superdan54
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Solving my whitescreen woes - Please Help!!
Manchester is not off to a good start at all for me. 2 crashes within 5 minutes, then tacking on another 15-20 minutes each crash just waiting for SONAR to release the drivers and I've spent a whole night being entirely unproductive and irritated. The project I'm working on is not very complex...I'm still in the tracking phase and haven't added any effects processing. I have 4 audio tracks, 2x Dimension Pro, 2x Kore 2 Player, Addictive Drums 2 & Kontakt. Each time the crash has happened during playback...suddenly the audio will start stuttering/repeating and then eventually whitescreen on me. I had the same crashing issues with Lexington but not this bad, and that was the first version I had since upgrading to Win10. I'm using a V-Studio 100 and have a AMD Quad 3.0 Ghz with 12GB RAM. Also use an Axiom 61 & a Mackie Control. Drivers are up to date on the VS Unit. I have it plugged into a PCI USB 3.0 bus card...could that potentially cause issues since the vs is 2.0? I'm at a loss but I can't continue like this. I had a 1212m PCI that worked great, but it doesn't work with win10 unfortunately. I briefly had a Focusrite 2i2 and experienced the same instability issues and non-releasing of drivers. It seems that nobody makes decent PCI audio cards anymore (under $700 that is) so I need to figure out how to get these USB devices to play nice. Any advice?
post edited by superdan54 - 2016/01/29 16:59:57
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/01/28 04:30:41
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I have it plugged into a PCI USB 3.0 bus card...could that potentially cause issues since the vs is 2.0? Yes, almost 100% that this is you problem. Connect it to a USB 2 port
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mudgel
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/01/28 07:26:23
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Only repeating what's already been said.
USB 3 maybe backwards compatible in general for file viewing and general activity of that sort but for passing time critical data such as live audio it doesn't seem to be so robust when USB 2 is called for.
Unless your device is specifically built with USB 3 in mind stick with USB 2
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superdan54
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/01/28 09:37:51
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Bristol_Jonesey
I have it plugged into a PCI USB 3.0 bus card...could that potentially cause issues since the vs is 2.0?
Yes, almost 100% that this is you problem.
Connect it to a USB 2 port
Is it best to have a dedicated PCI USB bus or is it ok just to plug it into the internal motherboard? Was always worried about IRQ conflicts and such.
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/01/28 09:45:18
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Should be ok on the MOBO - mine is
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superdan54
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/01/28 21:37:04
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Well that wasn't the problem. I switched USB ports but still got a crash a minute and a half into working on the same project. The only difference this time was that I immediately got a SONARPLT.exe has stopped responding message when the audio engine started going haywire. Before it would just sit there for a minute before whitscreening. Any other ideas?
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superdan54
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/01/29 00:26:56
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OK I've verified the sample rates, making sure they match what the VS-100 has. I've also tried WASAPI & WDM modes. WDM seemed to last a bit longer, but still crashed within 10 minutes of use. There is nothing of use in the event logs since it's just the audio engine completely fritzing out. Anti-virus is disabled, no programs running in the background, drivers are up to date...I'm at a loss. EDIT: Something definitely seems off now that I've looked at my Driver Settings. I have the Asio Buffer at 256samples/5.8 msec, yet the total Roundtrip latency is reporting at 29 msec (12 input & 17.1 output). That seems to be pretty high from what I've read.
post edited by superdan54 - 2016/01/29 00:56:18
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superdan54
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/01/29 17:05:02
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Sorry to clog the forum, but I really want to get to the bottom of this problem once and for all. I've been able to get by over the years using my trusty 1212m, but PCI audio cards seem to be a thing of the past. I've had numerous firewire & USB devices over the years (Tascam FIREONE, US-122, Roland V-studio 100 & Focusrite 2i2)...all of them have seemed to have stability issues with SONAR, but it has gotten exponentially worse since Win 10 and the last few Platinum releases. I've emailed cakewalk support as well and am awaiting a response, but if anyone has advice on things I can try or look for I would be appreciative! I should also add that the project I'm working on is set at 24bit/44.1hz. Does it need to be 24/48hz?
post edited by superdan54 - 2016/01/29 17:16:29
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dcumpian
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/01/30 08:21:57
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superdan54
Sorry to clog the forum, but I really want to get to the bottom of this problem once and for all. I've been able to get by over the years using my trusty 1212m, but PCI audio cards seem to be a thing of the past. I've had numerous firewire & USB devices over the years (Tascam FIREONE, US-122, Roland V-studio 100 & Focusrite 2i2)...all of them have seemed to have stability issues with SONAR, but it has gotten exponentially worse since Win 10 and the last few Platinum releases. I've emailed cakewalk support as well and am awaiting a response, but if anyone has advice on things I can try or look for I would be appreciative!
