Sonar OR Cubase OR Studio One OR Mixcraft

Interested to see how those who have narrowed the choice down to two or more of the above are progressing with the decision.
 
I still need to explore the demos a bit more but I'm pretty sure that whichever of the four I choose they have enough of what I need to make music. This means that my final decision will come down to a few less technical factors.
 
Sonar
 
Pros

• No learning curve (except for features that I don't already know)
• No loss of functionality (locked and 32 bit VSTs, DX support, Pro Channel)

Cons

• Lack of support (updates and how to)
• Could turn out to be an expensive choice (this depends on how long it keeps working i.e. at what point does cross grade plus updates exceed the price I pay in the future I'm guessing that I'm in pocket if Sonar works for 4 years before I finally have to buy)

Cubase, Studio One, Mix Craft
 
Pros

• Support (updates and how to)
• Should get better
• Pro options include effects and instruments (not necessarily replacements for what is lost but a start)

Cons

• 32 bit VSTs need a wrapper (which may or may not work based on my research to date)
• Learning curve
• I had not budgeted for this now
• May not be compatible with everything else I use and my hardware (unlikely but could happen)

Cubase
 
Pros

• Current offer is reasonable 
• Have their own hardware (good for the their finances and for me if I need to update/upgrade)
• Part of Yamaha
• A "standard" (I did not choose Sonar/Cakewalk over Cubase I just bought what was right at the time and stuck with it there have been times when being a Cubase user would have been a good thing i.e. when my son was at college and the choices were Logic and Cubase)
• Used in Education (this is good repeatable business)

Cons

• No ARA for Melodyne (VariAudio looks like a viable alternative)
• Feels "old" (compared to the other two)

Studio One
 
Pros

• I'm sure the pricing will be reasonable when it is announced
• Have their own hardware
• ARA
• Feels "modern"
• Lot's of great reviews

Cons

• Some elements seem like a work in progress
• Not an established Pro player

Mixcraft
 
Pros

• Price
• ARA
• Takes a different approach

Cons

• Small company (they remind me a lot of Twelve Tone not necessarily a bad thing but need to think about it)
• Feels like a work in progress

Summary
 
Cubase feels like the safe (future proof) option and Sonar the sensible (financially conservative) option.
 
This leaves Studio One as the innovative this could be really good (or bad) options.
 
I remain undecided and open to ideas.

This is nicely summed up, thanks. Right now here is where I am. I have been playing with Studio One demo. First impressions; it's a stripped out, lightweight racing DAW. That will suit a lot of people, especially newbies who can get up and running fast. For me though, it doesn't go deep enough and I can see myself hitting brick walls and having to compromise my workflow around the limits of what the DAW can do. Sure, that's the same with any DAW to an extent, but S1 is just too lean for me. However, I'll come back to it in just a mo.
 
Cubase is currently my top choice. Presonus' marketing department refer to Cubase (and Sonar) as "being built on legacy code which makes it full of bloatware" - not an exact quote, but the jist of it. However, what they refer to as "bloatware" is actually deep features, flexibility, and workflow choice. Much of the legacy code in these big, old DAWs are actually features that still work and are still used. I'm not exactly a newbie to Cubase. I first used it on an Atari ST in the 80's and later used it in the early 2000's. I had some issues with it then and later moved to Cakewalk. Cubase is the devil I kind of know and it is the only choice that has the robustness of Sonar for my kind of workflows (which vary depending on the job I am doing at the time). It's the only option that is really comparable with Sonar. However, there are things I don't like about Cubase. Steinberg is one of those things. The update pricing regime is more expensive than other solutions. If you skip an update, it will cost you more. Even the forums often feel a bit stiff and uptight. One thing I loved about Cakewalk was the friendliness and community feeling here. Another con is the lack of ARA support, but they have their own alternative for Melodyne and Melodyne can still be used as a plugin. 32bit plugin support requires Jbridge, but there are only a few 32bit plugs I use in Sonar now and I probably wouldn't miss them too much so may not even bother with Jbridge. The dongle - not a big issue for me. I have several dongles for stuff now so one more won't hurt.
 
