Beepster
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Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stuff.
This is yet another obvious and simple suggestion from a rather simplistic dude but it has been pretty useful for me so I thought I'd point it out. Since we are always getting new stuff now and pretty much all of us (even our hardened veterans) are constantly learning (if you aren't you are doing something wrong... lol) it can be a little anxiety inducing and possibly counterproductive poking around at new things within our musical babies. A project in the works is going to have a lot of factors that can alter the sound, force us to bend new tools/features to accomodate the project, distract from just getting used to new stuff and in the worst case scenarios potentially crash/corrupt what we are working on. For a while now I have been keeping "Test" projects for each version of Sonar. Most of them have veered off until full blown songs but now with Platinum I am keeping it simple. It is just a project named "Platinum Test" and all I have in it is a MIDI drum setup and one track routed to the line in on my interface for guitar/bass. No effects or nothing. Anytime I want to try something out or study an effect/synth in detail I open this project and add what I need (currently I am giving myself a crash course on GR5 and after that will be going through all the synths I have one at a time to really learn them). I can create presets for templates, effects, synths, etc in it. If I want to try out Sonar features or just explore I add whatever needs to be added (like I can record or drag in MIDI/audio then test things out on that). If I end up tracking some ideas I think I might want to keep and work on later I just use Save As to put it aside without screwing up the basic test project. Because there is very little in the project to begin with it isn't weighed down with a bunch of files or other factors that might make troubleshooting issues more complex (if something screws up I can be pretty certain it's that feature or synth... not something else in the project going wonky or conflicting). It's great for working through manuals, tuts and just jamming out on. Once I'm done I close without saving so I can just pop it open and start all over again. Because as I try things out and create presets and templates there is no reason to save the project because if I want to insert what I've done elsewhere I can just load it from teh browser or various loaders in the program. Of course, as I said, if I actually write something I want to keep it's just a matter of doing a Save As and now I have the backbone of a new project. Alternatively I can just do an export and drag the results into a new project as a "ghost" track or backer. Again, I know this is pretty obvious stuff but I find it useful and we've got a ton of new users it seems with the introduction of Sonar 2015 so sometimes the simplest of workflow suggestions can make a huge difference... and my back is ticking me off today (again... due to the damned spring rain) so I figured I would blather on for a while. Peace.
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Zargg
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/10 13:24:41
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Cool tip
Ken Nilsen ZarggBBZWin 10 Pro X64, Cakewalk by Bandlab, SPlat X64, AMD AM3+ fx-8320, 16Gb RAM, RME Ucx (+ ARC), Tascam FW 1884, M-Audio Keystation 61es, *AKAI MPK Pro 25, *Softube Console1, Alesis DM6 USB, Maschine MkII Laptop setup: Win 10 X64, i5 2.4ghz, 8gb RAM, 320gb 7200 RPM HD, Focusrite Solo, + *
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John
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/10 13:35:38
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I thought everyone did this. Good tip though.
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Zargg
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/10 14:04:46
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I (have started to) do a save as, when I open a project in a new version. I used to just dive in, and hope for the best. Been burned a few times
post edited by Zargg71 - 2015/05/10 14:44:14
Ken Nilsen ZarggBBZWin 10 Pro X64, Cakewalk by Bandlab, SPlat X64, AMD AM3+ fx-8320, 16Gb RAM, RME Ucx (+ ARC), Tascam FW 1884, M-Audio Keystation 61es, *AKAI MPK Pro 25, *Softube Console1, Alesis DM6 USB, Maschine MkII Laptop setup: Win 10 X64, i5 2.4ghz, 8gb RAM, 320gb 7200 RPM HD, Focusrite Solo, + *
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Beepster
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/10 14:16:55
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Yeah... it is a simple concept but like Zargg I end up getting into stuff and save and save and save until I've built up an actual project. For every release I've always started a "test" project that stayed named "test" until I realized "oh crap... this is now a song... better rename it". lulz Just kind of a mental/conceptual thing I guess but I think I might have tried out more stuff if I had actually kept my test project as an actual test project. For example there are a ton of things in SPlat I've been wanting to try out but I have been working on two specific things artistically. One was for an actual client so it wasn't really the type of thing to screwaround with (although I came up with the noise removal trick in that project) and the other is actually my X3 "test" which has turned into a full blown opus. Both of those were too important and/or huge and/or had so much other distracting things going on that it was preventing me from really trying anything. So if I wanted to do something I would create a new project, screw around and then exit without saving. But then I gotta do the prelim set up every time and yadda yadda. Silly and obvious? Totally but I guess it's just good habit building. You know how excited one can get with all sorts of new goodies or if you get the inclination to try something. The urge is to just go nutty on whatever is in front of you. IDK... I'm a spazz. lol
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/10 14:32:55
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Good idea Beep, and one i've been using for a while. I also have a couple of projects called "ideas" which are exactly what they suggest. Sometime it's just a guitar riff or a melody, chord sequence, others are Midi based with just a couple of tracks, Dim Pro & a piano usually suffice My latest project came about when auditioning loops from the browser. One of them I really liked so had a good listen to what was going on and recreated the loop using separate synths. This is now a 5 minute song.
