Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs

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mattplaysguitar
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2011/08/20 04:13:08 (permalink)

Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs

So I am currently in the process of writing an album. I plan make this album flow and all sound like it is all from the same person, in the same studio etc. Each song I feel is quite different, so I want to bring them back together a bit with the sounds. This is how I plan to maintain a similar sound theme: - Record all the drums for all songs using the exact same set-up unless there are artistic reasons not to do so - Record bass for all songs at once, again maintaining the same sound or a limited range of sounds where things may vary (eg clean and distorted) - Same with vocals and all other instruments - guitars I imagine will vary a fair deal though in sound song to song In terms of mixing, I plan to choose one song to mix first. My best sounding, all rounder song. Once I get eqs and gates and compressors and verbs etc set on the drums, I'll save those presets. Same again for all other instruments and vocals (except maybe that compressor, as it'll change a lot). I'll then use these presets for all other songs BUT I will tweak these. The presets will be simply a starting point. I feel this will mean I find a verb I like on certain instruments and keep using it. Drums should all sound the same unless there is a reason for artistic difference. Nothing I say here is set, these are all just points to start me off at. The mixing will go wherever the song takes me, but I feel this should give me a really smooth sounding album. Any thoughts or other ideas I might like to include? This is such a huge project. I still have 2.5 songs to write before I can start recording and I can't freaking wait!!!! Fingers crossed I can have this all recorded by the end of the year. Then I'll probably take a month or two off it and then start mixing next year.I think a fresh mind would be good.


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    Guitarhacker
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/21 14:40:54 (permalink)
    another way... is to take notes on your settings.

    I simply record the music..... and it all kind of sounds like it's me. I've been at this a while so I tend to set things up the same way time after time. I found out what works and now I pretty much use it.

    Also, using the same mastering plug with the same or similar settings will tend to give a sonic cohesiveness to the music.

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    Jeff Evans
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/21 17:05:38 (permalink)
    matt  I produced an album with local musician Dan Lethbridge. (Dreamers of the world Unite) I think we achieved a sense of all the songs belonging together as part of an album but also I think you do need some things to vary from song to song. It adds interest.

    I played drums and changed up the drums slightly in terms of mikes and positions (and tunings). But even with that because it was the same Sonor kit that put the main coherence back in. Dan played several electric guitars but we changed the pedals going before the amp at times and tone settings. I tended to use the same mike for the guitar cab which was a nice Epiphone valve amp. The coherence factor there is the same amp and mike.

    Some tracks we just added in things that were not on other tracks such as a resonator guitar recorded in my kitchen off the studio here which has got a sort of live sound to it. We added in things organ through Leslie (sexy very slow turning) and synths a fair bit too. Other tracks were vocals and just two guitars etc.

    The tracks varied from very small to quite epic at times (Instrumentation wise) . Did not matter because it was Dan's songs that held it all together from song to song. They are the link. (And his vocal style) Your own writing style will live through every song.

    With mixing I definitely kept the core things fairly similar all the way through eg drums sounds and vocal sounds. Changed up the acoustic guitars. We had 4 expensive Martins to choose from and that helped a lot. We also altered the rhythm tunings on some tracks. I recorded the rhythm guitars in slightly different acoustic environments as well including my garage which sounded huge. Changed the acoustic mike choice as well. U87, to AKG 414 etc

    Other musicians came in and did their thing and they brought their own sound in with them. I used my upright acoustic piano for some tracks and True Pianos for others. Changed the string samplers too from Kurzweil to EMU at times. I think you can keep some core things constant and change up other stuff.

    Same vocal mike and vocal chain for everything. Changed up the reverbs definitely though.

    Mastering also unites things again and adds some more coherence back so its OK to go from say vocals and 2 acoustic guitars out to 32 tracks of instruments with lead vocals and harmonies and big pounding drum track.  As long as you keep the average level fairly constant etc in mastering.

    We also ran some tracks right into the next and overlapped and that worked a treat in a few places as well. Sounds great when done occasionally and right.

