Scientists...meh

I don't believe in Santa Clause--the Easter Bunny told me not to.  
 
 

Jonbouy to my mind what is claiming everything suddenly appeared out of nowhere if not exactly the same thing?
 

<Pedantic>
No one claims everything suddenly appeared out of nowhere (well, not really nowhere, but...). It is not known what happened before the Big Bang because there is currently no evidence from beforehand available to us.
</pedantic>

 

Jonbouy
Lots of talk today about being able to trace matter back to the 'Big Bang' which gave birth to the Universe.
 
And they have the cheek to laugh at 'ridiculous' creationists yet to my mind what is claiming everything suddenly appeared out of nowhere if not exactly the same thing?
 

Unfortunately the discipline of science leads to some conclusions that do not fit our prejudices. I, for one am so used to time that it seems not to make any sense that it has not existed infinitely into the past of my universe. But I have no doubt that there is good evidence to support a model that forces the conclusion that it has not.
 
http://www.hawking.org.uk/the-beginning-of-time.html
 
As for not really knowing anything...well clearly that is the case.
 

Figment I may be...but I still trouble you in your dreams. Bawahaaaaaaaa!

Physics has just now come to describe with complex equations and all it's mechanism the exact same 'is ness' arising from the 'is notness' that so-called seers of centuries past have been flagging up.
 
I'm not talking about the perils of being locked in by the constructs of particular doctrines that have come and gone over the millenia, I'm talking about the simple ability to see how stuff really works and appreciate how amazing the whole shooting match is.
 
Nobody needs a degree in astrophysics to see that a simple snowflake just rocks completely out loud.

At some level the science just boils down to equations that are consistent with observed phenomena … and unfortunately, I was never very good at math.

bitflipper
Big bang theory rocks! One of my favorite TV shows.

Mine too!  My wife complains because I watch reruns all the time and laugh at them!

i'm so proud of one of my oldest friends, who co-led the team... we called him mr spock at school, always knew he had it in him :-))) amazing, words genuinely fail me, nobel etc blimey

Gravitational waves left over from the big bang may have caused the clumps of matter in our universe to clump the way they did. 
 
It is not just the big bang we research but the resulting shape of the universe trillionth of seconds after the bang that really shaped what we see/learn about today.  It is all so fascinating!

Jonbouy
 
Lots of talk today about being able to trace matter back to the 'Big Bang' which gave birth to the Universe.
 
No talk of the obviously very naughty boy that let that one off, nor even perhaps of an even bigger boy that made him do it.
 
And they have the cheek to laugh at 'ridiculous' creationists yet to my mind what is claiming everything suddenly appeared out of nowhere if not exactly the same thing?
 

I'd argue that the crucial difference is that the creationists believe there was a 'creator'.
 
And instead of conducting observations and gathering data, and then advancing hypotheses that best fit this research, creationists are already certain that they know who (or what) did the creating. Some of them, I'm led to believe, even know exactly when this happened.
 
Scientific ideas and theories are usually never more than the current "best fit" explanation of a phenomenon or occurrence. No true scientist would ever say that any particular hypothesis is correct (particularly his own), or that they 'know' that something is or isn't true (aside, of course, from pure mathematics and some forms of logic) .
 

Jonbouy
 
It just goes to show that none of us 'know' jack really.
 

 
There’s a lot we don’t know for sure, but that shouldn't stop of from trying to learn more about the universe we inhabit.
 
 

Jonbouy
 
Nobody needs a degree in astrophysics to see that a simple snowflake just rocks completely out loud.

 
I agree.
 
But that shouldn't stop those of us who haven't from trying to found out how they are formed.
 
 
Incidentally JB, did you happen to watch this fascinating episode of Horizon a week or so back - What happened before the Big Bang?
 
Sadly, it's no longer on the iPlayer if you didn't, but some fine chap has uploaded it on Facebook:

• Part 1
• Part 2
• Part 3

SteveStrummerUK
I'd argue that the crucial difference is that the creationists believe there was a 'creator'.
 

 
There are two different methodologies by which people arrive at their conclusions regarding such things - Faith and evidence. Obviously different people will often assign very different weights to the value of each. 
 

And instead of conducting observations and gathering data, and then advancing hypotheses that best fit this research...
 
Scientific ideas and theories are usually never more than the current "best fit" explanation of a phenomenon or occurrence. No true scientist would ever say that any particular hypothesis is correct (particularly his own), or that they 'know' that something is or isn't true (aside, of course, from pure mathematics and some forms of logic) .

Be careful - often a theory will predict certain things that have never been observed until they are subsequently tested and confirmed. This makes for much more powerful evidence than just coming up with something that seems to sort of fit previous observations.
 
Well established theories that are strongly supported by a preponderance of carefully gathered and confirmed evidence are regarded as both "settled science" and "fact".
 
I think saying things like "best fit" is misleading for anything but the frontiers of theoretical science. Most refinements made to settled science will only apply around the edges and/or under unusual or extreme conditions.

I wish someone would tell my daughter that ... She's just about to graduate (Physics Major) and got accepted into two grad schools to continue with this foolishness ....  
 
Well, at least I finally understand the Blackhole theory ... The cost of educating a Physicist .... (Hmmm... Big Bang Theory as well)