Swhalen
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[Solved] Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
Hello, I am new with Sonar 8.5 and excited to get started. but I am having major trouble. I have a laptop specifically to run Sonar, and I use a Presonus Firebox as an audio interface. I will be recording myself playing my Martin acoustic/electric with it plugged into a line in on the Firebox. Everything will be fine, but half an hour to an hour after starting, the sound on the guitar (playing through or recorded) will suddenly change drastically. It will become much quieter and will start to sound distorted. Frankly, it sounds like the guitar did when I was mistakenly plugging it into a channel that has a pre-amp on the Firebox. When the guitar goes bad, everything that has already been recorded, including on the same track, remains sounding clean and good. I do not have another guitar on hand to see if it is the instrument, but I can't see what else it could be. The mic and electric guitar I run through the pre-amped inputs seem to have no trouble. Does anybody have any thoughts on what the problem might be or suggestions on troubleshooting? Thanks, Sean
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robert_e_bone
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/11 01:26:10
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If your laptop has a WiFi adapter, these are notorious for causing massive DPC Latency spikes, which can do horrible things to the ability of your computer handling streaming audio processing, like what Sonar does. So, try this: Just before launching a Sonar session, look for a physical switch to turn off the WiFi - or it may be a function key. If neither, than go into Windows Device Manager and temporarily Disable the WiFi adapter (NOT uninstall - just Disable). Then, launch your Sonar session and see if things sound better. When finished with your Sonar session, turn the WiFi adapter back on, or it it was Disabled, go back into Windows Device Manager and Enable it again. That will restore access to the web. If the above does not fix things up for you (it does for lots of folks though, so I am hoping it does for you), you can always download some freeware called LatencyMon and run it for a few minutes while Sonar is NOT running, and it will give you its opinion on your computer's ability to handle the streaming audio needed for applications for Sonar, and will give you an idea of which routines may be causing audio performance issues that you can then try to resolve. I hope the above helps, Bob Bone
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Swhalen
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/11 01:39:47
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Thanks for the suggestion. Is this a latency issue though? There is no delay, just the change in the volume and quality of the sound from the guitar. The laptop was purchased specifically to run Sonar and was built with that in mind. The specs are great, and the wireless adapter is disabled. I do not use the laptop to go on the web. I will try the tool you mention, but am not sure if it will assist, if it is meant to assess latency issues. Thanks again, Sean
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pwalpwal
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/11 01:44:37
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Kev999
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/11 02:56:24
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Also try replacing the battery in the guitar.
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Mystic38
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/11 10:51:26
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gotta go with this as a +1 Kev999 Also try replacing the battery in the guitar.
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bitflipper
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/11 11:35:26
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Swhalen Thanks for the suggestion. Is this a latency issue though? There is no delay, just the change in the volume and quality of the sound from the guitar. The laptop was purchased specifically to run Sonar and was built with that in mind. The specs are great, and the wireless adapter is disabled. I do not use the laptop to go on the web. I will try the tool you mention, but am not sure if it will assist, if it is meant to assess latency issues.
Don't confuse DPC latency with audio latency. Though often related, they're not the same thing. DPC latency can indeed cause an effect that sounds like extreme distortion. In your position, however, I would suspect the instrument's electronics first and the interface second. Could be a bad jack on the guitar, for example, or a flaky cable. I'd try running through a preamp or mixer prior to the interface, and also try the other line input on the interface to see if the problem moves. Maybe you have access to, say, a synthesizer that you could plug into the interface; if there are no problems then the issue must be with the guitar.
 All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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Swhalen
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/11 14:55:17
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Thanks for all of the suggestions. I am really new and learning quite a bit already. , thanks. Checked the cable. Same issue with all three cables. Kev and Mystic, thank you! Embarrassingly, I was unaware that the guitar even had a battery. Do you think that could cause a situation where it works fine for a time, then goes distorted and quiet, and then, after turning everything off and waiting a bit, goes back to working normally for a time again? Would a bad battery just cause it to not work well, or could it bounce back and forth as it does? Bitflipper, I appreciate the clarification. I have never heard of DPC latency. Sounds like maybe not the problem here, but good to be aware of. The problem occurs regardless of if I go into line input 1 or 2. I do not have anything else to plug in except a mic and an electric guitar. These will not work in a line in, correct? For now, I will try to replace the battery in the Martin and will also endeavor to get my hands on another guitar that I can try in the line in jack. Thanks for all of the suggestions. I’ll let you all know when and if there is a resolution.
