, I do it this way and bounce the SD3 to an audio track so I can add reverb. Bummer SD 3 has no efx send on mixer, that would be cool. Funny TTS-1 does. 

    The sounds from the brain are better overall as they are way more interactive with playing. The ride cymbal has a bell and very different. I can use the Brain but it would involve recording midi, Editing, send back to brain and record audio output. What I don't like about this idea is your drums are all on one stereo track so no control durring the big mix. I guess I could keep the kick separate easy enough. 

     I will try this later. I would prefer to just find a way to make it so VST's would respond properly. 

    I'm digging in the SD folder looking for better sounds. They have to be SFX or they suck  even more. This will take time like all things to do with DAW recording and getting what you want out of this stuff. 


    post edited by Cactus Music - 2013/01/17 12:04:44

    Johnny V  
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    bapu
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/17 13:23:29 (permalink)
    Not a bad first digital drums effort at all.
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    Lynn
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/17 16:23:59 (permalink)
    Regardless of the drums, you did a good job on the song overall.  Your vocal work was particularly good.  It's good to hear songs like this.

    All the best,
    Lynn

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    ABull
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/17 17:39:52 (permalink)
    Lynn


    Regardless of the drums, you did a good job on the song overall.  Your vocal work was particularly good.  It's good to hear songs like this.

    I second Lynn on this and also, the guitars were nifty.
     
    Allan
     
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    Cactus Music
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/17 21:14:51 (permalink)
    Niffty?? I'm not sure that's a compliment? ha ha! 

    I tend to be a Teleblaster guy by default, To many New Riders and Burrito Brothers albums when I was young I guess.

     That's my G&L ASTAT (Japan) which only has 2 sounds but they're both most excellent. The Amp is my trusty Princeton ( 1973). I also used my dobro and will be adding Banjo via by friend Corky soon. 
    Not happy with back up vocals,,, picky picky picky... 

    But thanks to all for listening I really do value your input. 

    Johnny V  
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    THE NIGHT FOX
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/19 12:23:02 (permalink)

    Nice job , the Hi - Hats were too loud for my taste . The rest of the kit sounded great .
    I plan on buying a new set of Rolands in the next four months , my only fear is running the kit into my DAW .
    I can tell you didn't have any problems with this electronic Yamaha kit you used except for the hi-hats being a bit too loud .

    Good one - James
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    pistolpete
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/19 14:08:02 (permalink)
    Yee Haw! over all not bad. the stops were a nice change of pace. However, there was a really bad hissing noise at about the 1:18 mark during the guitar solo.
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    eko
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/19 14:50:59 (permalink)
    Yes I react on the hissing sound too why is it there? The drums are a bit strutty and the HH a little bit to high otherwise very good.
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    Guitarhacker
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/19 15:09:47 (permalink)
    New Riders, Burritos, Poco, Nitty Gritty..... all that country rock shining through. 

    Nice work, I do remember hearing this back in the day. 

    The recording is good, nice tone and nice playing. 

    Enjoyed that a lot. Makes me wanna go dig out the old 33LPs and spin them again. 

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    Scottytunes
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/19 18:35:58 (permalink)
    Truly delicious sounding! 

    I love my Roland kit. So easy to record with no mic set up...just plug 'em in and play! You'll enjoy those DXT's once you get them dialed in where you like them.




    String Jammer
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    Cactus Music
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/19 23:18:11 (permalink)
    Well your not actually hearing the DXT as I said I just used Session drummer, It was a matter of finding good sfx sounds in a hurry and not to happy so far, Next week when I get a chance I will figure out how to use the DTX sounds and re post the song.  

    The other issue I had was velocity was different than the sound you get from the kit. I played listening to the brain on the headphones with Sonar input to the aux in. 
    The problem is Session drummers sounds will react differently to velocity than the DTX sounds, So you don't get the same dynamics. I have never figured out how to globally edit the velocity I tried CAL but it gave mixed results. So was not happy with how the midi track turned out in that way.   
    Your right about the stiff sound of the drums I believe it's a result of quantasizing to 16th notes. Got to come up with a better system on that too. When you paly drums on the keyboard that's about the fastest I could go, so for years I've used 16th or 16th triplet. But these new digital kits are very accurate with subtle rolls and fills. That got flushed with the quatasizing. The best sound would be from the audio output but that would then be only a stereo track ( with this model) and my timing is a little off which I cannot stand.  
    I could always record one part at a time and use audio snap but then your back to square one and the results will sound unnatural. 
    The real solution is to get better at kit playing which I will hope is still possible at 60 for me. I don't really like having to "cheat". I had a real kit for years but never played it because of angry looks from dog and wife... this is a new age of quiet drumming and I can practice a lot more now.  
      
    The hiss seems to be an artifact created in uploading, It's not in my original MP3. Go figure? I have a funky internet using G3 cell network so uploading is dicey. It often stalls. 
    The song is a work in progress will be replacing one guitar solo with banjo. Just gave my friend the file to work on. 

    Thanks a bunch for input everyone 



    post edited by Cactus Music - 2013/01/19 23:36:03

    Johnny V  
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    jamesg1213
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/20 05:14:58 (permalink)
    That was very enjoyable John. Don't know the original, but this sounds really nice. Love your vocals and guitar playing.

     
    Jyemz
     
     
     



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    Scottytunes
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/20 07:30:08 (permalink)
    This thread is confusing. 

    "First song with new digital drums....The drums are Yamaha DXT 400K....I didn' use the kit...." 

    How do you spell schizophrenia?

    String Jammer
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    jamesg1213
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/20 07:47:21 (permalink)
    I took it to mean he's playing the e-drums, but the sounds are from Session Drummer and TTS-1.

     
    Jyemz
     
     
     



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    Cactus Music
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/20 16:22:21 (permalink)
    Yes I thought that was very clear. I don't think very many people use the sounds from the brain ( somehow that sounds funny)  when using digital drums. The difference is a matter of using a real drum like interface to input the data as opposed to using loops or a midi keyboard. 

    You actually need to PLAY the drums.

     So this song was my first song attempt using a set of digital drums -- as an input device.    
    Using the sounds from the drums involves either playing perfectly ( not me yet! ) or re recording the midi data sent back to the brain and audio recorded from brain - which I will do later this week and re post. 

    post edited by Cactus Music - 2013/01/21 11:51:50

    Johnny V  
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    Scottytunes
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/20 19:51:56 (permalink)
    Aha! Now it's making sense.

    String Jammer
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    THE NIGHT FOX
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/24 13:32:30 (permalink)

    Hi John , I'll be buying the DTX400K next week myself . I plan on pluggin my DTX400K set into my addictive drum software to trigger the drums sounds from that software .
    I also have the Steven Slate drum software too so I might test that software out as well to see how it works out with this kit your using .

    Have a question about this kit , how do you like the kick pedal that is included with this kit ? Its suppose to be very quite when playing in apartments and I live in a apartment , noise from a kick pad is a big factor for me .

    Anyway after I order this kit next week and get it all setup I will do some recording and post it so you can hear what it sounds like after I plugin to my addictive drum software .

    Happy Drumming Cheers -James
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    darylcrowley
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    Re:Rider-First song with new digital Drums 2013/01/25 22:52:34 (permalink)
    This takes me back to early country rock days a long long time ago.

    This is quite period correct.  Nice job.

    Daryl

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