I should also add that the project I'm working on is set at 24bit/44.1hz. Does it need to be 24/48hz?
Only if your interface has stability issues at 24/44.For example, mine doesn't always work well at anything other than 24/96. I suspect the driver was optimized for that. Honestly, I have read about so many issues with interfaces and Win10 that I am happy I haven't "upgraded" to Win10. When my current DAW needs to be replaced, I'll upgrade the interface to one that is built for Win10. Regards, Dan
Mixing is all about control. My music: http://dancumpian.bandcamp.com/ or https://soundcloud.com/dcumpian Studiocat Advanced Studio DAW (Intel i5 3550 @ 3.7GHz, Z77 motherboard, 16GB Ram, lots of HDDs), Sonar Plat, Mackie 1604, PreSonus Audiobox 44VSL, ESI 4x4 Midi Interface, Ibanez Bass, Custom Fender Mexi-Strat, NI S88, Roland JV-2080 & MDB-1, Komplete, Omnisphere, Lots o' plugins.
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superdan54
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/01/31 16:22:54
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dcumpian
Only if your interface has stability issues at 24/44.For example, mine doesn't always work well at anything other than 24/96. I suspect the driver was optimized for that.
Honestly, I have read about so many issues with interfaces and Win10 that I am happy I haven't "upgraded" to Win10. When my current DAW needs to be replaced, I'll upgrade the interface to one that is built for Win10.
Regards,
Dan
Well nothing I know of indicates that the Vs-100 is less stable with different configs. I might try 24/48 or 96 just to see if it makes a difference. I think my problems go beyond Win 10, but maybe I just need a fresh install of it as my current one is an upgrade from XP->Vista->Win 8. I wonder though if there is anything else I can do that is less drastic as I don't really have time to completely wipe & restore the system, especially when it's not guaranteed to have any impact. Would a reinstall of USB controller drivers have any effect?
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Sanderxpander
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/01/31 16:36:29
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Manchester seems less stable for me too, at least compared to Lexington. Last week I was in Germany on a writing camp and I was working my system for literally 14 hours a day and had three crashes or so in the whole week. I updated to the last Manchester when I got back, sat down with a friend to record some backings in an otherwise nearly empty project and got three hangs within an hour, which is when I reverted to Lexington. I tried the new Manchester version today and had two hangs so far. It's like the OP says, if you wait for maybe 15 minutes it does come back but that's hardly beneficial to the creative process. I did notice that one time it mentioned Kontakt 5 crashing and I use that in some form in most projects. Superdan, do you use that at all?
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Hatstand
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/01/31 17:53:21
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Can I suggest you do the following?
load a blank project and add 1 audio track and import a long wav file onto the track and play it.
if you have no crashes then try adding a synth track with one of the cakewalk synths and play along to the wav file.
Is it still stable?
If it is then you need to keep adding things until it isn't
If it isn't stable even with this low load then you have a serious problem somewhere. I know this sounds over simplified but if there are others using Sonar without issue then the difference is most likely your environment and not the software
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superdan54
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/01/31 17:57:24
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Sanderxpander
Manchester seems less stable for me too, at least compared to Lexington. Last week I was in Germany on a writing camp and I was working my system for literally 14 hours a day and had three crashes or so in the whole week. I updated to the last Manchester when I got back, sat down with a friend to record some backings in an otherwise nearly empty project and got three hangs within an hour, which is when I reverted to Lexington. I tried the new Manchester version today and had two hangs so far. It's like the OP says, if you wait for maybe 15 minutes it does come back but that's hardly beneficial to the creative process. I did notice that one time it mentioned Kontakt 5 crashing and I use that in some form in most projects. Superdan, do you use that at all?
Yeah I use Kontakt quite a bit. This project only has 1 instance of Kontakt, and it's not super heavy intensive, just an acoustic bass by Orange Tree Samples. I tried a few things that seemed to help somewhat. I reset the vs-100 to factory settings and also reinstalled the win 10 drivers. I also set the SONAR Platinum shortcut to always run as administrator. After this I was able to run for about 45 minutes until I got my first crash. I was able to restart SONAR after a couple minutes as well after rebooting my V-studio a couple times. That said, crashing once an hour is still unacceptable so I'd like to press further. One thing I did notice, the SPLAT.exe process was at almost 2GB when it crashed and is using around 20% processing when it's running. Most of that is due to samples I've loaded, but the ones I have loaded aren't too intensive...maybe I have some other setting I need to look at or is that normal behavior?
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Sanderxpander
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/01/31 18:00:55
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Doesn't seem normal to me, as I said Lexington was running almost non stop for a week with virtually no crashes. I don't have your interface though. Still wondering if there may be a bug exposed in Kontakt since Manchester. It has never been the friendliest plugin to deal with.
