The whining in the music industry and longing for days of yore-Let's talk solutions!

http://wampus.com/2012/05/23/on-vince-gill-and-music-downloads/
 
After scaning Facebook today I found this article from a guy called Vince Gill, I'm sure the American's will know who he is...I don't-but there is a lot of discussions at the moment about the devaluation of music lately.  Including Nick Mason-Pink Floyd accusing USpew2 of devaluing music with the ifool travesty. 
 
I use to get into these discussions too, and routinely moaned but after doing quite a lot of research on music history this year, particularly the links between the classical avant garde and 60's art rock-which really was the last great stand of western art music...60's art rock does have clear links with the big three Bach, Mozart and Beethoven.  I have come to the conclusion we need to stop whining and find a way forward.  The music we create in the next 50 years will bare little resemblance to the last 350 years of art music IMO but we can ground this new music in structures and forms which are recognizable.  I think this is important, there is a need for people to recognize what they are viewing and here is the kicker...music will be viewed not listened to.  Musicianship is a fundamental too and this is something that needs to be instilled into the ipad generation.
 
Anyway this is a small essay I wrote on the subject surmising my research this year...feel free to chime in.
 
Yes, but all this says is the business model is broken.  When music was art...it was valued a lot more and the artists gained a lot more.  What we have now is mass entertainment.  Is it any wonder that people don't want to pay anymore than 99 cents for something that is thrown away? 
On the other end of the scale, look at Pink Floyds "Endless River" 30 bucks on iTunes and for CD format.  And 100,000 copies already sold, so for Pink Floyd the business model isn't broken.  Although we are still looking at 1994 prices and sales numbers.  But still not bad for an album that is essentially a jam album, and I have been looking forward to this as well. 
      Let’s look at a couple of facts, firstly "popular" music that is something you buy is only 100 years old, it never took off to the great heights until the late 60's and it only was that way for 15 odd years.  The reasons were, we were looking at proper artists, not musicians per se but proper artists, Townsend, Lennon, Barret, Mercury were all art school trained.  Around these 4 proper artists were the great musicians of the last 100 years,  people seem to forget that a lot of the late 60's "proper" musicians were classically trained or jazz trained.  These include Bruce, Fripp, Baker, Lake, Emerson, Krieger.  And around the proper musicians, the others learnt.  So all of a sudden, you have some very well trained renaissance people.  Top that off with Morrison and the film school stuff, the classically trained boffins at the best studios and you can start to see why music was worth something.   I'm also forgetting the literature based stuff too, very important...Dylan and the beat poets, Barret and English whimsy, these too are also super important, finally the connection with the classical avant-garde...Cage and Stockhausen (14 Hour Technicolour Dream Festival anyone?  Both Cage and Ono was at this event).   Unfortunately today none of this exists, the super-structure that sustained 50 years of art including music-is not there! 
     The technology is amazing but for all the whining, people still haven't cottoned onto the fact you need to fundamentally change the art we are creating and the way to present it.  In 1969 when Led Zeppelin hit the scene they created a sonic boom, so too The Beatles, this is when sonic rock gods straddled the stage and the world was in awe.  This era has links to classical antiquity because of this concept i.e. neo-classical rock or just plain classical rock.  Today this idea is not new and is boring, why would you want to see One Direction (Down the Toilet) or Lady Ho Ha on stage and submit to some sort of grovelling adulation?  It will not work...the world has moved on.  And the same could be said for pub rock, Oz's contribution to the world of music.  The venues are more or less gone, the infrastructure is gone and no amount of opining is going to bring it back.  This has a knock on effect because today's generation just don't care about going to the pub to see a band.  They are more interested in the ipad than the guitar. 
     So as artists we have to start to engage today's generation in a totally different way.  There are some fundamentals which are needed still, musicianship is one, and how to translate this to the ipad generation is the problem.  But again technology is the key, I use the Yourock guitar, and it fundamentally changes the style of music you can create, limits are a thing of the past. I'm going to hook up a fishman midi pick-up to my electric as well because the Yourock is not nice to play.  There is also a guy working on an acoustic synth hybrid. 
    But fundamentally verse, chorus, middle 8 won’t cut it anymore (sure there will always be a place for the troubadour), and so if that is all you’re going to offer, then 99 cents is about all your worth and less with streaming services.  Today you have to be a multimedia artist, this includes video, music, photography, possibly even computer graphics designer...although this last one is even beyond me.  Here is my latest attempt to meld high-art music with video and the latest music technology including: the Yourock guitar, Notion3 Orchestral Instrument (notice how I called it an instrument), DAW technology, granular synthesis and found sounds and video.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmNv25FxdBk 
     But if you want you art and this includes music to be valued more, then create art, not songs.  Here endth the lesson.
    
