Kylotan
Max Output Level: -71 dBFS
- Total Posts : 995
- Joined: 2007/09/10 17:27:35
- Location: Nottingham, UK
- Status: offline
Several questions about X2 capabilities
I am a Sonar 8.5 Producer user and I'm considering between 2 options - upgrading to X2, or starting to use the Reaper DAW instead. 8.5 has several bugs and omissions that have led me to consider switching, but I'm out of touch with what X2 offers, hence this post. So, my specific questions are: - Does X2 support the ability to split a clip (and all grouped clips) and automatically crossfade at the split? (Ideally with a configurable crossfade length.)
- Does X2 support the ability to move audio within a clip (and all grouped clips), without moving the clip?
(In 8.5 I would have to slip edit the start, then the end by the same amount, and then move the clip back to its original position) EDIT: Turns out that this is possible in 8.5 with Shift-Alt- Drag. - Is it possible in X2 to apply FX to track folders, or to have a fader on them, or do I still have to use a bus for that?
- Can X2 take one incoming MIDI CC message (eg. CC7) and either record it or play it back as 2 CCs (eg. CC7 and CC11)? I'd use this with synths that have separate volume and expression controls, to be operated with one expression wheel in real time.
- In your opinion, have there been any improvements to the audio engine since 8.5? I often get dropouts and glitches despite having a PCI sound card, ASIO drivers, and a quad-core processor, and it appears to affect the timing of tracking subtly as well.
- Is it any more stable than in 8.5? I get a some crashes when saving, when adding track templates, crashes almost every time when exiting the app, etc.
- Has the Matrix View or the Step Sequencer seen any improvements during X1 and X2? I'd like to use these more often, but they always felt half-finished.
post edited by Kylotan - 2013/09/20 12:55:02
Sonar Platinum (Newburyport) / Win 8.1 64bit / Focusrite Scarlett 6i6 / Absynth / Kontakt / Play / Superior Drummer 2 / ESP LTD guitar / etc Twilight's Embrace - gothic/death metal | Other works - instrumental/soundtracks
|
John
Forum Host
- Total Posts : 30467
- Joined: 2003/11/06 11:53:17
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/20 12:02:52
(permalink)
1 yes 2 not sure what is being asked 3 with FX chains in the PC there are a lot of things that can be don with them. 4 Sonar can record any CC. You can change a cc to another or add a cc. 5 Yes 6 its stable 7 yes and yes improvments have been made.
|
Kylotan
Max Output Level: -71 dBFS
- Total Posts : 995
- Joined: 2007/09/10 17:27:35
- Location: Nottingham, UK
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/20 12:15:22
(permalink)
John, some followups: 2) imagine I have an audio clip from 2:01:000 to 3:01:000, one bar long. There's a snare hit at 2:03:90 in there. I want to be able to drag the audio within the clip so that the snare hit is now at 2:03:000, but the start and end of the clip are unchanged at 2:01:000 to 3:01:000. This is available on Pro Tools and Reaper. 3) I don't know what you mean by 'the PC', but I'm specifically asking about track folders or an equivalent. 4) I know Sonar can record any CC - I need to know if it can record 1 CC and treat it as if it was 2, either by duplicating on record, or routing it in 2 directions during playback (and ideally monitoring) 6) Did you notice an improvement relative to 8.5? If you found it stable in both 8.5 and in X2, that's unlikely to help me. Thanks for the other answers. Question 4 reminds me of a related issue - does X2 allow you to route 1 MIDI note to 2 or more outputs yet? eg. via a drum map? On 8.5 it only allows each note to be mapped to one place.