CbB, Platinum, 64 bit throughoutCustom built i7 3930, 32Gb RAM, 2 x 1Tb Internal HDD, 1 x 1TB system SSD (Win 7), 1 x 500Gb system SSD (Win 10), 2 x 1Tb External HDD's, Dual boot Win 7 & Win 10 64 Bit, Saffire Pro 26, ISA One, Adam P11A,
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Gnarls
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/10 19:15:42
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Hi Beepster, thanks for this tip. I've been using various forms of Sonar (and benefiting hugely from this forum) for a while now, so your "obvious" suggestion is much appreciated. Cheers!
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Anderton
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/11 09:37:18
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I do something similar because I'm always doing little tests, coming up with audio examples, etc. I just create a new project with a nonsense title, like "dfhsjkf." Every now and then I go through the Projects folder and delete all the projects with titles that look like they were written by Martians.
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mudgel
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/11 10:00:33
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I have a base template that connects all my hardware, along with sufficient audio and MIDI tracks with all the necessary busses that I can load for an instant blank canvas. I have a mix project from a magazine comp that I kept for trialling. It's 34 tracks of audio and lets me try out features and fx in a known environment. I save a version with each new release of Sonar ie Allston to Dorchester (so far). Apart from planned projects I save noodling by dragging the audio and or midi tracks to Sonars browser. I have some folders already setup on my Projects drive. If plugins are involved then I save the whole project or save as plugin presets or fx chains as appropriate. i try to get noodles down to their basic audio and or midi components so I don't end up with endless array of meaningless projects full off ideas I can't catalog n some way. So from time to time I go back to those projects until the noodle project is empty of all audio and midi either deleted or dropped into Sonars browser or developed into a project I want to work on. Just some personal practices.
post edited by mudgel - 2015/05/11 10:10:27
Mike V. (MUDGEL) STUDIO: Win 10 Pro x64, SPlat & CbB x64, PC: ASUS Z370-A, INTEL i7 8700k, 32GIG DDR4 2400, OC 4.7Ghz. Storage: 7 TB SATA III, 750GiG SSD & Samsung 500 Gig 960 EVO NVMe M.2. Monitors: Adam A7X, JBL 10” Sub. Audio I/O & DSP Server: DIGIGRID IOS & IOX. Screen: Raven MTi + 43" HD 4K TV Monitor. Keyboard Controller: Native Instruments Komplete Kontrol S88.
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bitflipper
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/11 10:25:50
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Anderton I just create a new project with a nonsense title, like "dfhsjkf." Every now and then I go through the Projects folder and delete all the projects with titles that look like they were written by Martians.
My most frequently-seen SONAR message: "A project named asdf already exists."
 All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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mudgel
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/11 10:29:56
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bitflipper
Anderton I just create a new project with a nonsense title, like "dfhsjkf." Every now and then I go through the Projects folder and delete all the projects with titles that look like they were written by Martians.
My most frequently-seen SONAR message: "A project named asdf already exists."
Haha. Mine's "123..."
Mike V. (MUDGEL) STUDIO: Win 10 Pro x64, SPlat & CbB x64, PC: ASUS Z370-A, INTEL i7 8700k, 32GIG DDR4 2400, OC 4.7Ghz. Storage: 7 TB SATA III, 750GiG SSD & Samsung 500 Gig 960 EVO NVMe M.2. Monitors: Adam A7X, JBL 10” Sub. Audio I/O & DSP Server: DIGIGRID IOS & IOX. Screen: Raven MTi + 43" HD 4K TV Monitor. Keyboard Controller: Native Instruments Komplete Kontrol S88.
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Beepster
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/11 10:58:21
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I'm glad people are sharing their "test" workflows here. It's giving me ideas to refine how I do things and it's just plain interesting to see how others do stuff... especially the more experienced folks. One thing I did a while back that I haven't really messed with in a while but intend to return to is this... I created a project with a drum sim, an instance of Zeta with a realistic generic bass sound (Alembic Bass preset if anyone is interested but it could be anything... the Studio Instruments bass would probably be a good, simple choice for this) and blank guitar track. In the MIDI bass track I programmed in some blues, jazz, rock and song specific bass parts. Mostly just 4/4 stuff like 12 bar blues, simple jazz progressions, etc and I actually put in the bassline for Little Wing because I just like jamming over that. All these progressions are in the track's take lanes and I've set the clips up so there is one full revolution of the whole progressions. I set the MIDI clips up as Groove Clips. So now I can decide what I want to jam over (this is essentially to work on guitar improvisation), solo the lane that contains the bass progression, drag in an appropriate MIDI drum loop into the drum track and then just create loop points that span the whole progression. I then jam into the guitar track with whatever sim/sound I want for however long I want. I can easily change the tempo (obviously) but in the MIDI bass track I can just use the track's transpose control to easily play in any key I want. If I want to actually record something to use all I have to do is drag out the bass and drum groove clips to the length I want and disable looping and record the guitar part. That clip can be inserted into anything I want afterward or I can just do a Save As and have a new project on the go. As I find new progressions I want to try out or write stuff I can just add an extra lane to the MIDI bass track. Instant backup band to jam with. Cheers.