 
I suppose this is what I am talking about in regards to, mixing and mastering at the same time, creativity and various other things I muse about.  We are going to have to fundamentally change our mind set to get the best out of technology to create new art.  Those standing in the way are no better than the luddites.
 
Ben-Enjoy

dubdisciple
Interesting article, but it does create the question in my mind of whether the percentage of musicians that are formally  trained now is less or more or is it a matter of perception?  I often find myself shocked at the musical backgrounds of some pop and EDM artists.  Yes, a lot come from non-formal backgrounds like dj, just like a lot of classic rock bands had people who had no formal knowledge of music.  At the same time some of these guys went through formal programs and top music programs and chose to make music that to many of us are just bleeps and blips.   I think your article, unlike many of the "music sucks now" types leaves open the possibility that art does not have to die but evolves.

It's clear formal training is no guarantee. You can be an accomplished formally trained musician and still have little to offer in the way of creativity. I took a basic music theory night class at college many years ago and the teacher was an incredible pianist. She could sight read anything, no matter how complicated, and play it through perfectly the first time. She was also a very talented violin and French horn player. Yet when we asked her if she composed her own pieces, she just shook her head and said it wasn't anything that interested her. She only wanted to play other people's music. 
 
I think musical influence is more important than formal training. If someone has spent their life in love with good music and has the motivation to express the music they hear in their head, they'll get it out somehow. With or without formal training. 
 
As for electronic and pop music, well there are some exceptionally talented musicians in those genres, you just have to wade through a ton of crap to find them. I never stop wading. What with streaming services such as Spotify and YouTube it's never been easier. With the rise of the bedroom musician and people mixing and mastering their own tracks at little expense, there's never been so much music to choose from. Unfortunately most of it is instantly forgettable. With regards to electronic styles, I think a lot of people are instantly prejudiced against the genre and refuse to listen inside the bleeps and blips to perceive the music within. There are a few exceptionally talented artists working in these styles, but a lot of people would instantly dismiss them as musicians because of that style. An album like Matmos' "Supreme Balloon," for example, would immediately turn a lot of people off because of its bleepy-blippyness. But when you listen to it carefully it's actually a carefully crafted work of avant-garde genius which I'm sure someone like Frank Zappa would have approved of.  Sam Shepherd aka Floating Points is another one - his EP "Shadows" would, upon first listen, appear to be nothing more than the usual Garage beats of the type that would normally disgust anyone who prefers "real" music, but if you listen to it carefully with an open mind it's actually a beautifully composed and mixed tone painting, at the risk of sounding pretentious  And then you listen to his 16-piece band the "Floating Points Ensemble" and it's clear he's an accomplished jazz musician as well. 
 
It's never been easier to experiment with music. Some of the stuff I hear nowadays is nothing short of beautiful in terms of texture and timbre. There are electronic virtuosos out there if you're prepared to look, and their skills are incredibly versatile, including the whole gamut of music production from instrumental proficiency to synth programming and sound design, to composing and arranging all the way to mixing and mastering. What's more, these people are doing it without the pressure of some corporation with a bottom line breathing down their necks. The result is some insanely quirky and personal music which has been lovingly crafted by the artist at every stage of its production. A lot of them don't even care about the money. Sam Shepherd makes music in between studying for a PhD in Neuroscience. 
 
 

I believe that we are definately seeing a change of the guard, a revelution in the way music will be marketed and sold; and that we are in the begining stages of that change in process.  In my eyes, the best bet, to have some kind of success, is to write good songs.  Good songwriting in my eyes, will always be the main ingredient.  Followed closely by good musicianship and then good recording practices. 
 
I have an art degree as well Ben, but my professors always preached that you can follow your own artistic intrests, but in the end, if no one is wanting to buy what you have created, you will be a starving artist.