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dcumpian
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/02/01 08:21:46
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I ran Manchester (Update 1) over the weekend with heavily loaded Kontakt and Omnisphere 2 instances, along with BFD3 drum tracks and had zero hangs or crashes. Also, several glitches I reported while using Kingston seem to be gone, though I haven't retested everything I ran into.
It is weird how each release runs differently on various machines...
Regards,
Dan
Mixing is all about control. My music: http://dancumpian.bandcamp.com/ or https://soundcloud.com/dcumpian Studiocat Advanced Studio DAW (Intel i5 3550 @ 3.7GHz, Z77 motherboard, 16GB Ram, lots of HDDs), Sonar Plat, Mackie 1604, PreSonus Audiobox 44VSL, ESI 4x4 Midi Interface, Ibanez Bass, Custom Fender Mexi-Strat, NI S88, Roland JV-2080 & MDB-1, Komplete, Omnisphere, Lots o' plugins.
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superdan54
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/02/02 01:06:56
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OK well I think I've got my problems resolved with this track!
Kontakt was the culprit. In doing a final mix playthrough, I noticed it was crashing at about the same point each time. I also checked in X3 and it crashed at the same point as well. So I have some questions about how to properly use Kontakt.
The instance of Kontakt that is causing the crashes is actually the first time I've used its multi-instrument capabilities. Before I would always load a separate instance of Kontakt for each instrument. This time I loaded two instruments, a harp and a piano into it and assigned two midi tracks to route to the Kontakt instance. This is how to properly use Kontakt right, so as not to create unecessary overhead? The only other thing I can think is that the harp part was quite busy, so maybe it just overloaded the buffer and caused an audio engine meltdown?
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Sanderxpander
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/02/02 01:20:46
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Honestly I don't think it's supposed to "melt-down" at all, you're describing a pretty normal use of the plug. Good to know. I think it's probably a new bug/incompatibility in Manchester or one in Kontakt that got exposed.
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dcumpian
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes
2016/02/02 08:11:43
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superdan54
OK well I think I've got my problems resolved with this track!
Kontakt was the culprit. In doing a final mix playthrough, I noticed it was crashing at about the same point each time. I also checked in X3 and it crashed at the same point as well. So I have some questions about how to properly use Kontakt.
The instance of Kontakt that is causing the crashes is actually the first time I've used its multi-instrument capabilities. Before I would always load a separate instance of Kontakt for each instrument. This time I loaded two instruments, a harp and a piano into it and assigned two midi tracks to route to the Kontakt instance. This is how to properly use Kontakt right, so as not to create unecessary overhead? The only other thing I can think is that the harp part was quite busy, so maybe it just overloaded the buffer and caused an audio engine meltdown?
If your midi track has a bunch of little clips, try bouncing them to larger clips. Sometimes there is data in a clip boundary that can cause issues. Also, check your event list for duplicate notes or other weirdness. If you've built the part up over several passes, and then done a bunch of editing, lassoing the clips and bouncing them to a single clip usually helps. I used Manchester all weekend with new and old projects having Kontakt, Play, BFD3 and SSD4. These are not small projects, and I did not run into any issues with this release (yet, knock on wood). I did have problems with Kingston and skipped Lexington. Regards, Dan
Mixing is all about control. My music: http://dancumpian.bandcamp.com/ or https://soundcloud.com/dcumpian Studiocat Advanced Studio DAW (Intel i5 3550 @ 3.7GHz, Z77 motherboard, 16GB Ram, lots of HDDs), Sonar Plat, Mackie 1604, PreSonus Audiobox 44VSL, ESI 4x4 Midi Interface, Ibanez Bass, Custom Fender Mexi-Strat, NI S88, Roland JV-2080 & MDB-1, Komplete, Omnisphere, Lots o' plugins.
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JonD
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes - Please Help!!
2016/02/02 09:45:40
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Is Kontakt up to date with latest patch?
Is multi-core enabled in Kontakt?
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superdan54
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Re: Solving my whitescreen woes - Please Help!!
2016/02/02 23:52:02
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JonD
Is Kontakt up to date with latest patch?
Is multi-core enabled in Kontakt?
Yes and Yes! I spoke to soon apparently on Kontakt being the culprit. I loaded up the project tonight and started playblack, I then clicked on another portion of the timeline and instant crash. Back to the drawing board! EDIT: After testing stability by freezing each soft synth, I found one instance of Dimension Pro that crashed every time I tried to freeze it. Upon inspection, one of the harp MIDI clips was inadvertently copied to it in a new take lane, so there was a ton of data being processed at once, and for a long release pad I'm guessing that put it over the top! Hopefully that really is the culprit this time!
post edited by superdan54 - 2016/02/03 00:41:37
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