theheliosequence
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Sample Rate Conversion Powered by iZotope
We have iZotope's pitch and time stretching algorithm. I think it would be great to also have iZotope's sample rate conversion algorithm.
When importing waves, we'd now have iZotope quality SRC. When exporting tracks, we'd now have the ability to choose a new target sample rate.
I think it would also be great to have the ability to change an entire song's sample rate within a project. Does any DAW currently have this ability? A simple option of 'change projects sample rate' and then select your target sample rate, choose your iZotope SRC settings and then wait for the program to render the clips in the project.
Example 1: You are mastering or doing fades for your final 48kHz - 192kHz mixdowns in Sonar... you now wouldn't have export files, then leave the project and use a high quality external sample rate converter and then reimport the waves into a new Sonar session. You could simply convert the project and then you'd be ready to do your final processing and export for CD or MP3.
Example 2: You're mixing a clients album that was recorded at 44.1kHz, but you prefer to mix at a higher sample rate because your plugins sound better (less digital aliasing) at a higher sample rate... Or your converters sound better at a higher sample rate when running through your external analog summing mixer. You could simply convert the project to a higher sample rate, save and you'd be good to go.
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lfm
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Re: Sample Rate Conversion Powered by iZotope
2015/04/23 02:44:31
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My vote was more for selection of algos - don't know if Izotope is best for every type of material.
Reaper is giving you options to run full project or any track actually - in it's own speed. So resampling is on clip level even in realtime.
Cubase always convert to samplerate of project - any change in project properties on that, and you get a dialog to convert. That at least, is what I would like to see in Sonar - and also choose from a set of algos doing that.
Change like Reaper is total remake, and nothing I desire, though. Just FYI - askin for daw abilities.
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theheliosequence
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Re: Sample Rate Conversion Powered by iZotope
2015/04/23 05:30:12
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That's cool that you can do real time SRC in reaper. It's an impressive program and if I ever stop using Sonar, it will probably be the first program I look at for creative work (also using Pro Tools, but it's not my favorite). Also cool that Cubase allows a complete resample of an entire project. I know that a bunch of guys at Sterling Sound were using the Steinberg Crystal Resampler over iZotope and Weiss Saracon... but not sure if it's included in Cubase. Either way, I would love that flexibility in Sonar. I have heard various SRC do well on certain material and not on others. But generally speaking, I'd say it would be difficult to find a SRC as versatile as iZotope. The fact that you can change the filter slope, frequency and pre-ringing is not something I've ever really seen in another SRC and the new upgraded algorithm in RX4.1 sounds better than ever. I'm now using it over the Weiss Saracon in mastering sessions. or... Cakewalk could license this guy's SRC: http://www.sonicillusions.co.uk/finalcd.htm A lot of mastering engineers think it's the best out there, but most people don't know about it. I personally won't use anything that doesn't render a 32bit floating point wave (this currently only has straight 24/32bit), because there are almost always overs (peaks that would be clipped in a 16/24 bit wave) after SRC on a loud master. I need floating point so I can re-limited the pesky peaks.
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lfm
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Re: Sample Rate Conversion Powered by iZotope
2015/04/23 06:49:05
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I found this place too: http://www.mega-nerd.com/SRC/ There is some one time full license too for companies. Downloaded and thinking if to try and compile this and do conversions before importing to Sonar.
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bitflipper
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Re: Sample Rate Conversion Powered by iZotope
2015/04/23 09:36:38
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I have the greatest respect for the folks at iZotope. They are one group that almost always gets it right, whose quality is impeccable. But If I was voting on this around a conference table in Boston, I'd vote "no".
First, SONAR's SRC is already among the very best in the industry. It's able to do it on the fly with complete transparency. No one would notice any difference, so there's no technical advantage.
Adding third-party components costs money and therefore raises the price of the product. Most important from a marketing perspective is that nobody chooses a DAW based on things like SRC, so there would be no competitive advantage, either.
 All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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mudgel
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Re: Sample Rate Conversion Powered by iZotope
2015/04/24 06:16:03
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bitflipper
I have the greatest respect for the folks at iZotope. They are one group that almost always gets it right, whose quality is impeccable. But If I was voting on this around a conference table in Boston, I'd vote "no".
First, SONAR's SRC is already among the very best in the industry. It's able to do it on the fly with complete transparency. No one would notice any difference, so there's no technical advantage.
Adding third-party components costs money and therefore raises the price of the product. Most important from a marketing perspective is that nobody chooses a DAW based on things like SRC, so there would be no competitive advantage, either.
When we do a Save as different project is the Sample Rate selection available as this would be an incredibly fast way to up or down sample a whole project. I don't remember if it is or not.
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Rob[at]Sound-Rehab
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Re: Sample Rate Conversion Powered by iZotope
2015/04/24 07:20:39
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mudgel
bitflipper
I have the greatest respect for the folks at iZotope. They are one group that almost always gets it right, whose quality is impeccable. But If I was voting on this around a conference table in Boston, I'd vote "no".
First, SONAR's SRC is already among the very best in the industry. It's able to do it on the fly with complete transparency. No one would notice any difference, so there's no technical advantage.
Adding third-party components costs money and therefore raises the price of the product. Most important from a marketing perspective is that nobody chooses a DAW based on things like SRC, so there would be no competitive advantage, either.
When we do a Save as different project is the Sample Rate selection available as this would be an incredibly fast way to up or down sample a whole project. I don't remember if it is or not.