Music used to be just one of a few home entertainment options
Today there are hundreds (or more) non music based entertainment options in our homes.
Has music been devalued due to the onslaught of media entertainment options
We need to discover new and unique ways to monetize music
Technology has changed the way we listen to music
Technology has always influenced the way music is created
Retain the joy of discovery in your music. Experiment
If you discover something new, pay it forward.
 
There are some serious shifting sands.  Things have changed.  The old model no longer applies.  Stop whining about it and look at what I have mentioned in bold above.  We need to find new ways to make money simple as that.
Royalty based library production music is the future.  In the past royalties could only be earned from 2 or 3 sources, the great news is that today it is more like 200 to 300 sources!  Find them.
 
If your music is really good you will always do well and make money.  (you just have to know how to market that music) Simple as that.  If it sucks then you won’t.  (the thing the teachers forgot to mention is that if you are a great artist and you are starving it is because you have not marketed your art properly. Art/Music tecahers don't have a clue about marketing. They are on a salary and they dont have to! They are basically lazy) 
 
The bar is high now.  I think we are in a very exciting time.  Think positive.
 
Two excellent books:
 
http://www.amazon.com/Demystifying-Cue-Thoughts-strategies-competitive/dp/1500686107/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1415133302&sr=1-1&keywords=demystifying+the+cue
 
and
 
http://www.amazon.com/Music-Marketing-DIY-Musician-Executing/dp/1480369527/ref=pd_sim_b_1?ie=UTF8&refRID=0K3FBPX6N9Q9WCX1ZYNG
 
Demystifying the Cue is an excellent book for those interested in producing production library music.  This area of music making and earning is GROWING!!!!
 
The Marketing book is heavy going but essential.  The problem with many many many musicians is they have no idea how to market their music in today’s modern world.  Learn and do it!
 
U2 is a great band and anyone thinking otherwise is just plain silly.  The free album and the free idea was excellent.  It has created a situation where all their other album sales have gone up bigtime.  Smart.  They are making even more money. I like it!

Benn i agree and try and do my part.  I teach kids how to use modern studio techniques  but I have also been supplying an acoustic band of teenagers  by encouraging them and lending or giving them what little I can afford.  i encourage them to come in the studio too (which they can record for free) so that they can properly capture their creativity. 
 
As for the disparity between rich and not so rich stars.  That's another one of those things where that has always kind of been the case.  The list of artists who managed to get very wealthy and stay that way is shorter than most people think. At no point did artists get a big share of the record sales pie.  When you look at a list of wealthiest musicians, the bulk of wealth is from tours that came long after their heyday as chartoppers like Jimmy Buffet) or shrewd business deals like Dolly Pardon. Even the bulk of Jay-z's wealth is not from actual record sales.  The only insanely rich one I can think of off the top of my head  who has a significant chunk of his money from royalties is Paul MCCartney and even that is combined with 100 million dollar plus tours and licensing agreements.
 
On a brighter note, artists do have new ways to monetize their talents that did not exist  a few decades ago.  Music for games and apps is one.  A viral video on youtube will make an artist much more than a typical record deal.  I was shocked by some of the figures I saw for artists who have not even sold a record. If an artist is lucky enough to go this route, they have more leverage in securing a better deal than the ones typically secured by new artists. 

Lots of good thoughts above me. I play live still acoustically, and no PA even in places others need one. I take pride in my live abilities, hold a tune, be loud enough to be heard, write good songs, (I'm told). My personal feeling is, and I warn you, this is out there!. If we suddenly lost all electrical appliances use around the world, it would be the greatest day in the world for all musicians and artists in general. We would suddenly have real value, those of us who actually can play live, and the pretenders would all be gone. 
 
The issues are many, my solution is nasty I know :D.

Starise
One thing I recently heard that has stuck with me is a statement recently made by blind artist and musician, who is very successful. He said- " You are responsible for your own music career ". I agree with that comment. 

I'd take that one step further: you are responsible for your own music, period.
 
We here are fortunate that we can make our own music. Make music you want to hear and forget what anybody else thinks of it or whether it might make you some money. That's how it was for centuries before a bunch of non-musicians decided they could build an "industry" around it. Those times will become a historical footnote, a curious and short-lived phenomenon.
 
