Silent Buses Bug

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Matt
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2011/08/31 14:25:20 (permalink)

Silent Buses Bug

I've read a bunch of threads about this... not sure that any of them are relevant to me.
 
So I have a file, which (of course) is very important to me.  So important, in fact, that I've saved many versions of it.
 
Out of the blue, with me having made no changes to hardware/software, etc, when I open the file I get a message 'Silent Buses Detected':
 

 
So I look and sure enough, all of the softsynths are routed to nothing instead of to their usual audio track, so I try to reroute them to an audio track but I can't get MIDI to the softsynth.  I know the synth is set up correctly, i.e. the proper MIDI is going to the proper place and the proper audio is routed to the proper place... but I can't get any MIDI to the plugins.
 
So I remove the plugin (Omnisphere for example), and re-insert it.  It plays fine now.  With all the MIDI and audio routed just as above.  So I remove all the plugins and reinsert all of them, and they all play fine.
 
But when I save and close the file... next time I open the file I get the same exact message.  I go back and open up my various backup versions, they all have the same message.
 
So...  I re-open the original file, I remove ALL the softsynths.  I save the file to another location, another drive.  Seems ok, I can open and close the file with no plugins.  So I insert just one plugin (doesn't matter which one, I tried this with all of them).  Plugin saves fine, but when I re-open the file same silent bus message.
 
I check other files.... like 10 completely at random, all with many of the same plugins.  No problems there, it's something specific to this file.
 
I don't use buses at all, I never touch them.  I just found where they are and I only have two setup: 'Master' and 'Metronome'.
 
What's going on here?  I've never seen this message before in 15 years of cakewalk/sonar.
 
Thanks in advance,
 
Matt Koskenmaki
#1

9 Replies Related Threads

    Beagle
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    Re:Silent Buses Bug 2011/08/31 17:13:26 (permalink)
    I have this happen to me on one project and I cannot for the life of me figure out why it does that.

    however, you SHOULD be using the master bus.  if you don't send your tracks thru a master bus before sending them to the soundcard then you're summing at the soundcard instead of inside sonar.  if you sum at the soundcard you can't tell what your peaks are hitting and you can easily be summing at over 0dB.  0dB for digital is a hard clip, not like analog summing and it causes digital distortion.

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
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    #2
    Matt
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    Re:Silent Buses Bug 2011/08/31 17:37:01 (permalink)
    If I understand what you're saying, my sound card isn't summing anything because I have external digital mixers, so the sound card just passes the audio along.
     
    Still no luck with this error message.  Hopefully someone can help me figure this out.... I know I just posted it a few hours ago but I've been fighting it for some time now, getting frustrating.
     
    Thanks!
    #3
    Beagle
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    Re:Silent Buses Bug 2011/08/31 17:55:37 (permalink)
    ok - so you're running ADAT to the digital board?  that would be OK then.  99% of users don't do something like that, thus my suggestion of never going directly to the soundcard.

    does this happen on ALL projects now when it wasn't happening before?  did you update your MOTU drivers lately?

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    #4
    Matt
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    Re:Silent Buses Bug 2011/08/31 18:20:33 (permalink)
    Yeah I actually have 48 channels of ADAT running out of 3 2408s which combine with 48 channels of ADAT from external sample computers along with my analog synths at the boards.  Then I have 2 channels of SPDIF come back into SONAR via the 2408 which I guess you would call my master bus.

    It doesn't happen on ANY projects except this one.  I know I can copy and paste but it is going to take a loooong time on this track to get all the settings right.  I had just painstakingly set all of the key offsets for every single track and there's 300+ tracks.  And no I haven't changed any drivers recently, but thanks for the suggestions.

    Matt
    #5
    Beagle
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    Re:Silent Buses Bug 2011/08/31 21:56:09 (permalink)
    I'm really not sure what's going on there.  if someone else doesn't have a better suggestion I'd say call tech support on this.

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
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    #6
    Matt
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    Re:Silent Buses Bug 2011/08/31 22:32:59 (permalink)
    I seem to be making some progress through trial and error...

    I mentioned I was setting the key offset for every track in my template.... that's not something I usually do.  There seems to be some bug (at least in 8.3) which is only related to Instrument (softsynth) tracks and only when you open the Track Properties dialog box.

    I haven't figured out what causes it (doesn't happen every time) but sometimes when you open the Track Properties box it causes the synth to 'disconnect' in some way where it doesn't respond to MIDI input or output audio (even from within the plugin itself) even after you select inputs and outputs.

    Furthermore occasionally I have been able to fix this by selecting 'split instrument track' and setting the two tracks inputs and outputs individually but sometimes it doesn't work.  For example, let's say you set the Instrument Track output to be ADAT 1 out.  If you then split the track, sometimes you see that on the output there actually isn't anything selected and you can then select 'ADAT 1' to fix it.  But half the time when I split the track, it will still show that the output is ADAT 1 and then there's nothing I can do to fix it.

    At this point I'm just documenting this in case it helps someone searching the forum at a later date.  I hope to still narrow down why I'm having this issue.
    #7
    Beagle
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    Re:Silent Buses Bug 2011/09/01 06:45:19 (permalink)
    I personally never use instrument tracks because they are limited in outputs from synths.  I usually want more than 1 output per synth and you can't do that with instrument tracks.

    that shouldn't cause the problem you're seeing, that might be a bug.  do you have the latest update for 8?  you say 8.3, but I think the latest was 8.3.1 or 8.3.2 I don't remember exactly.

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
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    #8
    miguelito
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    Re:Silent Buses Bug 2011/09/01 10:12:09 (permalink)
    I've had this happen to me. My circumstance was moving from one computer to another. I had created a Cakewalk Bundle and copied it on to the new computer. The project was extremely simple - 3 tracks, and 3 busses (master, metronome, and a reverb).

    After a lot of effort I never could resolve it since it made no sense. I kind of assumed it was in the bundle file and just moved on. Wish I had a solution for you.

    Regards.

    Mike

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    #9
    Matt
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    Re:Silent Buses Bug 2011/09/01 11:41:47 (permalink)
    Yeah I'm on 8.3.1.372.  Never upgraded to 8.5 or X1 just because 8.3 has been so solid for me I never saw the need for change.

    I don't generally use intstrument tracks, like Stylus for example I'll have 8 inputs and outputs.  But for a lot of these plugins one track is fine and I like the convenience.  All my samples run on 5 external computers so I've got plenty of outputs there.

    Anyway the problem seems to be 'fixed' if you can call it that.  The problem was occuring only when opening the Track Properties dialog box on an instrument track.  For lack of any other cause, I'd say it's definitely a bug.  I was opening the dialog box after inserting an instrument track just to change the key offset, but if I just used the controls on the track view I'm fine.

    Seems a pretty unique bug/quirk but I hope this helps someone in the future.
    #10
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