KyRo
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Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
Would there be any disadvantages or potential problems in routing your projects' audio files to subfolders within the main "Audio" folder?
That is, having the audio save within:
C:\Cakewalk Projects\Audio\Project Name
Instead of:
C:\Cakewalk Projects\Project Name\Audio
I'm just thinking that this method might make things even tidier than the standard per-project folder routing, in that all of your audio files would be held within one main folder (while still being organized into their own per-project subfolders), and all of your project files would be right there in C:\Cakewalk Projects ready to open with one clicking action.
Does anyone see anything risky or problematic with this approach?
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noynekker
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/16 20:45:56
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Hopefully you have a backup plan to another drive, because if and when your C:\ system drive fails, projects may be hard to recover. I've always though the best advice was to keep the project files on some sort of data drive.
The only other issue with doing it this way as you suggest is that you are bypassing the Cakewalk per-project feature by doing this. If you ever need to streamline the audio files in a project, and you "save as" to another folder, there will always remain some remnants of the un-used audio files in that other folder, and it will be harder to manage which audio files are in use or not ?
If you don't use the pre-project feature, doesn't Sonar automatically put all new audio files in a folder something like C:\Cakewalk Projects\Audio ?
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dwardzala
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/16 21:38:23
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It would make archiving the entire project more difficult. You would also end up with a Projects directory full of many different files, especially if you save as a lot. Do you open files from the windows browser instead of inside Sonar?
post edited by dwardzala - 2015/07/16 21:47:13
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KPerry
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/17 02:15:59
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That's what I do - I also (at the expense of slightly more tedious archiving, as noted) put audio on one drive and the cwp on another. At least then if a drive dies, I have half the data available to reconstruct the project (not that that excuses anyone from doing backups!).
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Cactus Music
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/17 02:36:46
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To me that's a dumb idea. I am always moving projects and albums between computers and back up drives. That method would be a sure fire way of disconnecting data. Keep the audio in the project containment folder. That way you can move, copy, back up that song. Each project in a folder with everything that is to do with that project. I not only keep the CWP and audio files, I keep other files like lyrics, MP3's, rough recordings from handy recorder and a midi file as well. A midi file is super important because it can be used by any daw now and in the future. It also can represent a lot of your work on certain songs.
post edited by Cactus Music - 2015/07/17 02:44:22
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Kev999
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/17 02:57:17
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Cactus Music
To me that's a dumb idea. I am always moving projects and albums between computers and back up drives. That method would be a sure fire way of disconnecting data.
Keep the audio in the project containment folder.
That way you can move, copy, back up that song.
Each project in a folder with everything that is to do with that project.
I completely agree. I often copy projects back and forth between 3 computers via a flash drive or portable HDD. One project per folder is certainly the best system.
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KyRo
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/17 04:16:48
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noynekker
The only other issue with doing it this way as you suggest is that you are bypassing the Cakewalk per-project feature by doing this.
Not entirely. The audio files would still be saved in per-project folders, just in a directory other than the default. noynekker
If you don't use the pre-project feature, doesn't Sonar automatically put all new audio files in a folder something like C:\Cakewalk Projects\Audio ?
Yes. But again, I wouldn't be abandoning the per-project functionality, just re-routing the location of the folder. I've already tested it with a dummy project, and newly recorded audio goes right into the project's specified audio folder, regardless of its new location. (That's why we have the option to specify the target folder, no?) dwardzala
It would make archiving the entire project more difficult.
Only in the sense that I'd have to gather the project files and project audio from two different folders instead of one. (Or...?) dwardzala
You would also end up with a Projects directory full of many different files, especially if you save as a lot.
This is a very good point, one I hadn't considered, and probably the leading argument against doing this method. It would leave me with a bunch of auto-saves and file versions in the main Cakewalk Projects folder, wouldn't it? Hmmm... dwardzala
Do you open files from the windows browser instead of inside Sonar?
I use both. If I've already got Sonar open, I'll use it. But if I haven't opened it yet and want to get right into a specific project, I may use Win Explorer. Cactus Music
To me that's a dumb idea.
