Sonar X1c - Midi delayed while playback

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stuff
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2011/08/31 04:14:26 (permalink)

Sonar X1c - Midi delayed while playback

Hi folks!
After I spent half the night finding out a solution to my problem I refer to you for further ideas.
And here is the strange story:

I started a new project and added 7 tracks with midi which I sent to a Native Instruments Kontakt 4 synth with 6 different sounds (2 tracks go to the same harpsichord - bass and chords).
After that I decided to add 1 audio track with people laughing (it´s the beginning of a short story and a wedding ceremony)
- everything works fine so far.
Now I added another midi track and XLN´s Addictive Drums. Because the song consists of several parts I made a split after 49 bars and changed the tempo settings from 75 to 132 after a short ritardando.
So far I just used already existing midi parts, I did not play anything myself.

And now strange things happen...

I added another midi track and routed it to the Kontakt synth with a scarbee pre bass - everythings fine.
I pushed the play button - cakewalk plays - everythings fine
But as soon as I hit my Roland keyboard the bass is more than delayed because of latency - it is more like an offbeat playing to the original speed (no matter where in the song I start - 75bpm or 132 !)

I deleted the track and the Scarbee bass and everything worked fine...
I tried once more ...same result
I deleted the track again and added SI-Bass guitar... same result
I deleted that track and soft synth too.

...and now I have this delayed playback on all my tracks...

I tried deleting Addictive Drums but no result, I tried to adjust latency - didn´t work

Seems to me every time I add a midi track there´s something going wrong

PLEASE ANY IDEAS OF WHAT´S GOING ON ???

My machine:

Dell Precision T3400
Windows XP SP3
Intel Core 2 Quad CPU
Q 9550@ 2.83 GHz
3,25 Gb RAM

Soundcard:

RME Fireface 400 via Firewire


Thanks for help in advance

Nice greetings from Germany

Stuff
#1

6 Replies Related Threads

    stuff
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    Re:Sonar X1c - Midi delayed while playback 2011/08/31 08:55:23 (permalink)
    So after I deleted the audio track everything works fine!!!

    Can this be a sync problem between midi and audio tracks?

    Any ideas out there
    #2
    bigboi
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    Re:Sonar X1c - Midi delayed while playback 2011/08/31 09:05:23 (permalink)
    This sounds exactly like a problem I had recently with Maschine.  To get it working, I had to go into the plugin manager and change the "inputs" for Maschine from 8 to 2...it then worked fine. Totally strange....and it IS a Cakewalk problem.  My setup worked fine in Studio One.

    My problem was that Maschine would play perfectly in time.....it would just be one bar behind!
     
    Here is the other totally strange thing about it.....if I chose "midi metronome" instead of audio....everything worked fine. 
    post edited by bigboi - 2011/08/31 09:08:01

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    #3
    lfm
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    Re:Sonar X1c - Midi delayed while playback 2011/08/31 09:24:53 (permalink)
    We had issues reported and filed as bugreport to Cake about that recorded midi clips were not adjusted according to PDC used at the time of recording.

    Audio clips are supposed to be adjusted, but it seems that all midi recorded is seen as recorded late when this problem arises.

    It does not quite sound like the problem you had - but if PDC never was used(maybe disabled manually so far, X1 should have such a feature) it later became apparent.

    Does all notes show up in PRV as right on spot?
    #4
    stuff
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    Re:Sonar X1c - Midi delayed while playback 2011/08/31 13:45:24 (permalink)
    O.K. I finally fixed the problem.
    The delay in the midi track played live was caused by a IK Multimedia plug in, TRacks Lin EQ.
    When I turned it off in the effects container everything works fine, when I switch it on again the same delay happens again...
    But why does a plug-in influences the latency of an midi track or is it because the virtual synth (Kontakt 4) sends every note through my soundcard, as does the audio track?

    Any suggestions?
    #5
    Piers66
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    Re:Sonar X1c - Midi delayed while playback 2011/08/31 14:07:45 (permalink)
    lfm


    We had issues reported and filed as bugreport to Cake about that recorded midi clips were not adjusted according to PDC used at the time of recording.

    Audio clips are supposed to be adjusted, but it seems that all midi recorded is seen as recorded late when this problem arises.

    It does not quite sound like the problem you had - but if PDC never was used(maybe disabled manually so far, X1 should have such a feature) it later became apparent.

    Does all notes show up in PRV as right on spot?
    Hello,
     
    Aplogies if this is a stupid question, but what's PDC?
     
    Piers.

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    #6
    brundlefly
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    Re:Sonar X1c - Midi delayed while playback 2011/08/31 14:08:42 (permalink)

    But why does a plug-in influences the latency of an midi track or is it because the virtual synth (Kontakt 4) sends every note through my soundcard, as does the audio track?



    Yes. The IK plug needs extra time to do its processing. It reports this time to SONAR, and SONAR applies Plugin Delay Compensation (PDC) to all audio and soft synth tracks so they will play back in sync with the track that's being delayed by the plugin processing.


    To be clear, it's the audio output of the soft synth that's delayed, not the MIDI. But if you record MIDI to the delayed audio (even using a hardware synth with PDC Override enabled for input-monitored tracks), the MIDI will not be compensated, and will appear late in the timeline.


    Bottom line: You want to avoid using plugs that require PDC when tracking.

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