lfm
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Understanding differences between active and selected tracks - is it how you want it?
Clicking name of track - it's selected in Inspector, but not selected
Most parts in track header do it like this - part for track number, then track is selected.
I don't remember having this difference in other daws.
I remember having real difficulties getting 10 years ago starting with Sonar 4, when exporting a mix and get all in there that I expect.
And still a bit confused by this approach - smart tools does not work like I want to clicking on clips they are not selected always.
There are options whether to arm tracks for recording by selecting them - but are there any settins to choose how this works active/selected etc?
I certainly would like a different approach than default. I put a screaming red background color on track number to really see selected tracks easily.
Are you happy with this way of operating selections?
Clicking on name in console view track is shown in inspector, but not selected as such - confuses me.
Most operations, deleting tracks and stuff depend on selection and often give me unexpected result.
I got an excellent help the other day to alter how Sonar handles Solo/Mute in Aud.ini and now works exactly like I find intuitive.
Something like that for selections, maybe?
Thanks.
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Rob[at]Sound-Rehab
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Re: Understanding differences between active and selected tracks - is it how you want it?
2015/04/03 07:47:09
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lfm
Clicking name of track - it's selected in Inspector, but not selected
Most parts in track header do it like this - part for track number, then track is selected.
The way I understand it ... I activate a track from the control surface and channel strip, ProCh, etc. get the focus for editing ... I select tracks by mouse (for export, cloning, etc.) ... but my control surface stays focused on what i had selected ... One (action) shouldn't necessarily change the other (selection) ... and selections don't need to be the same ... lfm
I got an excellent help the other day to alter how Sonar handles Solo/Mute in Aud.ini and now works exactly like I find intuitive.
I think I missed that ... what was it about?
GOOD TUNES LAST FOREVER +++ Visit the Rehab +++ DAW: Platinum/X3e, win10 64 bit, i7-3930K (6x3.2GHz), Asus Sabertooth X79, 32 GB DDR3 1600MHz, ATI HD 5450, 120 GB SSD OCZ Agility3, 2x 1TB WD HDD SATA 600 Audio-Interface: 2x MOTU 1248 AVB, Focusrite OctoPre, (Roland Octa-Capture) Control-Surface: VS-700C VSTi: WAVES, NI K10u, FabFilter, IK, ... (too many really)
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lfm
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Re: Understanding differences between active and selected tracks - is it how you want it?
2015/04/03 07:56:50
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FreeFlyBertl
lfm
I got an excellent help the other day to alter how Sonar handles Solo/Mute in Aud.ini and now works exactly like I find intuitive.
I think I missed that ... what was it about?
Scook gave me the resolving solution of getting all about a track - audio and sends - to follow the mute principles - this whether pre/post fader sends. Variable is visible in prefs "LinkPFSendMute" On Topic: For me I would like clicking anywhere on a track header, or a clip header to select that track. This both in TV and CV. Don't remember doing such a separation in any other daw. Maybe LinkTrackActivationAndSelection=1 or something. Time selections are bit different - you may want a loop range to remain selected while you select partial of a clip etc.
post edited by lfm - 2015/04/03 08:15:03
Cubase Pro 9 with SA2015 as backup - W7 i7 2.8GHz 16G GeForce GT 730 - RME HDSP 9632 + AI4S
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icontakt
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Re: Understanding differences between active and selected tracks - is it how you want it?
2015/04/03 08:45:12
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I also don't appreciate the behavior in Sonar to be honest. The below is a quote from my own thread I posted about a year ago. -----  As the screenshot indicates, a "focused track" and a "selected track" are two different things in Sonar. This is quite inconvenient because, for example, if you hit Alt+3 wanting to display only the "selected" tracks in the PRV, it also displays the "focused" track, which you don’t want displayed. Similarly, when you want to solo the "focused" track by hitting Alt+S (this is "Solo All Selected Tracks" and I have to use this because there's no shortcut key to solo the "focused" track), it solos the "selected" track(s) as well. You could easily edit/delete clips on another track accidentally/unintentionally because of the current behavior. I hope there’ll be an option to change it.
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icontakt
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Re: Understanding differences between active and selected tracks - is it how you want it?