During the Alaskan gold rush, a fellow sailed up from Seattle with a newspaper under his arm. On arrival he was immediately offered $10 for the newspaper. In the spirit of the gold-rush mentality, he declined and instead hired a boy to read the newspaper aloud in a saloon, charging $1 to enter. His 10-cent investment paid back hundreds of dollars. But it was a brief opportunity.
 
Today, nobody in Alaska bemoans the loss of newspapers being read aloud in a saloon. They don't even mourn the death of newspapers. I do not mourn the days when my musical menu was tiny and dictated by AM radio. I will not be sad when musicians can no longer afford private jets, or when MBA suits in Japan move on to some other industry because they can no longer guarantee millions from pushing pap onto gullible kids. I won't even grieve over ordinary working-class musicians having to take a day job to feed their children. Join the club.
 
And next, let's kill professional sports.
 
 
 

sharke
Bit, you just reminded me of a story I remember reading in the news in Britain in the late 90's. In fact I'm going to dig it out: 
 
http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/money-are-you-ready-to-rock-n-dole-1167173.html
 
 

NEW LABOUR'S Welfare to Work plans threatening dole payments for the young unemployed were the last straw for many of the party's supporters in the pop music industry.
People such as Creation Records' owner Alan McGee argue that the dole has played a vital part in building the UK pop industry, allowing talented beginners to work on their music for a few years with no distractions. Taking this basic subsidy away, they claim, would sabotage Britain's impressive record of producing internationally successful bands, and hit Britain's earnings from record sales abroad.

 
You cannot make this up! And it gets better....
 

Last week, Andrew Smith, the Employment Minister, announced details of the so-called "rock 'n' dole" scheme to allow 18-to-24-year-olds to continue claiming their Jobseekers' Allowance of pounds 39.85 a week for 13 months, providing they can persuade the job centre clerks that they are seriously pursuing a career in music.

 
Imagine that! The government paying for you to sit on your ass until you find your creative muse! 
 

Now I will pay that, and it is interesting that the British government, probably one of the few governments in the world (and by government I mean successive) who understand the rich culture that Brittan has because of their arts.  This idea to pay one for their creative output via a dole subsidy shows a progressiveness which is lacking in today's world. 
 
Thanks for all the comments guys, lots to muse over I think.  I think and hope the boffins have taken some of what been said on board and get on board rather than continue their luddite ways!
 
Ben

As much as i love the arts, the idea of paying taxes for people lay on their artsy arses collecting checks in hopes they might make some timeless piece of art does not fly with me. I'm all for funding arts and even grants, scholarships, etc, but within reason and certainly not in a capacity where they don't work. I want to cultivate my megalomania while i perfect my plot to takemover the world but I don't expect the government to carry me until I get it together.

bitflipper
dub, you live in Seattle. We've been paying for stuff like this ($2.6M last year) since 1973:
 

Touche.  Our money goes to pigs and all manner of oddities. I know several artists with no jobs and somehow afford Seattle's high rent prices.

Ben, I think what you speak of is a totally differnt topic that probably veers closer toppolitics than I or Cakewalk would want to discuss here. Can't speak for Cakewalk so that's just a guess. In other words I will just touch the music/artist related portions of that. Bottomline is that regardless of what subsidies we give our artists, we can't legislate public demand and value. Yes, there is value in assisting artists and any other vocation to stimulate culture and industry, but no way do I feel that any segment of society capable of work should be more valued than others as to deserve a completely free pass. If we applied the same logc across other disciplines, life would come to a standstill

Great thread for sure here. One of the things I see happening is people of today are just no longer interested in anything dealing with older technology unless it wows them. Why play an instrument when you can play an electronic something CLOSE to an instrument that gives you instant results? It's like...why dial a phone number when auto-dial can do it? Heck, I remember when I used to remember the numbers of everyone in my life. Now that I don't ever dial anything manually, if I got arrested and needed to call one person....the only number I know would be my parents...who are now both deceased.
 