Cubase will probably be the way I go for now. They are not known for having upgrade deals so I will grab it while the crossgrade is reasonable. There's no rush though right now. They say the deal should last til Xmas or the end of the year. So I have some thinking a planning space.
 
Going back to Studio One. I will keep an eye on it. They seem to have deals fairly regularly. Like everyone else I was not budgeting for a new DAW. So I will get the more expensive Cubase now while there is a once in a decade deal. Then later I have the option to get Studio One once it's matured a bit more, during one of their many deals so that I can play around with it. I certainly think Studio One is going places and is worth keeping an eye on. It just isn't ready for me yet.

Has anyone looked at n-Track?
 
I tried it out around 12 years ago back when it was shareware, and it was basic but very stable. It seems to have matured quite a bit (now at version 8), and it's now also multi-platform.
 
The EX version (which supports 64 bit FX processing) is only EUR 71.40 - might be worth a look if you need multi-platform support.

I'm seriously looking at Bitwig. It seems to be the most innovative when it comes to features aimed at the synth/modular/sound designing crowd, and it gets a lot of praise from artists in those genres. I go back and forth between all of these DAW options and every one of them has some kind of giant bummer associated with it. Bitwig for example doesn't do time sig changes, and after the Cakewalk disaster I'm naturally suspicious of every company's ongoing financials (will Bitwig still be here in 5 years? What about Studio One? How do we know if these companies are concealing business problems that would potentially make them go ****-up like Cakewalk?).

35mm
[Cubase will probably be the way I go for now. They are not known for having upgrade deals so I will grab it while the crossgrade is reasonable. There's no rush though right now. They say the deal should last til Xmas or the end of the year. So I have some thinking a planning space.]
 
 
Cubase is looking the same for me as you said. Maybe I'm wrong but I get the impression that Studio One was designed for their live consoles which would explain the lack of midi. For me  I need something that was designed for studio recording and not the other way around. I was looking at their consoles and saw their DAW. The Yamaha TF series support Cubase should I desire automation. This is like a sudden death where you have to make arrangements  immediately. I was not thinking of dumping my DAW. I hope I have the time to get the crossgrades to my decision. I'm not going to purchase a DAW  just to get a deal. I still have my computer and my Native Inst, IK.. all work standalone. I have a Tascam 24trk DP24 and can easily import my instruments in like I did in 8 track analog days if need be. 

post edited by hydemusic - 2017/11/28 01:58:08

Anderton
Another difference is that Cubase supports MIDI FX, Studio One Professional does not. 

 
Craig:  Is that deficiency cured by the dxi wrapper you wrote about elsewhere, which includes a mfx wrapper as well?
 
Steve

Not to be a d**k and mention something at a sensitive time... I had already departed Splat world for more accommodating pastures in the last year.  Tried very hard to convert to Reaper (and still admire it) but it was not conducive to my workflow.  I ended up giving Studio One 3 Pro a try and fell in love.  Reason one: stability.  I just got the sense that there was bloat behind Splat that seemed to... cause problems.  None of that in SO3P.  In a year of working with SO3P, not one crash.  I would be lucky to go a day in Splat without a crash.
 
I will admit, the editor takes some time to get used to (paradigm shift and all that) but that's a brain/muscle memory thing. I have embraced the instrument track and now prefer it.  There are lots of other features I really like but this response is merely an affirmative, boolean nod to SO3P.

Here is one legacy for me.  There will forever be a "C:\Program Files\Cakewalk\Vstplugins\" folder on my DAW machine.  Too much stuff pointing there.

SMcNamara

Anderton
Another difference is that Cubase supports MIDI FX, Studio One Professional does not. 

 
Craig:  Is that deficiency cured by the dxi wrapper you wrote about elsewhere, which includes a mfx wrapper as well?
 
Steve

No, because there's no place in SOP to insert MFX.

Cubase is one of the most mature around and has really deep features for pro's .....
 
