dubdisciple
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Rain
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2014/12/31 03:18:49
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You've got to wonder just how much the internet has contributed to lower the bar and inspired people to do weird things just to get their 15 seconds of fame.
I mean, back in the days, whatever it was that you were on would wear off and you'd come to your senses before you enact those crazy ideas we all get some times...
TCB - Tea, Cats, Books...
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dubdisciple
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2014/12/31 03:47:34
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True. It seems like the sort of thing you say aloud as a joke and then everybody sleeps it off. That Grimace is nightmare inducing. Then Again, grimace was always kind of creepy. What was Grimace?
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bapu
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2014/12/31 13:00:19
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dubdisciple
What was Grimace?
The scum scraped off the griddle?
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slartabartfast
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2014/12/31 19:28:54
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Whoa...
Now there is a fertile field for litigation over trademark infringement and damage to the brand. Hard to imagine that the McDonald's people will sit this one out.
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bapu
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2014/12/31 19:32:22
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☄ Helpfulby dubdisciple 2014/12/31 19:56:03
Slart,
Brief Fact Summary. After Hustler Magazine and Larry Flynt (Petitioners) published an advertisement, depicting Jerry Falwell (Respondent) as having his “first time” in an outhouse with his month, the reverend brought suit based on invasion of privacy, libel and intentional infliction of emotional distress.
Synopsis of Rule of Law. When an advertisement parodying a public figure depicts facts which no reasonable person could take as true, that figure cannot prevail under a theory of emotional distress.
=====================
Ok so this is not an advert but all the same I imagine (not being a lawyer or John Lennon) that the band would not lose to Mickey D.
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craigb
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2014/12/31 19:59:14
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bapu
Slart,
Brief Fact Summary. After Hustler Magazine and Larry Flynt (Petitioners) published an advertisement, depicting Jerry Falwell (Respondent) as having his “first time” in an outhouse with his month, the reverend brought suit based on invasion of privacy, libel and intentional infliction of emotional distress.
Synopsis of Rule of Law. When an advertisement parodying a public figure depicts facts which no reasonable person could take as true, that figure cannot prevail under a theory of emotional distress.
=====================
Ok so this is not an advert but all the same I imagine (not being a lawyer or John Lennon) that the band would not lose to Mickey D.
But what if the parody IS true even if no reasonable person could take it as true? What then? Huh? Huh? 
Time for all of you to head over to Beyond My DAW!
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dubdisciple
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2014/12/31 20:08:03
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I can't imagine any sane person thinking McDonalds is actually having their trademarked figures run around doing Sabbath parody songs. As silly as this is, I am sure they are safe from litigation since it is clearly parody.
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slartabartfast
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2014/12/31 20:51:57
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Parody is in theory a defense against trademark and copyright infringement, but it is one in which the burden is generally on the infringer, and it is never so clear as to be absolute. The costumes look enough like the cartoon characters, that a case could clearly be made for infringement of the design copyright through creation of a derivative work. It would be difficult to argue that a copy would constitute parody if it is hanging in a closet in the wardrobe department, even though it was intended to be worn in a parody performance. Parody is much less useful in a defense against claims of tarnishment of the brand. McDonald's spends huge amounts of money presenting itself as a place suitable to bring children, and the characters being portrayed are specifically designed for that appeal. Many adults who do not find McDonald's menu objectionable might find the association with the devil's music injurious to that image, and many children (the targets of the whole hamburgler exercise) might actually be confused. Libel is a different issue altogether. In any event, I find it hard to believe that a band with so little going for it that it needs this gimmick is going to have the financial resources to fight a serious legal attack by a monster corporation's legal department. Their best hope is that McDonald's would avoid taking action to keep from raising the profile of the issue higher in the public view. To that extent, they remain safe only so long as no one notices them, which is not the goal of most commercial music enterprises. http://www.lfiplaw.com/articles/trademark_parody.htm
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dubdisciple
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2014/12/31 21:30:20
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I doubt McD's pursues them. I am awarde that it is a common corporate tactic to simply wear these type of people out by outspending them into simply dropping their act. I am also aware that McDonalds has chosen to skip legal action when it comes to parody and sometimes potentially libelous material due to fear of negative feedback for a company already fighting negative image issues. McD's has not used any of their characters for decades except Ronald and even he is rare. George Lucas is one of the few big names that made as habit of regularly threatening every minor parody his lawyers could track down and also had a habit of losing the cases that actually got to court. Bill Cosby is also notorious for bullying those attempting to parodying him and has been successful in making their lives so miserable they quit, so i see you point.
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soens
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2015/01/03 04:35:58
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Won't the plugblicity only serve to further the desire of those seeing them to crave and buy more BigMacs™ and Quarter Pounders™ with a few side orders of fries, sodas, and Chicken Nuggets™? I'm dreweling for 'em right now. Sounds like a win-win for MickyD's. Now esques me whilst I warms up me car.
