[Solved] Confusion with Concrete Limiter

I have recently begun using the Concrete Limiter.  Previously I used Boost and that behaved as I expected.  That is, when I set an absolute limit to -1dB, I didn't get any "red LEDs" on the meter for the main bus.
 
With the Concrete limiter, I keep getting the overdrive LEDs lighting up on my main bud, even when I have the limiter ceiling set to -4dB.  I am thinking I must be misunderstanding the sequence the effects are applied.  I have the Concrete limiter in the bottom slot on my main bus ProChannel.  I thought that was the last thing the out the door. 
 
I must be missing something basic.  I understand that because of sampling error, the output might be slightly higher than the ceiling, but not 4 dB.  Any idea what I might be doing wrong?

Regarding the sequence of signal flow, the ProChannel is pre-FX bin by default. If you click POST on the channel strip, it moves to post FX bin. Have you got anything in there?

John T
Regarding the sequence of signal flow, the ProChannel is pre-FX bin by default. If you click POST on the channel strip, it moves to post FX bin. Have you got anything in there?

Ahhhh.  I think that's what is wrong.  I didn't know about that Post FX Bin setting.  Yes, I had a stereo widener in the FX bin.  Can you confirm that the processing in both the FX bin and in the ProChannel is top-to-bottom (in at the top, out at the bottom)?  It seems to work that way.
 
After making that change, I have the Concrete Limiter ceiling set at -2dB.  The limiter reads a peak of -2dB and my bus meter reads a peak of -1dB which I think can be accounted for because I am allowing the limiter to automatically set its attack time.  Some transients are probably getting through the limiter, but that's OK.  This setting seems to work as I expected.
 
Thanks.

Yes, signal flow come in the top out through bottom in both FX bin and Pro Channel
http://www.cakewalk.com/D...amp;Req=Mixing.07.html

It does; look at the PC next to the effects bin, with the little switch symbols. That's showing you the two places in the overall flow it can go.
 
In terms of signal flow, there's no difference between tracks and buses, other than buses omit the clip section at the top.

If you would like to have just the Concrete Limiter at the end of your signal chain, you can add an "fx chain" to your Pro Channel and put the stereo widener in there.

I see what you're saying, but we don't have the same problems in a DAW as we would in a setup made out of physical boxes. In the case of Sonar, you can trust that the buses operate at completely reliable unity gain, and if the master bus fader is at 0db, then it won't do anything to change the level being put out by the last item before it.

Sanderxpander
If you would like to have just the Concrete Limiter at the end of your signal chain, you can add an "fx chain" to your Pro Channel and put the stereo widener in there.

Thanks for the tip.  I had looked at the FX chains in ProChannel before, but I guess I thought they were all pre-packaged chains.  I didn't think of adding my own.  So if I am already using the ProChannel, it seems like the best practice would be to never use an FX bin at all, and simply insert the FX stack into the ProChannel exactly where you want it to go.  I can't think of any good reason to use Both ProChannel strips and the FX bin on the same channel or bus.  It seems much more straightforward to have all the effects in the same stack so that there is absolutely no doubt about what is going on.

cparmerlee
So if I am already using the ProChannel, it seems like the best practice would be to never use an FX bin at all, and simply insert the FX stack into the ProChannel exactly where you want it to go.  I can't think of any good reason to use Both ProChannel strips and the FX bin on the same channel or bus.  It seems much more straightforward to have all the effects in the same stack so that there is absolutely no doubt about what is going on.

Increasingly, I find myself doing exactly that. On the mix I'm working on right now, I have about 30 tracks, and only five of the regular effects bins have anything in them.