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BobF
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/11 11:13:00
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I could see this going a step further. A benchmark project that includes audio and MIDI using only the plugs/VSTi included with Sonar. Something that could be downloaded and used for apples/apples performance comparisons.
Bob -- Angels are crying because truth has died ...Illegitimi non carborundum --Studio One Pro / i7-6700@3.80GHZ, 32GB Win 10 Pro x64 Roland FA06, LX61+, Fishman Tripleplay, FaderPort, US-16x08 + ARC2.5/Event PS8s Waves Gold/IKM Max/Nomad Factory IS3/K11U
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Beepster
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/11 11:21:31
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hmm... slightly veering off into the discussion from the other day but it's a good idea. Could make a series of projects rated 1-10 (or even more) with one being an average, small resource useage project and 10 (or the top end of the scale) being a completely impractical resource hogging project intended to essentially max out even the most poerful systems. Then come up with a set of instructions that get the user to insert the Perf module and learn how to read the resource monitor in Windows to see how their system handles each, increasingly oppressive project. They report the results and exactly what their specs are and what hardware they are using. Then troubleshooting and cataloging of variations (like system settings and installed programs) can occur. That's very complex but a more organized (and tech saavy) mind than mine should be able to come up with a way to sort and document it all. Cheers.
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brundlefly
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/11 11:26:10
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The SONAR demo projects are useful for this. They use only bundled content, and everyone has access.
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BobF
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/11 11:26:12
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Even without an exhaustive cataloging process up front, having something that could be loaded up by two people while one helps the other thru a troubleshooting session would certainly be beneficial. And being able to report problems to The Pastry Shoppe using a standard project would be very cool. I think. Sorry for the drift ... I can't help it. It's an attention deficit thing
Bob -- Angels are crying because truth has died ...Illegitimi non carborundum --Studio One Pro / i7-6700@3.80GHZ, 32GB Win 10 Pro x64 Roland FA06, LX61+, Fishman Tripleplay, FaderPort, US-16x08 + ARC2.5/Event PS8s Waves Gold/IKM Max/Nomad Factory IS3/K11U
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Beepster
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/11 11:39:27
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Man... he's probably busy but the guy I think who could really give our systems some good workout projects would be Mr. Roseberry. I'm sure he has his own set of diagnostic procedures and programs but I'm guessing he would know exactly how to hurt our rigs in just the right way across multiple user needs (like my needs as a MIDI/audio guy is going to be differnt than a pure audio guy or a pure MIDI opus writing guy... or gals of course) to isolate and expose potential issues.
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Beepster
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/11 11:39:27
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Rob[at]Sound-Rehab
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/11 13:54:50
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brundlefly The SONAR demo projects are useful for this. They use only bundled content, and everyone has access.
I have always wondered why people never use the bundled demo projects when it comes to verifying a problem someone else reported ...
GOOD TUNES LAST FOREVER +++ Visit the Rehab +++ DAW: Platinum/X3e, win10 64 bit, i7-3930K (6x3.2GHz), Asus Sabertooth X79, 32 GB DDR3 1600MHz, ATI HD 5450, 120 GB SSD OCZ Agility3, 2x 1TB WD HDD SATA 600 Audio-Interface: 2x MOTU 1248 AVB, Focusrite OctoPre, (Roland Octa-Capture) Control-Surface: VS-700C VSTi: WAVES, NI K10u, FabFilter, IK, ... (too many really)
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mudgel
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Re: Tip: Create and save a "Test" project to try out new builds/tools and to learn new stu
2015/05/12 03:49:14
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There were some benchmarking projects around quite some time ago.
I think around Sonar 8 or so when there were lots of 'motor boating' issues and discussions about Sonars audio engine.
I'll have a look in my archives. If I find one I'll upload it and post a link to my Onedrive/public folder
Mike V. (MUDGEL) STUDIO: Win 10 Pro x64, SPlat & CbB x64, PC: ASUS Z370-A, INTEL i7 8700k, 32GIG DDR4 2400, OC 4.7Ghz. Storage: 7 TB SATA III, 750GiG SSD & Samsung 500 Gig 960 EVO NVMe M.2. Monitors: Adam A7X, JBL 10” Sub. Audio I/O & DSP Server: DIGIGRID IOS & IOX. Screen: Raven MTi + 43" HD 4K TV Monitor. Keyboard Controller: Native Instruments Komplete Kontrol S88.
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