h3kke
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Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
The fear of Sonar breaking due to a future Windows update may be irrational. It might work for another 10 years (or to the point where the current computer/DAW paradigm is completely obsolete). Let's also assume that Cakewalk somehow provides access to a version that can be installed using a serial number scheme (I think it's a reasonable assumption that Gibson will at least work this detail out).
I'm wondering how you all think Sonar Platinum, in its current state, stacks up against the other DAWs out there for MIDI and audio?
I know everyone's reaction is sadness and despair at the thought of no development in the future, but that is pretty much how it used to be when you bought software. The "constant update" thing is a new paradigm and let's not forget, regressions are always possible with each update as well as advances. Other DAW companies and plugin companies will likely suffer a similar fate soon with so much stuff so cheap on the market.
Basically I'm just wondering if I should keep Sonar Platinum and just not worry about it, or retire it to the grave now and go with another DAW.
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gprokap
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 01:46:41
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rlared
I'm wondering how you all think Sonar Platinum, in its current state, stacks up against the other DAWs out there for MIDI and audio?
I think overall it's the best product out there. But eventually it'll stop working, might be 10+ years but eventually you won't be able to open projects. Does this matter that much? If you're a hobbyist not so much. If you're a pro you probably weren't using SONAR as your only DAW.
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John T
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 01:48:15
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You can absolutely make broadcast quality, master record quality, movie soundtrack quality audio in current (and much older) versions of Sonar. And it's future proof up to crazy sample rates and running times. I'm in no rush to change to anything else. My only concern is the authorisation issue.
This is one of the problems, I suppose, for the DAW market. Most of these products have been essentially "complete" for a long time now. You can always enhance things and improve workflows and so on. But there's nothing I can really think of that I'll need to be able to do, professionally, in the next five or so years, that Sonar doesn't already do.
http://johntatlockaudio.com/Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
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FettsVett
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 01:48:22
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It's not irrational. It has broken my setup before. No one could help me here, and there was no tech support. So I had to completely re-install everything.
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dubdisciple
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 02:10:10
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As long as there are no compatability issues, current state sonar will likely stack up well against other DAWs. Honestly, most DAWs reached point where in the box recording, mixing and mastering were reality years ago.
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Ionian
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 02:31:02
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The problem is there's missing functionality that needs to be put back. There's longstanding bugs that need to be fixed. There's plenty of issues with the program. What this means is that NONE of this is going to get any better. The state Sonar's in, is where it's gonna stay forever.
Not to mention that you have no idea how long Gibson will do us the courtesy of keeping the servers running. It maybe a week, a month, or whatever but there will be a time when re-installing the program will be impossible because you won't be able to authorize it.
If you're a casual user or a hobbyist, then you might be able to chug along with no issues for some time because you're not always banging up against the endless bugs that now will never be fixed (and let's not kid ourselves, Cakewalk never had any intention of fixing them). But even if you're a hobbyist, there will be a point when you can't re-authorize it and that's when it comes crashing down.
My equipment: A Commodore 64, 2 1541 Disk Drives, Dr T's Music Studio and a Casiotone CT-460. www.frankperri.com
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mixsit
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 03:03:06
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.. but there will be a time when re-installing the program will be impossible because you won't be able to authorize it. Question; On 8.5 here. I have (saved) the text files originally used to install and run Sonar. I thought they were my assigned keys' and could be reused on a reinstall. Thank you
Wayne Smith Part time long time.. CathouseSound Mother Ships - StudioCat DAWs Portals - RME
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Vastman
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 03:04:06
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Best alternative? Well, I've owned studio one 3pro for a couple years now and I think it sucks... there is NO comparison. However, I've just bought a couple copies of Cubase for me and a fellow Sonar user as this is the platform of choice for many heavy hitters over at VI Control and after watching the Groove3 Cubase bundle, which I'd picked up on sale awhile back, I'm kinda stoked...very pleasing to the eye, super midi tools and a fresh start with a company that ain't going away.
Been with Sonar from day one but given the way this has come down, I'm ready for a fresh start. My fondest hope would be for Magix to acquire cakewalk and fold it into it's Vegas family as this would be a powerful combo... but I'm moving ahead with a new platform for now...