Studio one is the most "reactive" when it comes to developpement , some stuff are just beautyfully excuted , some other stuff missing are just imbelievable  .... but for me it's the one i spend the most time here , i 'm good in mixbuss , master sonar , good at live , protools , and studio one  ....i will take the time to work real work to judge .... but so far the transition between sonar and S1 is smooth , regular stuff are intuitive , exotic option are easy once you get he concept , and the project management is the ice on the cake (i don't know if it's the right way to say it ;))
 
of course sonar isn't dead , and it's up to everybody to handle the maintenance of their system so they can use it for a long time ..but for me , having done the mixing in sonar , and mastering as i write in studio one , i started to think i should have mixxed in studio one to get the "link done" between songs and projects in case of modification ....

Looks like we discussing the same thing in different threads. Here is my thread on KVRaudio.com on this topic. Everybody should join KVR. Great community for keyboard and software synths based musicians. https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=495072
 
I remember in early 2000s, Emagic released their last update for Logic- 5.5 and announced that they discontinue Windows development. The update was $150. I bought it thinking- they fixed ALL the bugs and got newest features- it should last for couple years. It did. But in couple of years it looked very outdated, I started getting more and more errors and crashes and all kind of minor issues. I built new computer and installed Sonar 4. I remember this feeling of reading about new versions of all other software and see your DAW slowly dying and becoming buggy and developing issues. I will keep Sonar for my old projects but I am moving forward now. 
 
I bought Cubase crossgrade at $255. I spent one evening and one full day with it. I like it. It does not look old. It looks old on demo videos, but now when you open it on dual 43" monitors. It looks gorgeous. The audio clips have transparency and it makes them look like they made of glass. I have issue with only 16 colors, but you can customize the brightness of tracks and adjust individual colors, but then you have to choose one of 16 slots for it.
 
Every new project requires set up of audio inputs and outputs, then you get to save it as a preset, but it does not stay set if you start new project- you still have to load preset. This is irritating. 
 
They have tabs for everything and fader with Meter hiding in one of the tabs, so it is not visible on the left like with Sonar unless you open that specific tab that gets closed randomly. But there is HUGE master meter on the right- I mean super big and colorful. 
 
Melodyne is working. I tested it. You have to insert it as plugin and then Play the vocal track, and it records it- kind of weird. It opens as empty window first- you have to play the whole track. But then it works. Also I upgraded my Melodyne to Editor- it is not basic version that came with Sonar. 
 
I seriously missing the ability to record sounds comming from Software synth as audio. In Sonar, all it took was to select Record on Instrument Audio track. I like to insert separate Audio and MIDI tracks for softsynth. Looks like in Cubase only single track can be selected. You can route extra MIDI track to it. But to record Audio from software synth, some Fantom track has to be created and routed to master- I have to read again what they were explaining to me.
 
I get a feeling that all the new features that we got recently in Sonar were to keep up with Cubase, because most of it was already implemented. I like the Piano Roll in Cubase better. It has dark background. You can draw the notes. You can insert set length notes. You can select any notes. I did not discover how to enter note length by typing it in yet- hope it is available. I also dont know if it has that new feature of multitrack window. 
 
Will be learning more. Helpful community. 
 
 
 
 
 

Don’t forget Reason. It hosts VSTs now, and there is a black friday/cyber monday sale. Not endorsing it,but it is a contender.

If one does not like Cubase, do not get it.  But to say that their offer is unreasonable is not fair.
Underpaying does not help anyone.  

As long as you have a dedicated machine, and you don't let Windoze update anything without making a couple Acronis clones so you can return to where you were, Sonar will continue to work just like it does right now for infinity and beyond.  There is no reason for Sonar to suddenly crap out unless you let your OS crap out.  It is a set of files on your drive.  It is not a puppy you need to feed and let outside so it doesn't crap on your floor!

Anderton
Another difference is that Cubase supports MIDI FX, Studio One Professional does not. 

So I can use SEM with Cubase?

Not even thought about that until now.