Sonar Platinum (Newburyport) / Win 8.1 64bit / Focusrite Scarlett 6i6 / Absynth / Kontakt / Play / Superior Drummer 2 / ESP LTD guitar / etc Twilight's Embrace - gothic/death metal | Other works - instrumental/soundtracks
|
stevec
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 11546
- Joined: 2003/11/04 15:05:54
- Location: Parkesburg, PA
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/20 12:22:23
(permalink)
There is a way to drag a waveform within the clip boundaries, but I can't recall exactly what it is. I think it might even be in 8.5 as well. Might be worth a search in the help. For track folders, no, they are for organization purposes and don't act as a bus (though that would be nice). I haven't used 8.5 since shortly after X1, but for me X2 feels a bit smoother than either one. I'm pretty sure there were some audio engine enhancements outlined in both X1 and X2. One example would inserting VST/i's while a project is playing back which I don't think 8.5 can do at all? Edit: At least I think you can still do the waveform drag... haven't found anything on it yet myself, though I doubt it's a highly used feature
post edited by stevec - 2013/09/20 12:30:01
SteveC https://soundcloud.com/steve-cocchi http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=39163 SONAR Platinum x64, Intel Q9300 (2.5Ghz), Asus P5N-D, Win7 x64 SP1, 8GB RAM, 1TB internal + ESATA + USB Backup HDDs, ATI Radeon HD5450 1GB RAM + dual ViewSonic VA2431wm Monitors; Focusrite 18i6 (ASIO); Komplete 9, Melodyne Studio 4, Ozone 7 Advanced, Rapture Pro, GPO5, Valhalla Plate, MJUC comp, MDynamic EQ, lots of other freebie VST plugins, synths and Kontakt libraries
|
scook
Forum Host
- Total Posts : 24146
- Joined: 2005/07/27 13:43:57
- Location: TX
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/20 12:42:36
(permalink)
2) ALT+SHIFT+drag moves data within a clip
|
Kylotan
Max Output Level: -71 dBFS
- Total Posts : 995
- Joined: 2007/09/10 17:27:35
- Location: Nottingham, UK
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/20 12:50:03
(permalink)
scook 2) ALT+SHIFT+drag moves data within a clip
And it works on 8.5 too! Funny how I never discovered that before. Doesn't seem to be in the help file.
Sonar Platinum (Newburyport) / Win 8.1 64bit / Focusrite Scarlett 6i6 / Absynth / Kontakt / Play / Superior Drummer 2 / ESP LTD guitar / etc Twilight's Embrace - gothic/death metal | Other works - instrumental/soundtracks
|
scook
Forum Host
- Total Posts : 24146
- Joined: 2005/07/27 13:43:57
- Location: TX
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/20 12:52:13
(permalink)
Maybe mentioned in Scott's book. You may want to try the X2 demo. The X3 demo probably won't be out for a while.
|
stevec
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 11546
- Joined: 2003/11/04 15:05:54
- Location: Parkesburg, PA
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/20 13:30:07
(permalink)
scook 2) ALT+SHIFT+drag moves data within a clip
Thanks!! At least I know I wasn't imagining things! Well, at least this time.
SteveC https://soundcloud.com/steve-cocchi http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=39163 SONAR Platinum x64, Intel Q9300 (2.5Ghz), Asus P5N-D, Win7 x64 SP1, 8GB RAM, 1TB internal + ESATA + USB Backup HDDs, ATI Radeon HD5450 1GB RAM + dual ViewSonic VA2431wm Monitors; Focusrite 18i6 (ASIO); Komplete 9, Melodyne Studio 4, Ozone 7 Advanced, Rapture Pro, GPO5, Valhalla Plate, MJUC comp, MDynamic EQ, lots of other freebie VST plugins, synths and Kontakt libraries
|
thebiglongy
Max Output Level: -80 dBFS
- Total Posts : 502
- Joined: 2006/01/29 19:20:31
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/20 14:12:27
(permalink)
scook Maybe mentioned in Scott's book. You may want to try the X2 demo. The X3 demo probably won't be out for a while.
This ^^ Why not try the demo out and see for yourself :) Only you will know if it works for you.
Sonar x2a Win 7 x64 // i7 930 @ stock speed // Gigabyte x58a-ud3r (rev 1) // 6gb corsair 1600mhz triple channel // ATI HD5450 Samsung EVO 128gb SSD // 2 x WD Black 1tb. M-Audio Fast Track Ultra 8R
|
Kylotan
Max Output Level: -71 dBFS
- Total Posts : 995
- Joined: 2007/09/10 17:27:35
- Location: Nottingham, UK
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/20 14:17:22
(permalink)
It can take months to truly get to grips with a product and learn everything about it - evident by the fact that I didn't know that one of the features I want is already in 8.5, which I've used for years! So it's much more efficient if people who already have that experience can give me simple answers to my questions.