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Adq
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/11 14:58:13
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Usually it is consider as a best practice to record acoustic guitar with a mic, not with a piezo. Or to use piezo as addition to main mic sound. Concerning your problem, if new battery wouldn't help, it sounds that it might be an issue with your guitar's electric part. But what you do to return good sound back?
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kellerpj
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/11 15:08:50
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I just had the exact same scenario happen at a practice session I was recording this past week. One of the guitar players' direct acoustic guitar signal would play just fine, then turn into a really "grungy", distorted sound, then back to normal again. It turned out that the batteries in the guitar AND the direct interface box he was using were low. He replaced the low batteries and things sounded consistently good once again. Paul
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Anderton
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/11 16:09:27
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Swhalen
I was unaware that the guitar even had a battery. Do you think that could cause a situation where it works fine for a time, then goes distorted and quiet, and then, after turning everything off and waiting a bit, goes back to working normally for a time again? Yes. Piezo preamps draw very little current. So if the battery is on the edge, it can run for a while before losing enough charge to be problematic. Then when unused, internal chemical reactions occur that bring the battery back up somewhat again. Of course eventually the battery will die and never return, but before that happens it will exhibit the behavior you describe.
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Anderton
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/11 16:17:15
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Adq Usually it is consider as a best practice to record acoustic guitar with a mic, not with a piezo. Or to use piezo as addition to main mic sound.
The "piezo sound" usually sucks compared to a nice condenser mic, but piezos don't always have to sound bad. This article explains why there's a problem, and some potential solutions. This article goes into specific EQ settings that work well with piezo pickups. As luck would have it, all the examples use the ProChannel QuadCurve Also, last February the Braintree release included the "Acoustic Piezo" CA-X Amp Sim. Give it a try...as the description in the Rolling Updates section of the site says, "This amp compensates for the deficiencies of piezo pickups to bring out the true beauty of your acoustic guitar. While not intended for acoustic guitars with built-in EQ, if you can disable the EQ you may find Acoustic Piezo a better alternative. Acoustic Piezo can also be very useful for clean, defined electric guitar sounds, especially with neck humbucker pickups." The same update also included 15 ProChannel EQ presets for acoustic guitar.
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Adq
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/11 16:50:55
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Anderton
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/11 19:37:17
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No problem! I'm always glad to contribute what I've learned in the hope that it will benefit others.
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teego
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/11 19:48:06
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Don't forget to unplug your cable from the guitar when you aren't using it as it will drain the battery also. At least that is what I've always been told.
Computer: Intel core2 quad q8400 @2.66ghz, 4 gb memory,64 bit Windows 7 Focusrite Saffire Pro 24, Sonar Platinum Ipswich and Update 1
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Swhalen
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/12 13:45:11
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Thanks everybody! I am happy to report that I have swapped out the battery on the guitar and so far it seems as though the problem has been solved. I really appreciate all the suggestions and info.
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rscain
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/12 14:49:12
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Kev999 Also try replacing the battery in the guitar.
+1
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SF_Green
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/12 15:34:39
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Kev999 Also try replacing the battery in the guitar.
My Taylor did that to me one time. Freaked me out too. Definitely check the battery. The behavior of a dying one is exactly what you describe.
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SF_Green
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/12 15:38:38
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Also, you should edit the title of this post and add: [Solved] Considered helpful and polite to let people know when they search they can find an answer to this problem here. Glad you got it cleared up. Cheers
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thedukewestern
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Re: Martin acoustic/electric gets distorted while recording
2015/10/12 23:50:38
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Kev and Mystic, thank you! Embarrassingly, I was unaware that the guitar even had a battery. Do you think that could cause a situation where it works fine for a time, then goes distorted and quiet, ...... Yes - Absoluteley - get a large diaphragm condensor - and record your acoustic with on 2 seperate tracks - the pickup and the mic - itll sound great!
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