That said, I sincerely believe this is what the industry is all about. Change and keeping interest. Even if that change is not to our liking, it has to keep interest. As a teacher in the recording/music field, I lose a child/adult as soon as I don't make it interesting. They'd rather learn a cool tapping lick on guitar or some cool effect in recording that could be used to impress someone on the spot for 10 minutes over a years worth of stuff that could impress those friends for a lifetime. This is the new world we live in. Longevity is gone. You live for the moment and do whatever you can to make an impression or make a buck because tomorrow is promised to no one. As soon as you try and keep up, things have changed.
 
This is happening with everything really. We have to cater to those who buy. We can even apply it to cover bands. We in our 40's and 50's don't go out as often. We have other things in our lives....children, grand children, we work hard and maybe feel like we don't need to be somewhere so we stay in and sleep or watch TV. Those that play in bands....if you're in a classic rock band, your people show up for one set and are gone by 11 pm. The rest of your night, you play to crickets.
 
Create a cool look, have all the right stuff in your band and play the new stuff that the younger generation is loving, you play to a packed house for the entire night. It matters not how good you play....what you play or how great the tone of your instrument is. Can you sell drinks? You have to, you're now in the alcohol business and are no longer a musician.
 
My point in mentioning the above.....this is the same with the music industry. Can you sell drinks = can you sell product? Whether it's computer generated, computer manipulated, not very musical or delivered in a way that we musicians who have worked hard at our instrument can swallow, you have to just accept that this is where we are in the world.
 
Take a look at what sells and ask yourselves why.
 
Rap: successful because those that love it, actually support it. You don't sell millions stealing it off the net. When a new rap CD is ready to come out, you can see people waiting in line. Budgets are tolerable most times. 200% profit. (If it were a rock CD, you'd see people waiting ONLINE....to steal it. Sad but true. If a classic rock band could sell 1 million today, they'd throw a party.)
 
Country: successful because the songs are catchy, it's one of the few styles of music that still has good playing and singing as well as the best production you could ever want if you are an engineer. Finally a style of music that doesn't just use massive compression! It's also purchased by a wide array of people from teens to older adults. One size fits a lot with country. They can get away with bigger budgets....they make the money to support the habit. They've embraced the new technology here as well. Some of it fits, some of it sounds terrible. People don't seem to be complaining.
 
Kiddy pop: Most kids can't afford to buy it, so mom and dad buys it for them. They also have an oath sort of like we did to our stars. We'd buy or do anything to support them. When the kids love someone, it doesn't matter if they can even sing or perform really.
 
Top 40/solo artists: This stuff is always going to be around. Disco will never die. We need to dance to something...even if you don't dance. And there has to always be something sexual with eye candy to reel people in.
 
In my opinion, though the art has changed and the majority of songs aren't as strong, (I really do like modern country as far as good songs go...though some of the words don't do anything for me) the art part is even more interesting. Though I would like to see it more musical (which in some cases, it's still awesome if you look for it) I've seen some really incredible innovation. Some of it not for me, but I have to tip my hat to anyone that can make a buck in this industry or create something new that makes me go "wow...wish I thought of that!" Do I think the quality of music has gone down? Most definitely. But the reason for that is the same reason most of us are being bled dry by our governments. Greed.
 
Did a classic rock band really need a 500k album advance? Seriously....today, if we play our cards right, we can get a totally slamming recording in a slamming studio for $40,000 or less with producer included. That's really not a lot when you go back in time and look at what some of those guys were getting. Not to mention all the added stuff in their contracts that had to be a part of the deal. Granted, signed artists should be taken care of. But when they are greedy like sports athletes, this is why one day, someone says "You know what...screw 'em, we can just kill some quality, change a few faces and people will still learn to enjoy it. They may not take to it at first, but they will fall right in to place eventually."
 
Look at the grunge era. It didn't catch on immediately. Why? Because though the art was cool and some of it was really unique, people weren't ready for a garage band sound. But alas...they got used to it and what followed inspired an entire generation which also opened the industry up to those that didn't need to be incredible musicians. It was ok to sound like Cobain instead of being as polished as Bonjovi or Def Lep.
 
Why spend 500k on a band in the studio when you can do the album for 10k or less? Look at rap....those dudes don't really need much budget at all to record those albums. It's 200% profit for a record that literally costs about 5k or less to record. Add in the producers and beat masters etc and it goes to 50k or 100k, but again...consider the outcome. Rap albums sell in the millions....rock guys are lucky if they see 500k in sales.....unless you're the new teen rock band that totally catches on.
 