Sonar Platinum (Newburyport) / Win 8.1 64bit / Focusrite Scarlett 6i6 / Absynth / Kontakt / Play / Superior Drummer 2 / ESP LTD guitar / etc Twilight's Embrace - gothic/death metal | Other works - instrumental/soundtracks
|
stevec
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 11546
- Joined: 2003/11/04 15:05:54
- Location: Parkesburg, PA
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/20 14:35:07
(permalink)
One thing the demo will give you however, that no one here can, is a feel for the UI changes in the X series. Specific features aside, how you get there can make a big difference. I personally like SONAR X* and even more so where I see it heading, since I found X2 to be a more evolved version of X1. And I expect X3 to be the same. But only you can make that decision.
SteveC https://soundcloud.com/steve-cocchi http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=39163 SONAR Platinum x64, Intel Q9300 (2.5Ghz), Asus P5N-D, Win7 x64 SP1, 8GB RAM, 1TB internal + ESATA + USB Backup HDDs, ATI Radeon HD5450 1GB RAM + dual ViewSonic VA2431wm Monitors; Focusrite 18i6 (ASIO); Komplete 9, Melodyne Studio 4, Ozone 7 Advanced, Rapture Pro, GPO5, Valhalla Plate, MJUC comp, MDynamic EQ, lots of other freebie VST plugins, synths and Kontakt libraries
|
Kylotan
Max Output Level: -71 dBFS
- Total Posts : 995
- Joined: 2007/09/10 17:27:35
- Location: Nottingham, UK
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/20 16:21:09
(permalink)
So the answers are, so far: - Yes (although nobody's mentioned how, yet)
- Yes.
- Probably not.
- Maybe.
- Maybe.
- Yes (although I've no details on this yet).
Anyone able to elaborate?
Sonar Platinum (Newburyport) / Win 8.1 64bit / Focusrite Scarlett 6i6 / Absynth / Kontakt / Play / Superior Drummer 2 / ESP LTD guitar / etc Twilight's Embrace - gothic/death metal | Other works - instrumental/soundtracks
|
daveny5
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 16934
- Joined: 2003/11/06 09:54:36
- Location: North Carolina
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/20 21:57:12
(permalink)
Stability is hard to predict...too many dependencies. Depends on your computer, memory, operating system, video card, sound card, antivirus, etc. I've deleted most of the freebie VSTs I had downloaded and that helped. I believe if you manage your computer well, its very stable, but if your computer is like the wild west, you'll likely have problems.
Dave Computer: Intel i7, ASROCK H170M, 16GB/5TB+, Windows 10 Pro 64-bit, Sonar Platinum, TASCAM US-16x08, Cakewalk UM-3G MIDI I/F Instruments: SL-880 Keyboard controller, Korg 05R/W, Korg N1R, KORG Wavestation EX Axes: Fender Stratocaster, Line6 Variax 300, Ovation Acoustic, Takamine Nylon Acoustic, Behringer GX212 amp, Shure SM-58 mic, Rode NT1 condenser mic. Outboard: Mackie 1402-VLZ mixer, TC Helicon VoiceLive 2, Digitech Vocalist WS EX, PODXTLive, various stompboxes and stuff. Controllers: Korg nanoKONTROL, Wacom Bamboo Touchpad
|
Grem
Max Output Level: -19.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 5562
- Joined: 2005/06/28 09:26:32
- Location: Baton Rouge Area
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/21 01:42:36
(permalink)
In X2a when I Alt+Shift+Drag my cursor turns into scissors and cuts the clip the length I drag. Not moving the audio.
Grem Michael Music PC i7 2600K; 64gb Ram; 3 256gb SSD, System, Samples, Audio; 1TB & 2TB Project Storage; 2TB system BkUp; RME FireFace 400; Win 10 Pro 64; CWbBL 64, Home PCAMD FX 6300; 8gb Ram; 256 SSD sys; 2TB audio/samples; Realtek WASAPI; Win 10 Home 64; CWbBL 64 Surface Pro 3Win 10 i7 8gb RAM; CWbBL 64
|
Grem
Max Output Level: -19.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 5562
- Joined: 2005/06/28 09:26:32
- Location: Baton Rouge Area
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/21 01:43:45
(permalink)
Double post.
post edited by Grem - 2013/09/21 10:56:34
Grem Michael Music PC i7 2600K; 64gb Ram; 3 256gb SSD, System, Samples, Audio; 1TB & 2TB Project Storage; 2TB system BkUp; RME FireFace 400; Win 10 Pro 64; CWbBL 64, Home PCAMD FX 6300; 8gb Ram; 256 SSD sys; 2TB audio/samples; Realtek WASAPI; Win 10 Home 64; CWbBL 64 Surface Pro 3Win 10 i7 8gb RAM; CWbBL 64
|
scook
Forum Host
- Total Posts : 24146
- Joined: 2005/07/27 13:43:57
- Location: TX
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/21 09:37:46
(permalink)
☄ Helpfulby Grem 2013/09/21 10:57:17
Grem In X2a when I Alt+Shift+Drag my cursor turns into scissors and cuts the clip the length I drag. Not moving the audio.