No, it's not ... and I can't remember it ever being there ... but IMHO this would be the place to stick "auto-conversion" i.e. if you need to convert, "Save As" new project with new WAV files. I would not want to have any kind of auto-conversion in the background ... along the lines Cakewalk would have to change the warning that appears when loading a project with different sample rates to a suggestion to save as ...
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theheliosequence
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Re: Sample Rate Conversion Powered by iZotope
2015/04/24 08:12:06
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bitflipper
I have the greatest respect for the folks at iZotope. They are one group that almost always gets it right, whose quality is impeccable. But If I was voting on this around a conference table in Boston, I'd vote "no".
First, SONAR's SRC is already among the very best in the industry. It's able to do it on the fly with complete transparency. No one would notice any difference, so there's no technical advantage.
Adding third-party components costs money and therefore raises the price of the product. Most important from a marketing perspective is that nobody chooses a DAW based on things like SRC, so there would be no competitive advantage, either.
I completely disagree about the quality of Sonar's SRC. It's not that great and far from transparent... in fact no SRC is. Weiss Saracon and iZotope RX4 are two of the best I've heard. I know that Sony Sound Forge licensed the iZotope SRC, so it's not unheard of. If you can't hear the difference between cakewalk's SRC before and after then I guess this is something that doesn't interest you. No worries...
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mettelus
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Re: Sample Rate Conversion Powered by iZotope
2015/04/24 08:12:13
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I agree with Bit's point. SONAR's SRC is already one of the best and one "under the hood" feature many take for granted is if you import audio into a project, the SRC gets done automatically behind the scenes on the import.
What "lacks" is a process function to "Convert Project Sample Rate." A Process with a UI similar to the Export dialog would be great to have where an entire project could be saved, converted, and given a new name automatically. Then could keep audio/video versions of a project "side by side," per se.
Only downside of this is that all audio interfaces do not play well in the sandbox with each other, but if the audio engine disengaged first, it seems such a thing would be feasible. I am curious how others do such "on the fly," though.
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mettelus
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Re: Sample Rate Conversion Powered by iZotope
2015/04/24 08:15:59
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http://src.infinitewave.ca/ Many SRC's are reaching "top notch" capacity... you can compare them via the "Converter" drop down. I use Audition CS5.5 for "wave work."
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theheliosequence
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Re: Sample Rate Conversion Powered by iZotope
2015/04/24 09:22:47
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mettelus
http://src.infinitewave.ca/
Many SRC's are reaching "top notch" capacity... you can compare them via the "Converter" drop down. I use Audition CS5.5 for "wave work."
Yes, a great reference site and cool that they've kept updating it all these years! But which one's are "looking" top notch to you? I only see a few. Best performer seems to be the free FinalCD program I mentioned above. I would be more than happy to be able to use that when importing files into Sonar. I've done the A/B tests. Not using Sonar's current SRC on any of my files... but I'm not knocking anyone else if they do! Anywho, even though I disagree with some of the comments, I appreciate the feedback and discussion. I've been using Cakewalk since Home 3.0 back in the 90's. I'm all for it to improve like everyone else. We all just have different things we want to get out of it. I personally would love to be able to do an SRC on an entire project... but wouldn't use the feature with the current SRC included in Sonar.
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theheliosequence
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Re: Sample Rate Conversion Powered by iZotope
2015/04/24 09:27:37
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mettelus
I agree with Bit's point. SONAR's SRC is already one of the best and one "under the hood" feature many take for granted is if you import audio into a project, the SRC gets done automatically behind the scenes on the import.
What "lacks" is a process function to "Convert Project Sample Rate." A Process with a UI similar to the Export dialog would be great to have where an entire project could be saved, converted, and given a new name automatically. Then could keep audio/video versions of a project "side by side," per se.
Only downside of this is that all audio interfaces do not play well in the sandbox with each other, but if the audio engine disengaged first, it seems such a thing would be feasible. I am curious how others do such "on the fly," though.
I imagine the work around for doing the SRC on a project would be a 'save as' sort of function with the processing done offline. Once it's complete, you'd just open up the session like any other. That would work, wouldn't it?
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mettelus
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Re: Sample Rate Conversion Powered by iZotope
2015/04/24 10:25:22
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I have never really tried this, as it has always been more painful than I would like. I have always just finished at the sample rate I was working and then converted the master track for use. For the site linked above (I have not looked at it in a while), the Sweep test is a good indicator of things... the background should be as black as possible with a single exponential line. If that holds true, the other tests tend to be similarly on the ball. Can run through them with the < and > keys. I was actually surprised to see Ableton Live 9.11 is suddenly "up there" now too - big jump from 9.03. Edit: Adobe's CS6 Media Encoder is terrible! I was just tabbing through them and happened to catch that. I think that is linked to hand shake with Premiere Pro (video), but not sure exactly what it's purpose is. Also of note to anyone reading this thread... some of the good ones are free.
post edited by mettelus - 2015/04/24 15:20:50
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Rob[at]Sound-Rehab
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Re: Sample Rate Conversion Powered by iZotope
2015/04/24 13:51:41
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theheliosequence
I imagine the work around for doing the SRC on a project would be a 'save as' sort of function with the processing done offline. Once it's complete, you'd just open up the session like any other. That would work, wouldn't it?
Well, that's what I was trying to say in my earlier post ;-)
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