    Send me a PM and I will send you a copy of the CD to check out. I have sent one over to Mike McCue and I am looking forward to hearing what he thinks of it.

    The only thing I would have changed now is that I mixed it all on an analog Tascam mixer and I can hear the sound of the mixer on every track now. It is not bad at all but simply there. But that was when I was into all that outboard analog stuff. It would sound better mixed digitally now I know it. You could do things like digitally add in some nice buss sounding plugins and use those consistently from song to song as well. I think all digital allows you to move away from the sound of the overall production if you feel you want to for any reason.

    Like if I produce a piece inside Fruity Loops and use everything of theirs then it sounds different to Sonar or Studio One, but do I not put that on an album because it sounds too different from other tracks I may have done. No I say, mastering can bring things like together very nicely I believe. I think it adds interest to the overall listening experience. My writing style is also going to link any number of tracks together. Even though we think we are changing up the music writing a lot, it is more similar than you think. It is because it is you. I believe it is not until you collaborate with a second musician then the end result music will be different to either one of you individually. (I love that by the way and when it is more it can be even better)

    Don't do too much everything the same in the production process otherwise you might end up with something that sounds all the same!
    post edited by Jeff Evans - 2011/08/21 17:11:12

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    mattplaysguitar
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/22 08:28:15 (permalink)
    Thanks for that Jeff. Some good points there. I imagine drums and vocals I'll keep pretty consistent, bass generally similar, and guitars different all the time. But you're right, those little things such as similar equipment and my voice and my style etc will really help bring it together. Hell, I might even have to work to keep things sounding different! Haha The mastering is quite important too, as g-hacker mentioned. I'm looking forward to bringing everything together in mastering but plan on doing lots of comparisons at the mixing stage so that minimal mastering is required to bring it all in line. A lot of stuff can be done better at mixing stage so I will keep to this.


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    batsbrew
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/22 10:41:02 (permalink)
    It is really more of a choice, than a technique.

    There are a lot of elements that have to play nice together, the feeling, the tones, the pacing, the subject matter, the method of mixing has to be consistent from song to song, there are VERY FEW albums i've heard in the last 20 years, that even attempt to do this.


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    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/22 11:08:03 (permalink)
    "I have sent one over to Mike McCue and I am looking forward to hearing what he thinks of it."

    I just started listening to it... and I'm finding it difficult to express my compliments without seeming gratuitous. Words like fantastic, lush, pertinent, have come to mind. It's an a album; a cohesive body of work both musically and lyrically.


    My thoughts on the OP are that we all have a tendency to be who we are and we will leave a signature on the work. It may be so familiar that it doesn't seem to represent a unique sense of aesthetic. Over time, as interests change, it becomes easier to appreciate that a personalized expression lives within the work.



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    Slugbaby
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/22 16:47:01 (permalink)
    Hi Matt,
    I pretty much did the same thing you do: Keep the instrument sounds fairly similar.  I try to imagine it's a live setting, where you can only do so much to amend the sounds between songs.  That way is sounds pretty cohesive. 
    I take it one step further, and try to keep my guitar sounds to a minimum:  One rhythm acoustic sound, one acoustic lead/fill sound, one or two rhythm guitar sounds, and one or two lead guitar sounds.  They're not always 100% right for the song, but they're at least 95% there, and it maintains the flow of the whole album nicely.

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    Jeff Evans
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/22 16:57:28 (permalink)
    Thank you Mike and I am glad it got there safely. I do listen to it from time to time and enjoy it myself I must admit after spending so much time with it! I think that some things could have been done differently and one of them was that we tended to record quite a lot of material for each song. Dan wanted it all to stay in and I was more keen at times to maybe drop quite a lot of it out right at the start and bring things in over time more.

    I fought Dan on that a bit. Also I wanted the drums bigger in 'The Fallout' We agreed they should have been explosive right in the beginning and I played as such but that explosive playing has been held back a little for my likingc in the final mix.  I have done some Jeff Evans mixes of these tracks too which might showcase different things like drums for example. My wife did all the violins in the Fallout too. All that feedback was done at ear splitting volumes too!

