Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW)

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icontakt
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March 01, 14 7:08 AM (permalink)

Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW)

There are a few scenarios in which Sonar leaves an empty take lane or lanes without your knowledge (if you normally work with lanes collapsed). The below test shows one of them.
 
1. Create a new project.
2. Drag a long, audio or MIDI file (more than 7 bar-long in this test) from the Browser into the Track view's Clips pane, at the start of bar 1. (Let's use an audio file called "DBD_175_A_MUSIC_LP5" in Audio Library->Loops->Loopmasters->BREAKS DRUM N BASS->DANNY BYRD)
3. Hold CTRL and drag the clip to the start of the next bar (to make the clips overlapped). Repeat this 4 times.
4. Click the Expand/Collapse Take Lanes button in the track header to expand the lanes. Your Track view should now look like this:

 
5. Hit CTRL+Z (undo) until you see only the original clip.
 
[Expected Result]
Lanes 2-6 (T2-T6) are automatically deleted by the undo's.
 
[Actual Result]
Lanes 2-6 are still there, wasting precious screen space, like this:

 
 
Issue #: CWBRN-23897
Reported on Feb 4, 2014
Confirmed and submitted to development on Feb 5, 2014
 
 
 

Tak T.
 
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    Anderton
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    Re: Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW) March 01, 14 3:42 PM (permalink)
    I'm not sure deleting the lanes would be the expected result. If you delete clips in a track, the track remains. Take Lanes, which have much in common with tracks, probably follow the same protocol so that's how I would expect them to react. Whether that's the most desirable way to react is a different matter.
     
    I believe that implementing what you want would require that Take Lanes have a different underlying architecture compared to Tracks. You wouldn't want tracks to go away if you deleted all the clips within it, as you may have FX bin and ProChannel settings you want to retain as you overdub a new clip. However Take Lanes don't have FX bins and ProChannel settings, so if you deleted the Lane with the clips, the only characteristic you would lose is the solo/mute/record status - which would be irrelevant anyway.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #2
    icontakt
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    Re: Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW) March 01, 14 5:24 PM (permalink)
    Craig, it's not delete I performed in the above steps. It's undo. Undo means to cancel the previous action, no?

    Tak T.
     
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    #3
    Splat
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    Re: Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW) March 01, 14 6:51 PM (permalink)
    Can repro. Yup undo isn't fully undo'ing...

    Sell by date at 9000 posts. Do not feed.
    @48/24 & 128 buffers latency is 367 with offset of 38.

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    Anderton
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    Re: Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW) March 02, 14 3:45 AM (permalink)
    Jlien X
    Craig, it's not delete I performed in the above steps. It's undo. Undo means to cancel the previous action, no?

     
    Ah, now I see what you're saying. I'm reading through things fast because I'm deleting zillions of spam messages and it has me pretty frazzled.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #5
    azslow3
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    Re: Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW) March 02, 14 4:37 AM (permalink)
    It looks like SONAR remembers the number of lanes even when the track itself is "Undone":
    Drag some audio to empty space, so new track is created. Than the same as in the original
    example (several lanes). Than "Undo" the whole procedure, till the track is removed.
    Then "Redo": the new track is created again with many empty lanes.
    But common, killing lane is on click action

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    #6
    Splat
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    Re: Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW) March 19, 14 11:04 AM (permalink)
    According to Jlien X not fixed in X3E.

    Sell by date at 9000 posts. Do not feed.
    @48/24 & 128 buffers latency is 367 with offset of 38.

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    cowboydan
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    Re: Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW) March 19, 14 11:16 AM (permalink)
    Jlien X
    There are a few scenarios in which Sonar leaves an empty take lane or lanes without your knowledge (if you normally work with lanes collapsed). The below test shows one of them.
     
    1. Create a new project.
    2. Drag a long, audio or MIDI file (more than 7 bar-long in this test) from the Browser into the Track view's Clips pane, at the start of bar 1. (Let's use an audio file called "DBD_175_A_MUSIC_LP5" in Audio Library->Loops->Loopmasters->BREAKS DRUM N BASS->DANNY BYRD)
    3. Hold CTRL and drag the clip to the start of the next bar (to make the clips overlapped). Repeat this 4 times.
    4. Click the Expand/Collapse Take Lanes button in the track header to expand the lanes. Your Track view should now look like this:

     
    5. Hit CTRL+Z (undo) until you see only the original clip.
     
    [Expected Result]
    Lanes 2-6 (T2-T6) are automatically deleted by the undo's.
     
    [Actual Result]
    Lanes 2-6 are still there, wasting precious screen space, like this:

     
     
    Issue #: CWBRN-23897
    Reported on Feb 4, 2014
    Confirmed and submitted to development on Feb 5, 2014
     
     
     


    What I fins strange is that you have 6 take lanes with track info and you move every track up 1 bar then the undo Ctrl+Z should just undo the 1 bar move and not delete the whole track.
    #8
    icontakt
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    Re: Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW) March 19, 14 11:45 AM (permalink)
    Well, I didn't "move" the clips, I duplicated them from the original clip, that's why the undo made the clips disappear. The issue here is that the lanes are still displayed, and you have to manually delete them (one by one or by using the "Remove empty lanes" command). I wish Take Lanes had an auto-empty-lane-removal feature.

    Tak T.
     
    Primary Laptop: Core i7-4710MQ CPU, 16GB RAM, 7200RPM HDD, Windows 7 Home Premium OS (Japanese) x64 SP1
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    #9
    stevec
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    Re: Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW) March 19, 14 2:54 PM (permalink)
    Jlien X
    I wish Take Lanes had an auto-empty-lane-removal feature.


    Close...
    http://www.cakewalk.com/Documentation/default.aspx?Doc=SONAR%20X3&Lang=EN&Req=Arranging.49.html
     

    SteveC
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    #10
    icontakt
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    Re: Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW) March 20, 14 8:08 AM (permalink)
    It would be great if, after loop-recording many takes, you lasso-select the overlapping clips and apply "Bounce to Clips" and then all the unnecessary lanes get automatically removed from the track. Well, that wouldn't be even necessary if Sonar had an auto clip merge recording mode...

    Tak T.
     
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    stevec
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    Re: Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW) March 20, 14 9:24 PM (permalink)
    Well, at least it's only one right and one left mouse click to accomplish the desired end result.  
     

    SteveC
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    #12
    icontakt
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    Re: Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW) March 20, 14 9:36 PM (permalink)
    Of course, but doing that in many tracks is a bit of a hassle. I think I want a shortcut key for the Remove Empty Take Lanes command...

    Tak T.
     
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    #13
    neirbod
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    Re: Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW) March 21, 14 10:13 AM (permalink)
    Jlien X
    Of course, but doing that in many tracks is a bit of a hassle. I think I want a shortcut key for the Remove Empty Take Lanes command...




    A shortcut key option would be nice.  I tried to set one up and found it is not listed in the set of assignable commands.  This would be a nice (and presumably easy) feature request.

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    #14
    icontakt
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    Re: Take Lanes: Undoing clip overlapping leaves empty lanes (Confirmed by CW) March 21, 14 10:24 AM (permalink)
    Yes, I'm planning to submit it. I'll try the auto lane removal feature as well. 

    Tak T.
     
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