2015/04/03 08:53:02
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Tak T. Primary Laptop: Core i7-4710MQ CPU, 16GB RAM, 7200RPM HDD, Windows 7 Home Premium OS (Japanese) x64 SP1Secondary Laptop: Core2 Duo CPU, 8GB RAM, 7200RPM HDD, Windows 7 Professional OS (Japanese) x64 SP1Audio Interface: iD14 (ASIO)Keyboard Controller/MIDI Interface: A-800PRODAW: SONAR Platinum x64 (latest update installed)
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bitman
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Re: Understanding differences between active and selected tracks - is it how you want it?
2015/04/03 09:40:03
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As I understand it. Prior to X2a, There was a workflow issue where you could be working say on the bass in the prochannel and you desired to mute the kick, so you mouse over to the track view or the console view and click the kick track's mute. BOOM!, your prochannel now is the kick track's prochannel just because you clicked a control on the kick track. No longer does Sonar select or focus a track upon control change for that reason.
Onward and upward............
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Anderton
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Re: Understanding differences between active and selected tracks - is it how you want it?
2015/04/03 10:04:23
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I agree with those who find the separation of focus and selection confusing, but I also agree with those who recognize why this is useful.
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lfm
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Re: Understanding differences between active and selected tracks - is it how you want it?
2015/04/03 10:07:31
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Thanks to Icontakt for always good illustrations as well as good input. bitman
As I understand it. Prior to X2a, There was a workflow issue where you could be working say on the bass in the prochannel and you desired to mute the kick, so you mouse over to the track view or the console view and click the kick track's mute. BOOM!, your prochannel now is the kick track's prochannel just because you clicked a control on the kick track. No longer does Sonar select or focus a track upon control change for that reason.
Onward and upward............
What you mentioned are probably things that influenced this behavior. But making this by choice in preferences would not hurt. Buttons like mute/solo are not always what you want to select a track as well. So thinking of like an integer in settings used as flags for parts that you want linked. Bit0=0/1 ; track header panel linked or not Bit1=0/1 ; mute button Bit2=0/1 ; solo button Bit3=0/1 ; track name field Beit4=0/1 ; Track header(what is seen as minimized state) or similar approach. If bit is set, Sonar also see to that track becomes selected. Using a global variable in software for such operations handling mouse events is really easy to do. So if setting is a bit hacker level, as a first step, does not matter. In time one can make preference dialog extended etc. We have some now for mouse, whether to move now time by clicking here and there etc. Rightclick do this, double click do that.... Maybe separate option bit for right click, left click, etc... In general in AUD.ini or for mouse operations what quite often got it's own preferences page. Example 1 You want everything as it is today. LinkActivationAndSelectionFlags=0; Example 2 You want clicking everything mentioned above but mute/solo to also select Track. LinkTrackActivationAndSelectionFlags=0x19 ; binary 11001 You have a separate bit for track fader, pan etc. Selection are probably among the most common things you do while working a project. And the more you can customize that - is a huge thing making you feel good about the workflow of your daw.
post edited by lfm - 2015/04/03 10:46:47
Cubase Pro 9 with SA2015 as backup - W7 i7 2.8GHz 16G GeForce GT 730 - RME HDSP 9632 + AI4S
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bitman
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Re: Understanding differences between active and selected tracks - is it how you want it?
2015/04/03 11:13:55
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lfm
Thanks to Icontakt for always good illustrations as well as good input.
bitman
As I understand it. Prior to X2a, There was a workflow issue where you could be working say on the bass in the prochannel and you desired to mute the kick, so you mouse over to the track view or the console view and click the kick track's mute. BOOM!, your prochannel now is the kick track's prochannel just because you clicked a control on the kick track. No longer does Sonar select or focus a track upon control change for that reason.
Onward and upward............
What you mentioned are probably things that influenced this behavior.
But making this by choice in preferences would not hurt.
Buttons like mute/solo are not always what you want to select a track as well.
So thinking of like an integer in settings used as flags for parts that you want linked.
Bit0=0/1 ; track header panel linked or not
Bit1=0/1 ; mute button
Bit2=0/1 ; solo button
Bit3=0/1 ; track name field
Beit4=0/1 ; Track header(what is seen as minimized state)
or similar approach.
If bit is set, Sonar also see to that track becomes selected.
Using a global variable in software for such operations handling mouse events is really easy to do.
