Sonar can't record soft synth audio output in real time?

I'm talking about the associated audio track that is created when you insert a synth. Why is the record button missing? Even if I route that output to another audio track then the R button gets removed.
I know that I can freeze a synth and/or bounce the audio but this doesn't let you capture the craziness that can be created in real-time with some groove modules such as Stylus RMX.
I can do this easily in Ableton Live! When I set the input of an audio track to recieve the output of a synth, I can arm the record button and record away and the waveform gets recorded. In Sonar, the best I can do is preview the waveform but it never gets recorded.

I'm pretty sure the feature your talking about was added in Sonar 8. However, me no have so I'm not sure how it's done but I think it's in a round about way. If you have Sonar 8 check out the help files for something called Live input bounce.

Live input bounce
When using the Bounce to Track(s) or Export Audio command to bounce audio in real-time, you can now choose to include any live audio input in the bounce. This allows you to capture realtime inputs as part of the bounce. This feature can be used to record soft synth outputs to a track in realtime - i.e. MIDI that triggers the synth will be printed to the track.

yeah this would be very useful on certain softsynth plugins and stylus is a perfect example like when using the chaos section of it-

i may be able to help with this.
i was trying to do the same thing recently with the Percussion Agent part
of Groove Agent. Percussion Agent does not output midi, whereas Groove
Agent (classic) does, and i wanted to capture the audio that i could see hitting
the "synth" track (the one with the R button missing).

i ended up downloading Silverspike Tape It 2. http://www.silverspike.com/?Products:TapeIt
Tape It 1 is free, Tape It 2 is about $20 and has some very nice features..

Real-time recording? It ends up working like this:
Insert Tape It into the fx bin of the synth track.
Create a file name in Tape It, check the checkbox that allows Broadcast Time Stamp.
Arm the Synth Track folder, start recording in SONAR.
Start recording in Tape It.
Start your synth, groove agent, whatever.
When you're done, stop the synth, stop Tape It, stop SONAR.
"Close the file" in Tape It. just one click.
Insert an empty audio track into SONAR (you could have done that first).
Drag the file (from the Tape It icon) into the audio track.
Assuming that SONAR is configured to recognize Broadcast Time Stamp, the audio will pop right to
the "realtime" starting point, regardless of where you drop it in that audio track.

Complicated? No. Once you try it a few times, all the above steps in Tape It take about 10 seconds total.

I've been very happy with it. I tried the free version for about 5 minutes, then purchased Tape It 2.

HTH
rusty

+1 for TapeIt.... did EXACTLY what I was looking for. (wanted to operate and record Arturia Moog Modular, including the changing sounds as you pull patch cords, adjust, well, anything. ) very cool.

ORIGINAL: MUSE

I don't really see why this should be so hard in Sonar. Many hosts have been able to route audio from one track to another and record the output of VSTi's to audio that way for a long time (examples: Live, Energy XT, Reaper, Samplitude)

It's probably not that it's *hard* - it's probably that SONAR has always been a bit "ahead of the curve" with MIDI and softsynth features (think of how long it took Pro Tools to come up with a softsynth or "instrument" implementation that even came close to being as streamlined and powerful), and when they first implemented softsynths in SONAR there may have been limitations to the ability to record their output in real time. Computers weren't as powerful, it was a new feature, etc., etc., etc.

Now that everything's more robust and softsynths have become the norm, there are probably more users for whom this type of capability would make sense; but I would guess that since it wasn't the way softsynths in SONAR were conceived from the get-go, it might mean an overhaul to get it working. It would be interesting to get insight from Noel or Brandon on this.

Have you submitted an official FEATURE REQUEST?

ORIGINAL: RTGraham

ORIGINAL: MUSE

I don't really see why this should be so hard in Sonar. Many hosts have been able to route audio from one track to another and record the output of VSTi's to audio that way for a long time (examples: Live, Energy XT, Reaper, Samplitude)

It's probably not that it's *hard* - it's probably that SONAR has always been a bit "ahead of the curve" with MIDI and softsynth features (think of how long it took Pro Tools to come up with a softsynth or "instrument" implementation that even came close to being as streamlined and powerful), and when they first implemented softsynths in SONAR there may have been limitations to the ability to record their output in real time. Computers weren't as powerful, it was a new feature, etc., etc., etc.

Now that everything's more robust and softsynths have become the norm, there are probably more users for whom this type of capability would make sense; but I would guess that since it wasn't the way softsynths in SONAR were conceived from the get-go, it might mean an overhaul to get it working. It would be interesting to get insight from Noel or Brandon on this.

Have you submitted an official FEATURE REQUEST?

I believe many have so requested. I know I have, and I've read that others have too.


OP, what I do is route my master out (or SS track out), to a digital mixer direct out channel, loop the DO back into a sonar audio track and record. Since my digital mixer is also my soundcard, I stay "in the box". There is a small delay, but since I'm routing the master out this way also, there's no latency issue with individual tracks (all tracks share the same latency).

If you have a digital setup like this, then use this workaround until Sonar comes to their senses.

I fasten my seatbelt every time I use Sonar.

If <a number of conditions are fulfilled>, it's easy.

Yeah, most cards will provide some form of loop-back routing in the digital domain. It's still a clunky workaround, because:

- each channel eats up 1 extra output and 1 input(-driver)
- the signal is converted to fixed-point, so you need to watch out for clipping
- doubled latency (even without DA/AD conversion)
- probably higher CPU use than staying within the host


One would think that such a feature is a no-brainer in this day and age of DAWs. I do understand that Cakewalk needs to prioritise feature requests. But c'mon, this one would solve so many problems in one swoop - including those for which reasonable workarounds exist. Though a reasonable workaround is still a workaround. And using e.g. TapeIt in the context of multi-out synths is not what I'd call reasonable btw.

werner

One of the easiest methods is to insert an audio recorder plugin (I use Edison) and record the audio output directly. Again Sonar is somewhat behind the field though in not supporting drag and drop of the resulting wave into an audio track (Reaper does this for example and even makes a track for you when you drag it into an empty space as well as copying over any markers or even slices made in Edison, I presume, since it was made by Image Line, so would FL Studio)

MUSE...
to my eye it looks like SONAR (8.3) does support dragging and dropping of recorded audio
(through Tape It) into an audio track... works for me...
Rusty

Interesting. Either tapeIt uses a different method than Edison to do this or I need to try a different method. I was assuming it would create a track as it does in Reaper but did also try creating an empty track and that didn't work either so is there something else I need to do (e.g. does it need to actually have some audio in it already?)

I'll have to experiment some more with Edison. I also have it inserted in the fx bin (although you can also have it in the master bin to record the whole piece). TapeIt looks OK but the great thing about Edison it's its a fully functional audio editor as a VST with excellent timestretching and beat slicing and in Reaper at least it will retain any markers and slices made if you drag it onto a track (plus you can drag selections as well as whole clips) so if I could get that working in Sonar too it would be very cool.

I know this is an old thread (very old) but was this feature ever implemented?  I'm using X1, and its not possible to record soft synth output live to an audio track (at least, if it it is I don't know how ...).    Is it possible in X1?  if not, then in X2?

You should ask this question in the X1 forum.