Sonar's Zero Value?

I keep running into this and wondering....

I do my mixes to peak at -0.1 to avoid overs... But Red Book Audio seems to dispute the value... In Redbook programs I often find I get "overs" while in sonar they are -0.1 and I read that as...

Red Book sees over-0.1 as zero while Sonar see's it as Less than zero... (Did I say that right? ;-)) so peaks that are -0.1 are fine, while anything over -0.1 but not quite zero are the debate....

Is this so? Why is this? ...or what am I reading wrong???

Keni

Your not seeing inner sample peaks, that's why its clipping in other programs

-0.1 is too high. -0.3 is a good starting point and you should oversampled it by 2 or 4 to prevent inner sample peaks. you should also get something to detect inner sample peaks

Thanks Guys...

I do remember reading about inner sample peaks... That was a while ago... and that would easily explain it.

I will see if I have something that detects inner sample peaks and check it out...

I guess I've been lucky as all the projects I've been doing all these years have been done to Sonar's -0.1... so I'm guessing there's a bit of distortion going on in those mixes... <sigh>...

It was so much easier reading meters for tape/analog! ;-)

BTW... CJ... I'm not sure what you're referring to "you should oversampled it by 2 or 4"... Can I control oversampling in Sonar?

Berklee, eh? I'll bet you're enjoying that Josh! (I'm a Berklee Alumni myself, but they didn't offer such courses when I was there ('70-'71)


Keni

BTW... CJ... I'm not sure what you're referring to "you should oversampled it by 2 or 4"... Can I control oversampling in Sonar?

Sorry, I should have been more clear. You can oversampled times 2 or by times 4 (X's 2 or X's 4) and no you cant do that in sonar. You need a plugin that can do that.
Wait.. The TL 64 can oversampled your mix when you enable it to do so. I dont know if its X's 2 or X's 4 though, but that plugin has oversampling in it, if you want your audio to be processed through it.
Cj

JoshWolfer


Keni, 

Yeah, the class is awesome ;) I'm loving every bit of it. 

A free plugin you can use is Bitter:

http://blingmyzik.blogspot.com/2008/02/free-bitter-vst.html

I personally just view it in iZotope Ozone which will also show it to you, but that costs money.

Cheers,

Thanks Josh...

I found Bitter yesterday after our chat.... I guess I'm doing ok as I don't see any innersample overs at all... I'll have to go back and look at some of my older work (just out of curiosity)...

I don't normally get overs in other programs, but I noticed that when I'm preparing to burn my cd's (I use CD Architect), all is well, but as soon as I insert ANY plugin, I've got overs even with all plugin controls at zero.... ???

I'll bet the Berklee class is cool... I loved the attitude of all their classes when I was there.... Have Fun!

Keni

bitflipper


Actually, even -0.3db is pushing the envelope. To guarantee no intersample clipping, you technically need to leave 3db of headroom. However, you don't need to be that conservative as long as you're using a brickwall limiter that calculates intersample values (for me, Ozone serves that function).

Thanks BF...

Always good to learn more... tho according to the meter I'm using (Bitter) I'm not getting any overs....

I mix lightly to my peak level... I don't typically use any limiting on the mix buss tho there are occasions... On a typical mix, even the few peaks that reach my usual -0.1 are few... Maybe that's been saving me? I've been leaving as much natural dynamics as my mix allows...

Keni

OZONE ROCKS!!!