Helpful ReplyUSB DAC on a laptop

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noynekker
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2017/04/16 00:25:46 (permalink)

USB DAC on a laptop

Now that I can use Cakewalk Platinum with WASAPI Exclusive drivers, my next problem to solve is that the headphone plugin on my laptop renders poor quality audio. I found a device that may solve this, but wonder if it's just a gimmick or the real thing ?
 
It's a small portable digital to audio converter that plugs into the headphone jack, acting as a pre amp, that supposedly increases the fidelity of the headphone jack . . . also increases the fidelity input to external speakers ?
 
Has anyone used one of these ? The one I'm looking at online is the Dragonfly Series by Audioquest.

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#1
AT
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/16 02:25:16 (permalink)
So it is gonna convert a lesser analog headphone signal from your built-in card to digital, then back into analog and then boost the signal.  The fidelity will be less after another round of ADDA and, at best, you'll send the same lesser signal to your headphones. While there may be some volume advantage with a stronger amp, it is the same quality signal (at best) that your built-in card gave you since that is where the signal still originates from. 

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synkrotron
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/16 02:55:22 (permalink)
I think that some laptops come equipped with an analogue and optical digital headphone socket so it would be D to A and not A to D to A

Perhaps the OP could confirm...

Edit: just to clarify, I mean on the same connection. I have a mini disc player that has this kind of connection and I am pretty certain that my CLEVO laptop does.

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synkrotron
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/16 03:03:53 (permalink)
Ah... Wait a minute... I just googled audioquest dragonfly and all is clear now. Sounds interesting and might indeed work, but I am assuming that you would have to set it up to work as an audio device just like any USB audio interface

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#4
Cactus Music
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/16 14:56:21 (permalink)
I don't think I've ever heard of someone complaining about laptop headphone jack producing unusable sound quality? 
I've owned and used many many laptops and often use the headphone jack , I've played umpteen dozen gigs using the headphone output into a large PA. It always sounded very good to my ears. At least if it was bad I'm pretty sure I would have noticed. And having spent day's and days with only a laptop< sonar and a set of medium quality headphones to work with, I conclude that it's never the issue. Seems the quality of th headphones is most important, not the D/A.
I am totally aware that the D/A in the on board sound chip has to has cost about $1.00. 
I just don't really see if there could be a noticeable difference unless like you say you have the one in a hundred laptop that has very low quality output. 
 
I look at that device and I can only imagine it uses the same D/A chip as many laptops. I would really want to have the option of sending it back if it turns out to be a farce. 
I would take the $130-$250 and invest in some real good headphones. 

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#5
filtersweep
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/16 20:32:06 (permalink)
Real good headphones might expose the deficiencies of the onboard D-A. Not attempting to be an audiophile snob, but I think there is quite a significant difference between the audio outs of my laptop and my audio interface. The difference may be less noticable if the source is compressed radio ready sound. I suspect the $1 converter on board is probably optimized for that source. When the source is raw vst or unprocessed audio I think the difference in quality is undeniable.
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Kev999
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/16 22:17:15 (permalink)
noynekker
...It's a small portable digital to audio converter that plugs into the headphone jack, acting as a pre amp, that supposedly increases the fidelity of the headphone jack...

 
If it's any sort of DAC, it definitely does not connect that way.

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#7
noynekker
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/16 23:38:08 (permalink)
 
Thanks for the responses everyone, some very interesting insights.
 
From the AudioQuest site, here's the blurb:
 
"Launched in 2012, press and public alike have enthusiastically embraced AudioQuest’s multi-award-winning DragonFly USB digital-to-analog converter/preamp/headphone amp as the rare audio product that bridges the gap between die-hard audiophiles and mainstream music lovers.
DragonFly plugs into a computer’s USB port to bypass the computer’s compromised audio circuitry and deliver cleaner, clearer, more naturally beautiful sound to headphones, powered speakers, and complete audio systems. Small, affordable, easy to use, and remarkably effective, DragonFly was named Stereophile’s 2012 “Computer Audio Component of the Year” and 2012 “Budget Component of the Year;” Tone Audio’s 2012 “Digital Product of the Year;” Computer Audiophile’s 2012 “Computer Audiophile Product of the Year;” AudioStream’s “Greatest Bits;” and What Hi-Fi?’s 2014 “Product of the Year.”
 
@ Kev999 . . . you are correct, I was mistaken, it doesn't plug into the headphone jack, it's a USB device, so there must be drivers to install . . . if it truly bypasses any computer's audio circuitry, isn't it just another audio interface ? . . . except when you're actually recording, it must still be routed through the computer's main audio interface.
 
@ filtersweep, synkrotron, and AT . . . I definitely hear a difference plugging the headphones between my USB Audio device, as opposed to directly into the laptop headphone jack . . . it wasn't a cheap laptop, it cost around $2500 CDN, so I was expecting the audio components to be half decent, but it seems I have to customize it further for serious audio, since this laptop was not originally "designed" for audio work.
 
@ Cactus Music . . . guess I'll just have to take my laptop and some of my mixes to the retailer, and actually hear the difference. I'm curious to see how the sound is altered by this device, and whether it's an accurate reference for monitoring the projects.
 
The headphones I use are KRK KNS-8400 . . . so not top of the line, but still $300 decent.
Of course, I use this laptop for mobile recording and composing . . . I still only trust my main studio desktop system for final mixes.