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dubdisciple
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2015/01/03 15:13:52
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"The fear of being eaten by a sandwich"- George Clinton
Comes to mind when I see the Mayor McCheese guy.
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quantumeffect
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2015/01/04 07:38:02
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I think you guys have this all backwards ... this should be a discussion about the damage to the Black Sabbath brand!
Dave 8.5 PE 64, i7 Studio Cat, Delta 1010, GMS and Ludwig Drums, Paiste Cymbals "Everyone knows rock n' roll attained perfection in 1974. It's a scientific fact." H. Simpson "His chops are too righteous." Plankton during Sponge Bob's guitar solo
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dubdisciple
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2015/01/04 17:46:43
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quantumeffect
I think you guys have this all backwards ... this should be a discussion about the damage to the Black Sabbath brand!
Better groups have been parodied in much more over the top ways with no damage to brand. I doubt this effects the legacy of anyone involved with Sabbath. Hard to damage the rep of a group who's lead singer is known for biting off bat heads and reality tv. Roy Orbison's estate tried to sue @-Live Crew for a raunchy parody of "pretty woman" but it was literally laughed out of court since the jury erupted in laughter when lyrics were read.
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slartabartfast
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2015/01/04 18:23:08
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dubdisciple
quantumeffect
I think you guys have this all backwards ... this should be a discussion about the damage to the Black Sabbath brand!
Better groups have been parodied in much more over the top ways with no damage to brand. I doubt this effects the legacy of anyone involved with Sabbath. Hard to damage the rep of a group who's lead singer is known for biting off bat heads and reality tv. Roy Orbison's estate tried to sue @-Live Crew for a raunchy parody of "pretty woman" but it was literally laughed out of court since the jury erupted in laughter when lyrics were read.
Actually, the issue in Campbell v. Acuff-Rose Music (92-1292), 510 U.S. 569 (1994) that was addressed by the Supreme Court was pretty much limited to the holding that the trial court had erred by deciding that the parody issue could be decided primarily on the intent of the infringer to make money, rather than to criticize (one of the statutory fair use exceptions which has been extended to include certain parodies) the original song. That same decision, which is popularly held as being a blanket defense of parody, includes this: "The fact that parody can claim legitimacy for some appropriation does not, of course, tell either parodist or judge much about where to draw the line. Like a book review quoting the copyrighted material criticized, parody may or may not be fair use, and petitioner's suggestion that any parodic use is presumptively fair has no more justification in law or fact than the equally hopeful claim that any use for news reporting should be presumed fair, see Harper & Row, 471 U. S., at 561"
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dubdisciple
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2015/01/05 13:14:57
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slartabartfast
dubdisciple
quantumeffect
I think you guys have this all backwards ... this should be a discussion about the damage to the Black Sabbath brand!
Better groups have been parodied in much more over the top ways with no damage to brand. I doubt this effects the legacy of anyone involved with Sabbath. Hard to damage the rep of a group who's lead singer is known for biting off bat heads and reality tv. Roy Orbison's estate tried to sue @-Live Crew for a raunchy parody of "pretty woman" but it was literally laughed out of court since the jury erupted in laughter when lyrics were read.
Actually, the issue in Campbell v. Acuff-Rose Music (92-1292), 510 U.S. 569 (1994) that was addressed by the Supreme Court was pretty much limited to the holding that the trial court had erred by deciding that the parody issue could be decided primarily on the intent of the infringer to make money, rather than to criticize (one of the statutory fair use exceptions which has been extended to include certain parodies) the original song. That same decision, which is popularly held as being a blanket defense of parody, includes this:
"The fact that parody can claim legitimacy for some appropriation does not, of course, tell either parodist or judge much about where to draw the line. Like a book review quoting the copyrighted material criticized, parody may or may not be fair use, and petitioner's suggestion that any parodic use is presumptively fair has no more justification in law or fact than the equally hopeful claim that any use for news reporting should be presumed fair, see Harper & Row, 471 U. S., at 561"
Actually, I was not using this as a sample of precedence of fair use. It is often cited in classes on fair use, but not my intent, since there are better examples. My point in mentioning this case was directly addressing a concern about brand damage. I doubt the song in question did any damage to Orbison's name or reputation. I suppose a more closely related example would be the great "Weird Al" Yankovic, who has made a career out of parody without damaging anyone's career. It can even be argued that his songs often bring attention to songs to people unlikely to listen to original on their own. Sales of Coolio's "Gangstas Paradise" had a spike in sells when "Amish Paradise" became popular despite Coolio's public disdain. Nobody would confuse Coolio and Weird Al and I doubt anyone would possibly confuse this group and Sabbath. McDonalds may have a stronger case for brand damage since the lyrics all seem to be somewhat of their product, but the case is hardly a slam dunk and not worth it to create free publicity for some bar band and coming off as the big evil corp.
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craigb
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Re: This May Be Creepier than Santa
2015/01/06 14:15:05
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Ah, a band thread. I thought this might be about Bapu's new avatar. My bad.
Time for all of you to head over to Beyond My DAW!
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