kakku
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Strange taste...
I have a probably rare problem (actually I have several). I have many soft synths but I find it really hard to find many artificial or 'synth'sounds that would please me. Also I have a smaller problem regarding finding pleasing natural sounds. I have NI's FM8, Waldorf Largo, Arturia's Sem V and the Analog experience Player 25, Halion Sonic 1 and probably hundreds of free synths. Still I end up using the same couple of synths and not many different sounds. I have tried to get quality synths but not with very good results. I find most sounds simply unusable, strange noises. Now I would like to hear if I have any 'fellow sufferers' or am I an 'unique freak'. Also I would like to hear if there are people here that have used synths I mentioned and are very pleased. Even better would be if I could hear songs made with them. I forgot the name of an orchestral sampler which I like. What would be even better is if you could come up with ideas that would free me from this 'curse'. kakku
post edited by kakku - 2014/11/17 10:14:06
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Wookiee
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Re: Strange taste...
2014/11/14 13:37:15
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Finding sounds can be a tiresome affair and frequently though both hardware and soft synths come with hundreds and sometimes thousands to choose from it can give one a significant head ache. There are a number of things to consider though, am I using this sound on its own or as part of a mix of other sounds, could I layer two different synth sounds to achieve the sound I am hearing in my furry head. Could I start with this sound and tweak it or add or change the FX to make that sound that is sitting on the edge of my mind. One of the main things with using modern soft synths is that most of them are infinity tweak-able, which is all part of the fun. One other thought that I learnt when reading an article on programming synths. Virtually every patch on a synths is designed to sound fantastic on its own which usually means it will not work in a mix. I only have one of the synths you mention above which I have as part of Arturia's V Collection that being the SEM V (Please note that this is not a shameless plug this is an example, (Honest)) Which if you follow the link you will hear a tune written by my studio companion entirely using just five instances of Arturia's SEM V. All the sounds other than the spoken bit were created by taking a basic patch and then tweaking it until I heard the sound I wanted.
Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain. Karma has a way of finding its own way home.
Primary, i7 8700K 16Gigs Ram, 3x500gb SSD's 2TB Backup HHD Saffire Pro 40. Win 10 64Bit Secondary i7 4790K, 32GB Ram, 500Gb SSD OS/Prog's, 1TB Audio, 1TB Samples HHD AudioBox USB, Win 10 64Bit CbB, Adam's A7x's - Event 20/20's, Arturia V6, Korg Digital Legacy, Softube Modular, Arturia Keylab-88, USB-MidiSport 8x8
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kakku
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Re: Strange taste...
2014/11/14 14:15:46
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Thank you Wookiee for your long and good advice. I have tried tweaking the sounds but I have not benefited from doing that but maybe I should just try harder. But one problem is that there are so many sounds and I usually do not find any new sounds that I like enough to start fiddling around. But maybe I just need to make new sound explorings with the synths I got. Atm though that is bit difficult as I don't have access to my main computer where lies the majority of my bought synths. The song example was a very nice retro piece. kakku
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sharke
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Re: Strange taste...
2014/11/14 14:51:15
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Are you going by the presets these synths come with, or do you find it hard to make pleasing sounds yourself on these synths? FM8, for instance, is an incredible sounding synth (if you're into FM type sounds), but I've never been impressed by the presets. Once you learn the ins and outs of FM synthesis it's a fantastic piece of kit.
JamesWindows 10, Sonar SPlat (64-bit), Intel i7-4930K, 32GB RAM, RME Babyface, AKAI MPK Mini, Roland A-800 Pro, Focusrite VRM Box, Komplete 10 Ultimate, 2012 American Telecaster!
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Rain
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Re: Strange taste...
2014/11/14 15:56:34
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A lot of developers feel the need to make their sound as big and impressive as possible on their own, so much that it's practically impossible to integrate them in the context of a piece of music. They exaggerate things a bit. Those presets are drenched in reverb and chorus and such, and some of them are so over the top that they'll clip your inputs with a single note (hello Cakewalk's Zeta). Then there's also the other demo factor - in order to demonstrate all that you can do with their synths, developers will often include some extreme settings as exemples. If memory serves me well, Arturia tend to include many of those more extreme presets which pertain more to texture and effects than music. And that's understandable because people use synths for sound design too. The funny thing is that synths which aren't drenched in effects are often criticized by people for sounding "sterile", yet they work incredibly well in context (Logic's ES-2 is a fine example of that) and can be as impressive as the next guy if you start cheating and adding tons of effect. I do think that most any of the synths you mention are capable of generating great results. Personally, I tend to stick to the same set of synths, and since I'm still quite green at programming them, I start w/ presets and work my way up from there. The first things I do is usually to turn off or at the very least cut back on the effects.