Hey, I'm just brainstorming here. Cut me some slack  My main drive for considering doing it this way was for appearance and streamlining. Rather than having a few Sonar folders ("Audio", "Audio Data", "Picture Cache") mixed in with a bunch of other folders with song names (as the standard per-project method would create), having JUST the project files with their icons lending a visual queue to make them more discernable from the CW folders seems more attractive to me. And the fact that (if using Win Explorer) you could open them with one clicking action rather than having to navigate through another folder first would also be convenient. But if, as a consequence, this way of doing things would also leave me with a bunch of auto-saves and versioning files from different projects all mixed together, then I would concede that the idea begins to lose some of its luster.
post edited by dimelives1 - 2015/07/17 04:37:35
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...wicked
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/17 05:26:34
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This is actually exactly how I have my audio folder setup. It does make keeping the folder clean by doing the "Save As" trick a little more complicated, but to me it just seems so obvious to do it that way. I keep my project files on another drive anyway but being able to scroll through all the project files in one directory and all the audio files for those projects in another just works better for me.
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/17 05:34:40
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KPerry
That's what I do - I also (at the expense of slightly more tedious archiving, as noted) put audio on one drive and the cwp on another. At least then if a drive dies, I have half the data available to reconstruct the project (not that that excuses anyone from doing backups!).
At the same time you are doubling the risk of hard drive failure, so you don't really gain anything. As you say, making regular backups is the only way to be sure. It would take a VERY compelling argument to get me to move away from Per Project folders
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OldTimerNewComer
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/17 06:53:01
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Bristol_Jonesey
KPerry
That's what I do - I also (at the expense of slightly more tedious archiving, as noted) put audio on one drive and the cwp on another. At least then if a drive dies, I have half the data available to reconstruct the project (not that that excuses anyone from doing backups!).
At the same time you are doubling the risk of hard drive failure, so you don't really gain anything.
As you say, making regular backups is the only way to be sure.
It would take a VERY compelling argument to get me to move away from Per Project folders
Hello. Forgive my ignorance, but please explain; How would keeping cwp's and audio on separate drives increase the potential of hard drive failure? Mel
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/17 08:22:26
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Because you have 2 hard drives, not 1.
If the chance of 1 failing is 1%................................
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Cactus Music
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/18 11:39:10
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☄ Helpfulby dimelives1 2015/07/18 23:08:56
I guess for me this goes way back to the days of working in an administrative office. I was the "boy" and one of my jobs was filing stuff. That was the railway but I'll use a Dentist office as example.
A computers "file" system can be thought of just like a real filing system.
A Hard drive is the Cabinet and there are drawers and folders.
In a dentist office you would never put the patient files in a seperate cabinet or drawer.
Everything to do with that patient would always be in their folder.
And because most everyone uses a second Data drive which these days can hold a lifetimes worth of project files, it's not something one should have to worry or fuss about "making room" or worrying about size of projects anymore.
My Data drive is for DAW storage only so the folders are at the top of the tree. In otherwords all the drawers are visable when you open this drive.
Each Drawer is for storing the different things and a drawer for each sub catagory of Sonar projects. I always add the date so when I drag and drop to other drivees it is clear how up to date the back up is. Rough example:
1: Backing Tracks July 5 2015
2: Client Joe April 2 2015
3: Client Mary Jan 2015
4: Originals Apr 2014
5: Song Ideas
6: Original Masters
7: Original MP3
8: Joes Masters and MP3
9: Marys Masters and MP3
Inside Client Joe's folder you will find a folder for each of his Songs. In each of those folders is the following:
Audio folder
Mix Scenes folder ( new)
CWP file
MIDI file
Lyrics Doc
MP3 of covers version or rough recording if original.
After a session with Joe, I drag and drop the whole Client Joe folder to my 3rd data drive and give it the new date. There will be a couple of the same Client Joe folders with older dates too. I don't toss anything out until Joe is a done deal.
Every once in a while I will also copy the latest Client Joe folder to an external drive. That drive goes with me and those files are also then copied to another computer 300 miles away.
So anyway's using your method would be a mess for me because it would meen double the work.
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Kev999
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/19 04:59:17
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Cactus Music
...In each of those folders is the following:
Audio folder
Mix Scenes folder ( new)
CWP file
MIDI file
Lyrics Doc
MP3 of covers version or rough recording if original.