    But overall it was a joy to mix and challenging at times. Spent lots of time on the little mono speaker on those tracks where there are lot of things going on. It highlights errors in these sort of things. I would love to remix it now with what I have got now. I am sure I could get it sounding better still but the budget or the need is not there. I did all that album in Logic as well. Had 24 analog outputs from 3 different sound cards. It all worked a treat. I can hear thet Tascam mixer though I swear it! I know I could get it more transparent now and a bit clearer here and there in places. I would love to remix it in Sonar for example. I would pull the drums up here and there too.

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    Sidroe
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/22 17:52:20 (permalink)
    Always keep in mind, even if you change to a an entirely different setup for your instruments, the magic of your way of playing and your way of arranging, note choice, even execution will always leave your fingerprints on every song you record. I have done thousands of sessions and the comment I always get is that you can tell who that is playing just from my tone and technique. That is something you can never cover up or hide. No matter how you try.

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    Dave King
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/22 21:35:10 (permalink)
    ...it's called "mastering."

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    mattplaysguitar
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/23 06:20:46 (permalink)
    "...it's called "mastering."" That sounds just like an 'I'll fix it in the mix' attitude... Sure, it's an important part, but your job is going to be a hell of a lot easier if you get it sounding well from the mix stage first..
    post edited by mattplaysguitar - 2011/08/23 06:23:37


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    mattplaysguitar
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/23 06:31:22 (permalink)
    And why has the 'quote' feature stopped working and the enter button doesn't create a new line when you post.. Have replies just turned into html only?... I have no bold, italic or size buttons either....


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    bitflipper
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/23 11:01:29 (permalink)
    Bapu couldn't make it so he asked me to pass along this tip: make sure all your songs are in the key of A minor.


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    guitartrek
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/23 11:11:23 (permalink)
    Matt - I'm doing the same thing as you.  I've got my core instruments and tones.  Drums, bass, vocal processing presets, guitar setups, EQ's, compression settings, and levels that I use on all my tunes for the core tracks.  Then I vary reverb lengths and so forth - a slow tune will use the same snare and compression settings, but slower reverb. 

    Then there are the non-core tracks that vary from tune to tune that gives each song a different identity / flavor.  Different pads, keys, sound effects, etc.

    The result is a collection of songs that sound like they've all been recorded in the same studio with the same engineer.  The volumes are all consistent. 

    I've been doing this for years. The thing is that if I find a better EQ setting on one of the core instruments or a better compression setting or, maybe I bought a new VST for one of the core instruments, I'll go through the pain of updating every one of my songs so that they all remain consistent.  This part takes a long time - it may take me a couple hours to open each project (over a dozen projects per CD) make the changes and export. 

    I'm still doing these mass changes from time to time as I progress with my mixing skills. 

    If you start with a perfectly mixed tune and are happy with the results, you may be able to avoid these mass changes, but as you work from tune to tune, you may discover settings that you like more on core tracks.  If you don't transfer those settings to all the tunes, the difference between the songs start to increase.
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    bitflipper
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/23 11:14:56 (permalink)
    Seriously, my best tip for making a bunch of songs sound like an album is paying attention to the sequencing and transitions.

    If two adjacent songs have similar tempos, count the imaginary beats in the gap between them so that the second song starts on what would have been the downbeat of the previous song.

    If two adjacent songs are in similar keys, consider eliminating the gap altogether and use a crossfade so the second song begins during the tail of the previous one. I have even gone as far as inserting short transitional material just for the purpose of tying two songs together.

    Contrary to popular practice, it is not necessary to make every song on an album exactly the same volume. Instead, arrange the album's dynamics the same way you do in a song: gradually build it up, bring it down, build it up again.

    And of course there is more to dynamics than just volume, so when sequencing songs consider the general excitement factor. If a song ends with a rousing anthemic chorus, the next one should either be an even bigger-sounding song or a quiet ballad.