Truth be told, we actually have choices. :) You either see how artistic you can be and use all the tools that are offered today, or you go old school. If you want to make a few dollars with your music, you look at what's making money. If you just enjoy the art of music and love playing instruments and recording, you're right where you need to be. Though there are times I show my disgust for certain things that are happening, I have to either accept and appreciate it or ignore it. I do all 3 on a daily basis when I have to. :)
 
One cool thing about being so fortunate to beta test for many companies, they have lead me to try things within their software that I wouldn't normally try. Some of these things are what we musicians hate and wouldn't think of doing within our music. That said, those things are tools....and the tools of today can help make tomorrow while becoming a part of our own art. The real artist embraces anything and everything but never dances to the beat of any other drum but their own. :) Whatever will be, will be. I say we just do what we do while enjoying every minute of it. :)
 
-Danny

Sharke, I think if the world followed the "who's to say what is and isn't" art thing too literally the world would be a little more sterile. I think a building, park, etc is more appealing than one without even if don't care for the art.

sven450
Danny:  That was insightful, relevant and just generally awesome.  Really interesting to hear from someone who has a feel for the industry.  I'm glad everyone isn't pissed and jaded.  It looks like we can be ourselves and still live in this new paradigm after all. It might not be the most nurturing for, say, a prog rock instrumentalist, but it is what it is.   Thanks to the interweb, there is a niche audience for everything.  Lets all hope the niche we fit in is REALLY FREAKING BIG, and growing everyday. 

 
Thanks Sven, that's how I feel as well. Even if the niche isn't big, it's nice to at least have one. :)

dubdisciple
Danny, interesting how one can agree with someone's general view yet have an opposite take on individual parts. I find modern country to be mostly horrible in terms of songwriting. I realize that not being an avid listener of modern country limits me to the pop songs with twang sold under that label, but what I hear is oftenthe same pop themes with a few stereotypical niche topics like trucks :)

Oh I may have exaggerated my love for country, dub. I like when people sing in key with good voices. We definitely can find that in the majority of country. I love production that moves me. You know, polished stuff that is an art all in its own. Sort of like the how some people like myself take pride in appearance.....meaning, if it takes me 30 minutes to do my hair as opposed to going out and looking like I just rolled out of bed, I'll take that extra 30 minutes. :)
 
That's one thing you will notice if you ever record a good country band from the ground up, brother. All the stuff we normally do in rock where we squash the crap out of things....doesn't hold up here. You can actually use reverb, delay, chorus and other coloration devices. It makes the music sound less like a garage band...which after you record that garage band sound 500 times with singers that aren't really singers, you welcome the change.
 
I love the drum sounds, the guitar sounds as well as the guitar players. The fiddle players, the pedal steel stuff....it's just really cool and quite a challenge because THEN you have to fit all that stuff in. I like the stacked back up vocals....it's just a preference of mine really.
 
I totally agree on the cliche thing. The words (most times) in country do nothing for me. I was honestly speaking from an engineer standpoint as well as a songwriter who appreciates hit material even if it has been done before. :) See, even there...this is another point to keep in mind.
 
Though some of us might laugh at simplistic tunes that turn into hits...or we may cringe because we heard the progression before, someone found an art in sort of replicating without being accused of stealing. And, they don't have to fly a desk for a living...lol....so you have to try and look at it for what it is instead of what we feel it should be. If hits were so easy, none of us would be on this forum. LOL! :)
 
Then again, hits aren't for everyone and that's understandable too. For the guy that could care less about making a dime, it's all about art and personal satisfaction. I get all that brother, I really do. That said, we still have to see the art in something even if that something isn't something we're down with. You'd be surprised what you can pull from that stuff if you disect it and take from it what may just be already in your style of choice.
 
I remember copping a piece of a Madonna song years ago in my music, but I sort of did it backwards. The change was so different, people commented on it positvely for quite some time. Here I was cringing hoping no one would ever notice...which they didn't....but I was more afraid of not fitting in...which I did totally. :) You just never know.....it's best to keep an open mind even when something is simplistic and done. It can be as powerful as the progressive riff that has tension and adds that little surprise when you fuse them together. :)
 
-Danny