Dana We make the future... Climate Change MusicVastMaschine:SP4L/W10/i74930K/32GB/RME/CAD E100s; The Orchestra! NOVO!/Inspire/BohemianViolin&Cello, ARK1&2,/MinimalCapriccioMaximoSoto/OE1&2, Action&Emotive/Omni2/Tril/RMX/All OrangeTree/Falcon/APE Jugs/Alpha&Bravo/BFD3 & SD3Gravity/DM307/AEON/DM/Damage/Diva/HZebra/Hive/Diversion/VC4/Serum/Alchemy/blablablaSpitfire/8DIO/SL/KH/EW/NI; Shred1&2/AGF,G,M&T Torch&Res&Ren/GD-6; Ibanez SR1200&SR505NOVAX FanFret Tele&Strat
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h3kke
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 03:39:22
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Vastman
Best alternative? Well, I've owned studio one 3pro for a couple years now and I think it sucks... there is NO comparison. However, I've just bought a couple copies of Cubase for me and a fellow Sonar user as this is the platform of choice for many heavy hitters over at VI Control and after watching the Groove3 Cubase bundle, which I'd picked up on sale awhile back, I'm kinda stoked...very pleasing to the eye, super midi tools and a fresh start with a company that ain't going away.
Been with Sonar from day one but given the way this has come down, I'm ready for a fresh start. My fondest hope would be for Magix to acquire cakewalk and fold it into it's Vegas family as this would be a powerful combo... but I'm moving ahead with a new platform for now...
Yeah I have used Studio One 3 Pro. I think it's pretty good actually but something about it just doesn't engage me. I also like Reaper. But something about Sonar draws me back. . . maybe it's the interface? I've tried Cubase Elements a few times and I absolutely hated it lol. I just can't figure out the interface of Cubase. I hate the way it looks, the menus all over the place, and that a USB license is required for the higher versions. But I know a lot of people love it.
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denverdrummer
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 04:25:25
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You should probably give Cubase 9 a try. They fixed alot of the interface issues in earlier versions.
The big thing I will miss is that I think Bitwig studio is the only other Windows DAW besides Sonar that has a native full screen mode in Windows.
Win 10 Pro 64 bit, Dell Inspiron 15, core i7, 16GB RAM, Focusrite Scarlett 18i20, Mackie MR5 Mark 1 speakers
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h3kke
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 05:33:36
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Cubase is so darn expensive though
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Fog
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 05:42:42
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rlared
Cubase is so darn expensive though
it all depends on what version you go for.. I don't like the .5 updates though, it just seems to be a way to get more money out of me, on a regular basis. i do like studio one also, but each has good bits and each has bits I don't like.
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denverdrummer
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 06:20:02
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update from 9 to 9.5 is $60. And Gibson/Cake was asking it's loyal users to pay $250, which they discounted to $199, for a subscription which you weren't even sure what the updates were going to be.
Win 10 Pro 64 bit, Dell Inspiron 15, core i7, 16GB RAM, Focusrite Scarlett 18i20, Mackie MR5 Mark 1 speakers
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Rbh
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 06:29:57
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I plan to stick with my current Sonar install until my DAW dies. I believe that there will be a purchaser for Cakewalk at sometime in the future. It is a very mature platform and my main concern would file compatibility and portability. I will slowly keep editing and exporting finished tracks to wave files as they're finished. I've had good luck with Samplitude as well as Mixbuss. I've had a difficult time adapting to Reaper. My hopes are that a seasoned VST company will pick it up. I don't have a lot of faith that MicroSoft will pick it up - but the bigger concern is that they will not stay true to the course if they do.
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kb420
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 06:32:55
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rlared
Basically I'm just wondering if I should keep Sonar Platinum and just not worry about it, or retire it to the grave now and go with another DAW.
Retire it now. The sooner you move over to something else, the better off you'll be. Sooner or later, Windows will do something that will make Sonar unstable, and when that happens, you want to be ready. It will happen eventually. Someone already mentioned Cubase, and I highly recommend it. I also like Studio One 3. You can't go wrong with either. Cubase does seem expensive, but I didn't buy it at full price. I was given a scaled down version for free with my Motif XF, and updated to the full version at a discount. The good thing is, to get the latest full version was only a $60 upgrade, so I now have Cubase 9.5 Pro, and I really like it. It's a rock solid veteran program that can handle just about anything you want to throw at it.