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kakku
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Re: Strange taste...
2014/11/14 16:24:04
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Thank you guys for the comments and ideas. I tend to check out the presets and then if I find something I like I often tweak it a little. I never do any sound creation. I know I probably should but it is so difficult I never do. I also usually switch off the effects on the synths and instead use DAW's fx.
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slartabartfast
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Re: Strange taste...
2014/11/14 18:16:03
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Good advice so far. Tweaking the presets is often a very useful exercise, and as has been indicated by others here, your first tweak should usually be to find where the "effects" are and kill them. A synth preset that has been designed to solo in a live performance, and especially to demo a keyboard, is likely to have a thick pile of effect feces obscuring the basic sound. Something that works by itself with bouncing stereo fields or science fiction inspired half octave tremolo, is not usually what you want. Combining several sounds placed in different locations by manipulating the synthetic stereo field and reverb typically results in a confusing cacophony of uncontrolled echoes. You can set the location better by using the effects in your DAW on relatively dry synth sounds. On the other hand, trying to get a synth to sound like your favorite wood and string analogue instrument is probably a waste of your time. Hire a performer, or use an expensive sample library--which has its own problems.
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dubdisciple
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Re: Strange taste...
2014/11/14 18:28:39
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Finding the right synth is a challenge. As others have said, presets heard in a vacum can be misleading for two reasons. One being that they can be useless when placed in a mix. Two, some of the best synths come with crappy presets. Z3ta is a powerful synth but the presets are mostly trance. For instrument sounds, I find that sampletank sounds are somewhat thin on their own but fit better in mixes than most of what he own. I think the degree you are willing to rol your own goes a long way to synth satisfaction. At the very least you have to be comfortable doing massive tweaking
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SteveStrummerUK
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Re: Strange taste...
2014/11/14 20:10:28
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☄ Helpfulby bapu 2014/11/15 13:31:10
I once bought myself an electronic organ. It was useless, everything I played on it sounded like Beethoven or Wagner.... I think it must have been a Nazi synthesizer.
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kakku
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Re: Strange taste...
2014/11/15 10:10:06
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Thank you guys for your helpful comments. It seems clear to me now that I have approached the synths I have with a wrong attitude. I have looked for easy and ready to use sound banks. Instead I should be prepared to really dig in deep into the insides of the complex sound engines. That may be too time taking for me though but I will try to spend at least a bit more time with my synths. kakku
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sharke
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Re: Strange taste...
2014/11/15 11:09:44
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Get yourself a subscription to Groove3 and watch some synth courses. I know there's an excellent one for FM8 but there may be some for some other synths you own too. They'll really open your eyes as to the possibilities. I find synth manuals very hard to read because they're so dry, technical and unmusical, but with the Groove3 courses I've become quite confident in making my own sounds from scratch.
JamesWindows 10, Sonar SPlat (64-bit), Intel i7-4930K, 32GB RAM, RME Babyface, AKAI MPK Mini, Roland A-800 Pro, Focusrite VRM Box, Komplete 10 Ultimate, 2012 American Telecaster!
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kakku
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Re: Strange taste...
2014/11/15 11:49:39
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Thank you sharke for your good tip. Unfortunately atm I don't have a credit card. So Groove3 will be inaccessible for me. Maybe I'll get one later though. kakku
post edited by kakku - 2014/11/15 13:21:34
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Wookiee
Rrrrugh arah-ah-woof?
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Re: Strange taste...
2014/11/15 13:19:11
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Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain. Karma has a way of finding its own way home.
Primary, i7 8700K 16Gigs Ram, 3x500gb SSD's 2TB Backup HHD Saffire Pro 40. Win 10 64Bit Secondary i7 4790K, 32GB Ram, 500Gb SSD OS/Prog's, 1TB Audio, 1TB Samples HHD AudioBox USB, Win 10 64Bit CbB, Adam's A7x's - Event 20/20's, Arturia V6, Korg Digital Legacy, Softube Modular, Arturia Keylab-88, USB-MidiSport 8x8
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kakku
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Re: Strange taste...
2014/11/15 13:39:09
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Thank you Wookiee for the helpful links, I will take a look if they can morph me into a synth guru or at least a bit wiser synth wise. kakku
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