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#8
noynekker
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/16 23:53:09 (permalink)
Perhaps this thing is merely an upgrade from the onboard "$1.00" D to A converter.
Though, I'm thinking what you hear, and what's gets recorded might be quite different.
 
It either colours the output to make listening back more pleasurable, or it improves the overall fidelity of cheap laptop parts . . . guess I'll have to go hear and find out for myself.
 
I was hoping someone here would say . . . "I use a USB DAC all the time, can't live without it" . . . maybe this does not have a place in Pro audio circles, and is more of a consumer audiophile thing ?

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#9
Jim Roseberry
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/17 12:45:54 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby tlw 2017/04/17 22:20:38
For $200, you can get a decent dedicated audio interface with proper ASIO driver.
For audio work, you're going to be much better off going that route.
Lower latency, higher-quality A/D D/A, rock solid driver, etc.

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#10
AT
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/17 14:37:24 (permalink)
Yea, I didn't understand that it was a USB DA.  For $200, you can get a good 2-way interface.
 
 

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#11
Cactus Music
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/17 15:32:51 (permalink)
Thee are at least 3 interfaces that come with decent ASIO drivers for $100.  That was going to be  my first response, but I understand people not wishing to drag around a 2 lb box. 
I take my Scarlett with me if I'm going to do anything critical. But as I said, there absolutely nothing I notice wrong with any of my laptops headphone jacks... sound just fine to me.. 
 
That little USB dongle looks like it would be OK but I'll only pay $29 for something like that as I would say it's all hype. $150 gets you a heck of a lot more with a small interface. 

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#12
tlw
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/17 22:22:54 (permalink)
Don't forget to buy some Audioquest USB cables to go with it, their very, very expensive audiophile USB cables really massively improve digital audio. Just like their $1,000+ mains leads do.

Apparently.

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synkrotron
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/18 01:45:30 (permalink)
noynekkerit wasn't a cheap laptop, it cost around $2500 CDN, so I was expecting the audio components to be half decent, but it seems I have to customize it further for serious audio, since this laptop was not originally "designed" for audio work.



Wow! yeah, I've just checked the exchange rate and that is, indeed, an expensive laptop. I agree with everyone that, for music creation, you need a proper ASIO interface. 
 
That said, I listen to music through my laptop headphone jack all the time, and the sound is excellent, in my opinion, although I would never use it as my Sonar sound device.
 
cheers
 
andy

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#14
Beagle
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/18 17:37:30 (permalink)
I use a Roland DuoCapture with my laptop to output Sonar to a PA.  $179
http://www.guitarcenter.c...udio-MIDI-Interface.gc
 
I had used a presonus audiobox for a short time, but couldn't get solid playback via their drivers (which I think is probably just USB Codec disguised as ASIO via wrapper, but that's just conjecture).
 
the duocapture runs on batteries or DC wall wart which I liked as opposed to running on USB power.  however, I recommend buying the DC power adapter (sold separately) instead of trying to use batteries all the time.  from experience:  I left the batteries in the case too long.  acid everywhere!  luckily it didn't ruin the unit, but I can no longer use it with batteries, only with DC power.
 
solid drivers, excellent sound, also includes a couple of inputs if I need them for remote recording.

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noynekker
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/19 03:17:29 (permalink)
tlw
Don't forget to buy some Audioquest USB cables to go with it, their very, very expensive audiophile USB cables really massively improve digital audio. Just like their $1,000+ mains leads do.

Apparently.

TLW, sarcasm recognized and appreciated . . . I'm also starting to see this device as audiophile overhype.
 . . . though, it's just across the bridge, and really I must go have a listen.

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#16
noynekker
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/19 03:29:57 (permalink)
Beagle
I use a Roland DuoCapture with my laptop to output Sonar to a PA.  $179
http://www.guitarcenter.c...udio-MIDI-Interface.gc
 
I had used a presonus audiobox for a short time, but couldn't get solid playback via their drivers (which I think is probably just USB Codec disguised as ASIO via wrapper, but that's just conjecture).
 
the duocapture runs on batteries or DC wall wart which I liked as opposed to running on USB power.  however, I recommend buying the DC power adapter (sold separately) instead of trying to use batteries all the time.  from experience:  I left the batteries in the case too long.  acid everywhere!  luckily it didn't ruin the unit, but I can no longer use it with batteries, only with DC power.
 
solid drivers, excellent sound, also includes a couple of inputs if I need them for remote recording.


Beagle, thanks for the input . . . I actually have an acceptable USB interface for my laptop (Steinberg UR22 mk II) . . . $200 CDN, ASIO drivers, USB bus powered  etc . . . but there are times, on the road, in the hotel room, in the truck, when I just want simplicity . . . for example: just the laptop and the "Acoustic Guitar VST" to write a song in the moment, that's where the appeal of the USB DAC comes in, since my laptop headphone plug doesn't cut it.

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#17
Zo
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Re: USB DAC on a laptop 2017/04/26 00:43:47 (permalink)
The Mobil UA from Roland is what i use for cours and on the go : unbeatable sound quyality (32 bits resolution ) and drivers latency imprssive (the only usb card that i succed to go Under 64 samples of buffer size via usb) and i own RME and other great stuff ;)

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