"Now, excuse me while I jump into my Jaguar; I need to board my private jet for the usual weekend trip to my mansion on the Big Island. I think Trixie, Crystal, and Heather are already there...must not keep them waiting in the hot tub!" -Craig Anderton-
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studioaloni
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 09:31:22
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☄ Helpfulby bodhi65 2017/11/23 14:17:35
I've been using cakewalk since the mid nineties, but lately i've been growing unhappy with it. It is still my favorite mixing environment, but editing has fallen behind quite a bit. I've been involved in a few collaborative projects the last couple of years which forced me to get up close and personal with Pro Tools 12 and I must say that, as clunky and inflexible ad it is generally as a working environment, the editing of multitrack audio in it is just so much easier and more intuitive and straight forward; while the rest has gotten steadily better over the last couple of versions, it is no longer near impossible to mix in-box with it. I'm horrified at the thought that I'll have to now transition the studio staff (for all of whom Sonar is home) to another daw, that will suck. But since we already own Pro Tools for collaborative project compatibility reasons, and because it is still mostly the industry standard which will make collaborative projects easier, I'm guessing that's the way we're gonna go. I think the only program which has both Sonar's flexibility and "homey" feel as well as Pro Tools' quick editing and proper track groups editing is probably Logic. But switching to Mac is not an option for us, as apple no longer makes suitable hardware. There is no way to push the RME RayDAT card we use as an interface into any mac that apple currently makes, so that's that. Funny but true - apple is no longer an option for professionals  And after this, there is no way I'm not gonna take a chance on a "small" program to be the backbone of the studio again. How do I know that presonus will not go belly-up and the same thing will not happen with Studio One? So it's either steinberg, which has Yamaha's might behind it, or Pro Tools. I seriously dislike Cubase's interface and heavy-footed approach, so I guess pro tools it is, especially that we already own it...
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ebibault51
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 10:08:21
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☄ Helpfulby bodhi65 2017/11/23 14:20:00
Remember last year (I think), after the big annual Windows update, lots of Cakewalk products were not working anymore. I'm a little bit scared because Microsoft hasn't installed the 2017 Windows Fall update on every PC in Europe (including mine), and maybe SONAR won't work well in a few days... And there is also the activation problem (I plan to change my PC within 2 years).
So I've decided to look at the market and decide which DAW will be mine in the future. But I will certainly wait a few months to see:
- if SONAR still works.
- if Cakewalk or SONAR is sold to someone.
- if there are special crossgrades from other DAW brands.
- if another DAW implements a way to import SONAR files (yes it certainly won't happen, unless someone from Cakewalk gives them the technical information and/or is hired by them).
For the moment, my choice is Cubase. The price is insane (but there is a SONAR crossgrade) and I don't really like the customer policy of Steinberg (with the USB dongle and so), but it's a jewel for people like my that are more MIDI/synth heroes than guitar heroes. And it has the feature that I have always been waiting for in SONAR : the chord assistant (AMAZING).
Craig will choose Studio one, a good choice but Craig certainly plays more guitar than he uses MIDI (I know, in fact, he can do all in the music field ;-) ). He also likes Mixcraft, it seems cheap and efficient, but that's from a quite unknown company and I want something serious and lasting now.
Like Craig, I think it is important too to choose now a crossplatform software. I don't like Apple and won't buy one but consider that it's a big con to use a software that is not available on the Mac, the reference platform for music creation.
The interesting and funny thing when you compare DAWs to SONAR is to look at the new 2017 features. For example, REAPER has strong innovations like VST3 support and FX parameters operations and control grouping... How powerful it is :-D
SONAR Platinum - Intel i5-3570 @ 3,40 GHz, 4 cores - 16 GB RAM - NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660 - Windows 10 (64 bits) - Roland QUAD-CAPTURE (ASIO mode) - Roland JUNO-G - Roland A-300PRO - AKAI MPK mini
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Bassman002
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 10:40:00
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HI:)
I want to go on with Sonar as long it will work. I don't need more functions or Instruments, I'm really happy with it!
I can "Freeze" Windows in my studio, so hopefully it will go on.....
For sure I'm looking which Option for the next DAW ist the best, but it's not easy. the Design of Sonar is the best of all DAWs to work with!!
Perhaps it would be nice to have Studio One or Reaper with Sonar Design:)
Bassman.
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GaryWalker
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 12:22:35
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☄ Helpfulby bodhi65 2017/11/23 14:20:58
Basseman
HI:)
I want to go on with Sonar as long it will work. I don't need more functions or Instruments, I'm really happy with it!