It only works on plain wave files, not loops. What you are describing happens to groove clips and imported rx2 files.
|
Kalle Rantaaho
Max Output Level: -5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 7005
- Joined: 2006/01/09 13:07:59
- Location: Finland
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/21 11:22:34
(permalink)
daveny5 Stability is hard to predict...too many dependencies. Depends on your computer, memory, operating system, video card, sound card, antivirus, etc. I've deleted most of the freebie VSTs I had downloaded and that helped. I believe if you manage your computer well, its very stable, but if your computer is like the wild west, you'll likely have problems.
And as the flaws the OP describes are IMO not SONAR 8.5 bugs (crashing by exiting/opening templates etc) per se, and I think it's been more like a concensus that 8.5 has been the most solid SONAR version for years (ever?) I wouldn't bet a penny for increased stability with 8.5 vs. X2 (in the same machine), even though the X-line has been fairly well ironed already, according to what I've read here.
SONAR PE 8.5.3, Asus P5B, 2,4 Ghz Dual Core, 4 Gb RAM, GF 7300, EMU 1820, Bluetube Pre - Kontakt4, Ozone, Addictive Drums, PSP Mixpack2, Melda Creative Pack, Melodyne Plugin etc. The benefit of being a middle aged amateur is the low number of years of frustration ahead of you.
|
Kylotan
Max Output Level: -71 dBFS
- Total Posts : 995
- Joined: 2007/09/10 17:27:35
- Location: Nottingham, UK
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/21 14:59:42
(permalink)
daveny5 Stability is hard to predict...too many dependencies. Depends on your computer, memory, operating system, video card, sound card, antivirus, etc. I've deleted most of the freebie VSTs I had downloaded and that helped. I believe if you manage your computer well, its very stable, but if your computer is like the wild west, you'll likely have problems.
All those things will be the same if I upgrade, so I assume stability will not improve! It's certainly possible that external plugins can cause crashes, but it is also possible to prevent plugins from crashing the host app, which Sonar doesn't do a good job of. Obviously people can blame things on the system, but of all the software I use, music or otherwise, Sonar is by far the least reliable. I've just put up with it because it has the features I need and is cheaper than Cubase.
Sonar Platinum (Newburyport) / Win 8.1 64bit / Focusrite Scarlett 6i6 / Absynth / Kontakt / Play / Superior Drummer 2 / ESP LTD guitar / etc Twilight's Embrace - gothic/death metal | Other works - instrumental/soundtracks
|
dubdisciple
Max Output Level: -17 dBFS
- Total Posts : 5849
- Joined: 2008/01/29 00:31:46
- Location: Seattle, Wa
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/21 17:15:24
(permalink)
From the looks of some of the answers you have recived, it sounds like there are a number of things you still have not discovered in 8.5 (this is normal for any program). I discover all the time there are many features i have not discovered because either a) it is not pushed heavily as a feature by the manufacturer or b) the exact process is hard to describe to even ask the question of another.
|
Kylotan
Max Output Level: -71 dBFS
- Total Posts : 995
- Joined: 2007/09/10 17:27:35
- Location: Nottingham, UK
- Status: offline
Re: Several questions about X2 capabilities
2013/09/21 17:51:49
(permalink)
The only one of the questions I asked that already applies to 8.5 is the ability to move audio within a clip, as far as I can tell? It's sadly not useful to me on its own as I need the cut with crossfades ability as well, and I don't think that is possible.
Sonar Platinum (Newburyport) / Win 8.1 64bit / Focusrite Scarlett 6i6 / Absynth / Kontakt / Play / Superior Drummer 2 / ESP LTD guitar / etc Twilight's Embrace - gothic/death metal | Other works - instrumental/soundtracks
|