I often create a another sub-folder to store plugins' settings that I have used within the project. Some people might prefer to store them in each plugin's own folders, but that entails to risk of them getting overwritten or deleted when you update or reinstall the software. Many plugins don't seem to have an obvious place for saving settings anyway. Whenever I want to re-use some (non-default) fx or softsynth setting that I previously used in a particular project, I know where to find it.
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Cactus Music
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/19 10:42:36
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I never though of that one, good tip.
You just gave me an idea about custom samples.
Client Joe wanted a railroad spike for his version of 16 Tons. So we made our our sample and stored it in the Session drummer folder. I built a new DAW and that sound was missing so I had to fire up the old DAW to dig it out.
I should keep a copy of that sample with that song.
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Kev999
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/19 16:38:50
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Cactus Music
...we made our our sample and stored it in the Session drummer folder. I built a new DAW and that sound was missing so I had to fire up the old DAW to dig it out.
I should keep a copy of that sample with that song.
If you used an audio sample in a project, there will be a copy of it in the project's Audio folder. If I ever make any samples or sfz files for future use, I keep them with the DimPro multisamples or Battery kits, which are on a separate drive.
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robert_e_bone
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/19 18:31:50
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I do a couple things with any custom synth presets I may create for a given project:
1. I save any custom synth or effects preset with the project name as part of the preset name, as it is particular to that project, and it is saved to a Presets folder that I create, if needed, within the Project folder, so that this preset will always be able to be found, as long as the Project folder exists.
2. If I think the custom preset may be usable for other projects in general, I may also save it to the normal folder most synths/effects have for User Presets. This makes it safe for another project to tweak it with no danger of accidentally destructively altering a preset needed for the original project it was created for.
I also am wondering why you would choose to go through the work to create these Audio folders within the global audio folder, or wherever it is, rather than keeping the audio within the default Audio folder that is created within each project's folder in Cakewalk Projects. A 2 TB drive is less than $100 these days, and has plenty of room for storing backup folders of all of the projects, and just following the defaults - backups are as easy as copying each project folder to the backup drive, etc...
Bob Bone
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KyRo
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/20 03:53:03
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robert_e_bone
I also am wondering why you would choose to go through the work to create these Audio folders within the global audio folder, or wherever it is, rather than keeping the audio within the default Audio folder that is created within each project's folder in Cakewalk Projects.
Bob, My main reason for mulling over the idea was that this:  ...seemed more distinguishable and attractive than this:  Notice in the second example (using the default per-project destinations) how the "Audio", "Audio Data", and "Picture Cache" folders are all mixed up amongst the project folders, rather than clearly separated and discernible like in the first example (my proposed method). But again, one thing I hadn't considered was auto-save and versioning copies of the all of the .cwp files, which would make my example not so pretty anymore. So, given that (along with other good reasons that folks here have mentioned), I've conceded that it would be wise to just go along with the typical per-project functionality, and maybe get around my aforementioned qualm^ by just saving all project folders into a "Projects" subfolder of sorts within "Cakewalk Projects". PS: Don't mind the project names in the pictures. They're just blank dummy files given random song names for this discussion. No copyright infringement here! 
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robert_e_bone
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/20 06:04:02
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You CAN move Picture Cache and Global Audio Folder to a different location, by the way. You can give them each a new location in Preferences>File>Audio Data. Just go here, and specify a new location for either or both. I chose to put them both under Cakewalk Content, but it is entirely up to you.
Maybe that would have you feeling better when you look through the Cakewalk Projects folder.
Bob Bone
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KyRo
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Re: Storing audio files in subfolders of the main "Audio" folder...
2015/07/20 16:19:26
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robert_e_bone
You CAN move Picture Cache and Global Audio Folder to a different location, by the way. You can give them each a new location in Preferences>File>Audio Data. Just go here, and specify a new location for either or both. I chose to put them both under Cakewalk Content, but it is entirely up to you.
Maybe that would have you feeling better when you look through the Cakewalk Projects folder.
Bob Bone
What about the default "Audio" folder (the one that's used if you're not using per-project folders)? Can that be moved, deleted, or hidden without causing any problems?
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