    Of course, if every song is comprised of droning arpeggiated monotonic synth tones, compressed to within a decibel of its life and metered by an unvarying 808 gated sine borrowed from an old Anacin commercial - well, then none of this matters. Put the songs in alphabetical order and you're done.


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    Chappel
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/23 11:42:18 (permalink)
    mattplaysguitar


    And why has the 'quote' feature stopped working and the enter button doesn't create a new line when you post.. Have replies just turned into html only?... I have no bold, italic or size buttons either....

    I have the same problem when I use IE9 or Firefox 6. I installed Google Chrome to see how it handled the board and everything works fine in it.


    I installed the Firebug addon in Firefox and it's showing a lot of errors in the board pages. Below are a couple of examples of the errors that Firebug is showing when I inspect the forum page elements. I added spaces to the URL to make them unclickable.


    RadEditor1ClientObject is null
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    GetRadEditor is not defined
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    batsbrew
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/24 12:00:04 (permalink)
    'mastering' really isnt' the issue here

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    Philip
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/24 17:43:28 (permalink)
    Matt and Bat,

    Am I too late to cast my vote?

    Albums are strange creatures (like myself).  It sometimes helps to have a target audience, general title, hook, and/or genre in mind.  JMO, IMHO

    Sure, Bob Katz-Mastering Audio (p93-96) mentions some possible method to the madness:  Start the album with "exciting up-tempo" possibility -->mid-tempo/continuing the mood" --> "slow/easy song" combos
     
    ... with varying intuitive (artistically woven) spaces/fades between each song ... and/or

    The 1st song being the most important "setting the stage", etc.

    ... but Katz dutifully states to "never count the seconds between songs" ... now that art rules the album's song spaces.

    For example: I have written an album that seems entirely dedicated to roller skaters (Heaven's Gate), another to an unrequitted divine-love theme (Everyday), and another that is dedicated to a "Loving Gaze".

    Depending on the artist, an ME may be invoked to help clarify, even add artistic "surprises" ... but many albums are unpredictable entities anyway (like so many rich songs being produced) ... IMHO, JMO.

    IOWs,

    1) The final product, perhaps, will have created itself (spontaneously generated?) ... despite your/my scientific protocols.
    2) You/I flow with what evolves artistically ... oft with intuitive/loving feedback from audiophiles, listeners, target audiences, etc.,
    3) IMHO, JMO ... please refute/rebuke as necessary.
    post edited by Philip - 2011/08/24 17:44:45

    Philip  
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    guitartrek
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/24 19:24:10 (permalink)
    Of course you don't have to have all the songs sounding for example like it was the same drummer with the same set on every song.  You hear a lot of pop albums where there are multiple producers and studios involved.   And you can certainly hear the differences, but the mastering engineer makes a cohesive album. But there are plenty of examples where it was the same personnel and the same studio for the entire album.  That's what I'm going for.
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    Dave King
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/25 16:52:19 (permalink)
    "...it's called "mastering."" That sounds just like an 'I'll fix it in the mix' attitude... Sure, it's an important part, but your job is going to be a hell of a lot easier if you get it sounding well from the mix stage first..

     
    I did not mean for my post to be taken as a wise-crack.
     
    Traditonally, the mastering engineer works to make all of the songs on an album sound similar in volume, adjusts the spacing between songs and generally makes it sound like a cohesive or compete work.  These things are often better done by a mastering pro than a mixer in a home studio.

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    silvercn
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    Re:Techniques to make an album sound like an album - not an arrangement of songs 2011/08/25 21:39:02 (permalink)
    I did not read all the responses but saw something that I highly agree with. - A notebook. I have a big green sprial bound notebook - with lined paper in it. It is labeled "Session Notes" It is right there on the control desk area. I imagine one could have a document opened or the "notes" section of a project in some DAWS, but mine has a fixed small font and I don't like it....there is something about handwriting in that book - with my own form of shorthand and dated at the beginning of any session. As far as ideas for production - you might want to check out the book I just posted about....
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