Tascam US-4x4

Hi all
 
Regarding the the Focusrite vs Tascam debate that is going on (mainly in my head I'll admit) - the biggest problem that I've read about is some negativity regarding the driver quality on the Tascam units. I read recently on a post here from Craig that Tascam will be developing their drivers in house - which is welcome news. Does anyone know how this is progressing or indeed if there ever was a problem with drivers on the new Tascam US units? Still can't decide really between the 6i6 or the US-4x4 - except that I don't really need six inputs - 4 would be plenty. I want to go for the Tascam but the Focusrite stuff just seems more 'proven' if you see what I mean?

I really don't want to make the wrong choice. Both are similarly priced. 
 
YC

I use the US-4x4 primarily because of the mic pres, which I tested and are excellent, and it having 5-pin MIDI DIN I/O. I also use the US-2x2 on the road. I've had no problem with the drivers since the 1.01 version was released (version 1.0 had an issue with crackling under heavy VSTi loads independent of crackling caused by too low a latency setting).
 
One person here had a problem where he could not play back through SONAR and play back through Windows sound devices without closing one and waiting before opening the other. However, I could not replicate; in fact I could get SONAR and any combination of Windows devices playing back simultaneously by disabling the computer's onboard audio drivers and enabling only the TASCAM drivers. If I left the onboard drivers enabled, I had the same problem. In the thread, TASCAM did they said they had found an issue and were doing a fix. I don't know whether it will fix that user's problem or not.
 
Overall I have been extremely pleased with the quality and stability of the US-4x4. However, you can't go wrong with Focusrite either. Note that neither provides ADAT I/O, you'll need to look elsewhere. [Edit: I had previously said the 6i6 didn't have SPDIF, but the "N/A" on the specs page for digital I/O meant details weren't available, not that SPDIF isn't available.]

I have the 6i6 and yes it's a great unit. The 6 inputs are
2x XLR multi 
2X TRS line/Intrument
1X  SPDIF stereo  
MIDI in / out
This configuration is perfect for my set up and this is what you need to also consider. To many people buy interfaces and don't really think about how they will use it. 
If you are going to need 4 mike pre amps then the Tascam is worth a look. Here's my blurb on features to look for. 
http://www.cactusmusic.ca/Articles/Johns%20Audio%20Interface%20blurb.rtf
 
So make a list of the features you find important. One guy here started a spread sheet to compare features. 
 
I have a Yamaha digital mixer so SPDIF is a must. I also have a Joe Meek pre amp and  TC Bass pre amp so I need the line inputs. Focusrite pre amps are good but my guess is the Tascam pre amps are something I'd like better.
I also have a Tascam us1641. I had to ditch it because of the driver performance, otherwise I'd still be using it.  Another member was having issues with a us1800 and so I ran a loop back test on mine. It was off by around 800 ms 
I then tested my Scarlett and it's timing was right on. A looback test is worth it for all DAW users. 
Read this thread for details. 
 
http://forum.cakewalk.com/Think-its-time-to-give-up-on-my-Tascam-US-1800-m3163904.aspx
 
I know these are old interfaces but the drivers were just released in December. So your right to be concerned about the drivers and I have asked if any owners of the new Tascam's could run the loop back test and see if this is resolved. I like Tascam gear and am hoping they do get the driver issue sorted. I think it's getting there. 
And the small amount of offset would go unnoticed by most people. But it's enough to drive me bonkers when trying to overdub bass for example. Ever note you play would be printed 400 samples early. The us1800 guy was getting 2,000 samples. And buffer size makes no difference. This is the driver reporting to Sonar. 

You don't have to open it to use the interface and the only time I do open it would be to change my buffer settings. Because I use either my Yamaha mixer or a Mackie Mix 8  for headphone cue mixes I don't actually use the software. anymore.
 Just like your guessing, I found it tricky and a steep learning curve to delve in deep. I do know exactly what to do with it now and it's powerful,  but it took a few hours of reading and fussing.
 I am a hardware person when it comes to level controls anyhow. I work with clients who need reverb in the headphones while tracking. Even though the Mix control could do this,  and I have the option of 6 different headphone mixes,  I get faster results with the Mix 8 sitting there ( $80) and I use a Lexicon MX200 for headphone effects. The mix control doesn't have DSP effects and that leaves you with toggling input echo and using the tracks effect send. 
This results in a digital delay of 20 - 40 ms on my system depending on buffer setting. 
 
But I think if you were recording a band the mix control would be excellent. 
 
Focusrite is one of the few interfaces that does not include a LE DAW. Instead they give you a few plug ins , I forget what they are called and when I tried them Sonar froze up on me so I never did do any thing with them. I'm not very patient with things that don't work the first time.. I've got lots of plug ins. 
 

dfreeborg
I've just received a Tascam US-2x2 and it seems to work ok on my Yoga 13.  I also have a Roland Quad Capture that I can run decent sized projects in at 44.1/64 samples for an RTL of less than 8 msec. What I don't get is that the Tascam seems to struggle to do 64 samples and even if it does it's RTL is a little more than 11 msec. The next setting up from 64 is 128 and then it's in the 20+ msec range and that's borderline useless for real time monitoring.
 
Does this unit really do quad buffers on the output? It doesn't show any on the input side ie:64 is 64. This just seems like an odd implementation. Is there any hope that they will eventually be able to reduce the output buffers? Are you able to use the 4x4/2x2 for guitar sims Craig?

I've measured RTL of 13.5 ms latency at 128 samples with the US-4x4. That's acceptable to me, I spent many years standing 10-20 feet in front of a guitar amp onstage so I guess it's in my DNA.  256 samples gives 21 ms RTL.
 
But I did disable all other audio drivers, especially the "HD Audio" drivers from the ATI graphics card, to get the best performance out of the TASCAM drivers. I can run 64 samples early on in projects, but not after throwing on a some soft synths and such. If I really want low latency, there's always 96 kHz. 
 

Thanks for the responses. I have disabled the other audio drivers and I understand that the yoga isn't a powerhouse. What I'm after is the "studio in a box" concept of just laptop, mobile interface and software. The Roland quad actually works pretty well for this purpose. I liked the Tascam due to the iPad compatibility. All in all its a nice piece but there must be some hardware differences in something like the babyface for it to do away with the hidden buffers. There's too much voodoo in this part of the industry in my opinion. Now Steinberg has  "Asio guard 2" whatever the hell that is -enough already just give us the performance we need. I've been doing this for so long, (cakewalk registered user #32-really, and I read your Drumulator manual cover to cover) that I'm both amazed at what's possible, but also frustrated that these problems persist. For me it's just a hobby, but a passionate one.

That all to funny as I was just reading a thread from 2008 where the op was pizzed that modern interfaces were still way behind in latency issues. 
 I don't think Mac owners run into near as many issues. We choose PC and put up with it.  
Apparently writing drivers for Windows is not much fun. The nerds writing the code cheat and use regurgitated code. 
And just when they almost perfect them, Windows changes and everyone starts all over again..