I can "Freeze" Windows in my studio, so hopefully it will go on.....
For sure I'm looking which Option for the next DAW ist the best, but it's not easy. the Design of Sonar is the best of all DAWs to work with!!
Perhaps it would be nice to have Studio One or Reaper with Sonar Design:)
Bassman.
I've started to migrate to Reaper and it's very customizable. I've started playing around with layouts and have a layout which mirrors fairly closely what I have in Sonar. Reaper also has screenset support so you don't really lose anything besides a few Sonar-only plugins and the pro-channel.
Cheers, Gary. Current configuration: Core i3 Laptop / 8GB RAM; Sonar Platinum (replaced with REAPER); Roland Quad Capture interface; Alesis Micron; Roland XP30; Akai Mini MPK; Akai S2000
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Vastman
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 12:39:36
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Cubase 9.5 pro... 325$ crossgrade. Craps on the $200 studio one 3 pro crossgrade I also own. Then again, thats just me...
Dana We make the future... Climate Change MusicVastMaschine:SP4L/W10/i74930K/32GB/RME/CAD E100s; The Orchestra! NOVO!/Inspire/BohemianViolin&Cello, ARK1&2,/MinimalCapriccioMaximoSoto/OE1&2, Action&Emotive/Omni2/Tril/RMX/All OrangeTree/Falcon/APE Jugs/Alpha&Bravo/BFD3 & SD3Gravity/DM307/AEON/DM/Damage/Diva/HZebra/Hive/Diversion/VC4/Serum/Alchemy/blablablaSpitfire/8DIO/SL/KH/EW/NI; Shred1&2/AGF,G,M&T Torch&Res&Ren/GD-6; Ibanez SR1200&SR505NOVAX FanFret Tele&Strat
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aconte22
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 14:47:58
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As a former VP of Sales at Cakewalk for 12 years, and now VP of Sales at Acoustica for the last five years, we would greatly appreciate your kind consideration to take a serious look at Mixcraft 8 Pro Studio. It is maturing with each new version and will surprise many of you. At $179 (on sale this weekend for $99), it includes side-chaining, VST3 and MP4 support, 64-bit and 32-bit, automation and sub-mixing, live recording to performance panel grids and professional video editing. Beautiful pristine sounding VI's emulating Steinway, Moog and many other vintage analog synths, acoustic instruments and orchestral strings. Includes integrated Melodyne Essentials directly into the sound edit tab, and one-click simultaneous publishing to soundcloud, mixcloud, youtube, FB, tumblr and your other music and video sites. Check it out at the Acoustica website.
Please allow me to point out the intangibles. We are a small software-only company focusing on the PC (like the early days of Cakewalk). We have a CTO who came from Sonic Foundry and was part of the senior development team that created Acid and Vegas, which is why you will see that the Loop Library asset management (over 7800 loops and samples with integration of freesound.org into the sound edit tab with instant access to thousands of more free loops) and video editing are far superior than any other DAW on the market today. Mixcraft 8 is for real!
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stxx
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Re: Sonar in its current state vs. the competition
2017/11/23 16:09:46
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Just keep using it! Don;t know why people are so concerned. There are those still using SOnar 8.5 on windows 7. If you're software works today, it will likely work yrs from now as long as it does what you need it too. Frankly, Cakewalk left us with a pretty robust tool. Better than anything else out there, at least for audio recording ( I don't do a ton of midi). If the servers remain up for awhile you shouldn't have an issue either. I know that for me, I had to roll back to 08 version because somewhere between 9 and 10, the performance for me went to **** but 08 did everything I needed and will likely ever need so I will just stay there. The only foreseeable upgrade I may need in the future would be to go to a thunderbolt interface and that is irrelevant to Sonar anyway. What more can we possibly really need in a DAW? Sonar does it all already!
Sonar Platinum, RME UFX, UAD 2, Waves, Soundtoys, Fronteir Alphatrack, X-Touch as Contl Srfc, , Console 1, Sweetwater Creation Station Quad Core Win 8.1, Mackie 824, KRK RP5, AKG 240 MKII, Samson C-Control, Sennheiser, Blue, AKG, RODE, UA, Grace, Focusrite, Audient, Midas, ART Song Portfolio: https://soundcloud.com/allen-lind/sets/oth-short
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