[SOLVED] Groove Clip Looping Problem

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JCody
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2017/09/22 17:28:26 (permalink)

[SOLVED] Groove Clip Looping Problem

I used to be able to select a part of an audio track and apply groove clip looping and it would maintain it's tempo. Now it either stretches or shrinks it and therefore makes it unusable. I'm pretty sure that it's a user error. Can someone point me in the right direction to get it to return to it's old behavior?
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    Zargg
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/22 17:36:49 (permalink)
    Hi. Do you "bounce to clip" before turning into a groove clip?
    All the best.

    Ken Nilsen
    Zargg
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    #2
    JCody
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/22 17:39:08 (permalink)
    I used to just split it where I wanted it to loop from, right click, and apply groove clip looping.
    #3
    Zargg
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/22 17:41:25 (permalink)
    Is this a self recorded clip, or an imported one?

    Ken Nilsen
    Zargg
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    #4
    JCody
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/22 17:42:07 (permalink)
    Usually imported
     
    #5
    JCody
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/22 17:43:41 (permalink)
    I think it's trying to change the tempo to match the template that I've imported it into.
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    Zargg
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/22 17:44:29 (permalink)
    Then I suppose there are some kind of time stamp to them, which needs to be removed before a new groove clip will be created correctly.
    I could be wrong, though.

    Ken Nilsen
    Zargg
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    #7
    JCody
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/22 17:50:38 (permalink)
    I messed with the settings somewhere awhile back experimenting with something and I think I messed something up.
    #8
    JCody
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/22 18:00:42 (permalink)
    I'll give it a try
    #9
    scook
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/22 18:17:14 (permalink)
    if clip length changes SONAR guessed the number of beats wrong. Correct it in the Loop Construction View.
    #10
    JCody
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/22 18:21:56 (permalink)
    I've tried that, but most of the things are greyed out and anything I try seems to not fix things. I've lately just worked around things by manually cutting and pasting the same piece of the clip. Not nearly as nice as it use to be for me.
    #11
    Anderton
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/22 22:07:12 (permalink)
    Are you importing WAV or REX files? They appear similarly but the rules for handling them are different.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #12
    JCody
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/22 23:26:25 (permalink)
    .WAV files
    #13
    Anderton
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/23 15:52:42 (permalink)
    I'd need a recipe to reproduce to help any further, looping works fine here and has for the past 17 years. If it happens to all your audio, it should be reproducible. If it only happens with some audio, then we need to find out what's wonky about the audio.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #14
    JCody
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/24 03:26:44 (permalink)
    OK, what I do is take any audio track and drag it into SPLAT. Lets say I need to add additional vamps to the song. I place the cursor at the beginning the vamp. Split the track at that point, and split it again at the end of the vamp. I now have three selectable clips. I move the last clip out of the way, select the vamp and right click and pick "groove pick looping." I'm then given a dialog box that informs me that things outside of that selected clip will be discarded. I click OK. I then see that the clip has either stretched or shrunk. I can then drag it out and get the extra vamps, but they are no longer at the same tempo as the remaining clips. It seems to me that groove clip looping always wants to match the tempo of the template I'm using, not the tempo of the songs I've imported. I've tried importing lots of different audio tracks from different sources and get the same results. Maybe its my template? I'll try a different template to see.
    #15
    Anderton
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/24 05:27:47 (permalink)
    JCody
    It seems to me that groove clip looping always wants to match the tempo of the template I'm using, not the tempo of the songs I've imported. 



    The Groove Clip will always respect the tempo in the Control Bar Transport.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #16
    JCody
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/24 05:39:10 (permalink)
    It didn't use to work that way for me. So I guess that my workflow would have to include detecting the tempo of the audio I import? What if the song has varying tempos? I wish it were simpler. Anyway, thanks Craig for your helping with this. If you find a setting that changes this behavior, that would be awesome.
    #17
    Anderton
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/24 16:11:42 (permalink)
    JCody
    It didn't use to work that way for me.

     
    It was almost certainly coincidence due to SONAR's tempo matching that of the audio being imported. I've been using SONAR to create loops for 17 years, and the loops always follow SONAR's tempo.
     
    So I guess that my workflow would have to include detecting the tempo of the audio I import? What if the song has varying tempos? I wish it were simpler. Anyway, thanks Craig for your helping with this.

     
    There are several ways to detect tempo. I wrote an "old school" but reliable way to do this with X3, but the principles are the same. 
     
    AudioSnap is another way to determine tempo from a clip, but you'll need audio with fairly defined transients.
     
    The most space-age and wonderful way to do this, which also takes into account varying tempos, is the tempo detection feature that was added in the 2016.03 update. Its ability to create a tempo map from existing audio is almost magical.
     

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #18
    JCody
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/25 19:27:38 (permalink)
    Thanks Craig,
     It must've been a crazy coincidence. I tried the tempo mapping ARA melodyne thing. It'll have to do. It for the most part is an amazing feature. It doesn't work all the time as I'm usually editing musical theater music which can be ridiculously complex and subtle in its tempos.
    Ha! now that I remember, I realize that it always worked perfectly when I was working with midi. It all makes sense now.
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    Anderton
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/25 19:32:29 (permalink)
    JCody
    Thanks Craig,
     It must've been a crazy coincidence. I tried the tempo mapping ARA melodyne thing. It'll have to do. It for the most part is an amazing feature. It doesn't work all the time as I'm usually editing musical theater music which can be ridiculously complex and subtle in its tempos.
    Ha! now that I remember, I realize that it always worked perfectly when I was working with midi. It all makes sense now.



    Changing the Melodyne algorithm to Percussion can also make it work better.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #20
    JCody
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    Re: Groove Clip Looping Problem 2017/09/25 19:40:03 (permalink)
    I'll give it a try! Thanks!
    #21
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