So if setting is a bit hacker level, as a first step, does not matter.
In time one can make preference dialog extended etc.
We have some now for mouse, whether to move now time by clicking here and there etc.
Rightclick do this, double click do that....
Maybe separate option bit for right click, left click, etc...
In general in AUD.ini or for mouse operations what quite often got it's own preferences page.
Example 1
You want everything as it is today.
LinkActivationAndSelectionFlags=0;
Example 2
You want clicking everything mentioned above but mute/solo to also select Track.
LinkTrackActivationAndSelectionFlags=0x19 ; binary 11001
You have a separate bit for track fader, pan etc.
Selection are probably among the most common things you do while working a project. And the more you can customize that - is a huge thing making you feel good about the workflow of your daw.
Perhaps, but I have no control (thankfully) over these things. When X2a came out I thought "It's Broke!" because my control surface code was following the old way of doing things where changing a strip widget selected the widget's track inside sonar. With every option in any software's preferences will be a blessing to some, and cause tech support calls and Baker clarification of those things on this board for others. It's a teeter totter balancing act for sure! Happy Friday and Rock On.
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konradh
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Re: Understanding differences between active and selected tracks - is it how you want it?
2015/04/03 15:14:14
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I often click on a track in the track view, but the track in the Inpsector/ProChannel is different. This has caused me to alter EQ or Sends for the wrong track many times.
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Rob[at]Sound-Rehab
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Re: Understanding differences between active and selected tracks - is it how you want it?
2015/04/03 15:32:08
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customization is key to global happiness :-)
if there is a change requested to clarify this situation, it must be up to the user to decided which way it should work for him/her ... I reckon I wouldn't change from what it is like at the moment, but I'm easily convinced if the outcome is something better workflow-wise with the option of going back to current status quo ...
GOOD TUNES LAST FOREVER +++ Visit the Rehab +++ DAW: Platinum/X3e, win10 64 bit, i7-3930K (6x3.2GHz), Asus Sabertooth X79, 32 GB DDR3 1600MHz, ATI HD 5450, 120 GB SSD OCZ Agility3, 2x 1TB WD HDD SATA 600 Audio-Interface: 2x MOTU 1248 AVB, Focusrite OctoPre, (Roland Octa-Capture) Control-Surface: VS-700C VSTi: WAVES, NI K10u, FabFilter, IK, ... (too many really)
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lfm
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Re: Understanding differences between active and selected tracks - is it how you want it?
2015/04/03 15:39:22
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bitman
When X2a came out I thought "It's Broke!" because my control surface code was following the old way of doing things where changing a strip widget selected the widget's track inside sonar.
With every option in any software's preferences will be a blessing to some, and cause tech support calls and Baker clarification of those things on this board for others.
It's a teeter totter balancing act for sure!
Happy Friday and Rock On.
There are a number of things to consider, touch screens, control surfaces, normal keyboard and mouse. So it could be it's best have a flag for each of these how it should work, to be backwards compatible. [Off topic a bit:]Control surfaces.... I tested Personus Faderport, but it was no benefit at all. This previous/next principle doesn't work so well. Track view has some tracks hidden, others in folders - and ýou had no idea where you were at. Softube Console 1 is on the right track in my view, one button to immediately put you on a tracks strip(at least by modulo 20, you have to shift page). To bad it isn't running as daw controller, and also select the track for you. Maybe that is enhanced by now. I talked to Steinberg about VST plugin standard to have a call that a plugin can ask to open up gui for it. Then you could make controllers that do what Console 1 do - in Sonar and other hosts - make a controller open any slot directly. You could really make low cost controller that don't need 24/32/48 fancy motorized faders. It would be such a treat to just position on any track with a simple controller like Novation Launchpad mini or something - up to 64 tracks and be there in a sec - and if you like throw up the strip as a default. So keeping projects the same - bass on 1st track, drums on next 10 tracks and similar way you would soon have in your backbone which button to press without looking - what a thrill. Haven't looked, but ProChannel can maybe be addressed directly by track number and do that stuff. If Gibson/Cakewalk come up with a 64 button track selector - and some specified option knob/buttons like Softube did with their strip - might be in demand. And open any plugin slot as you wish - and bring into view. What a boost that would be - end of the era to scroll screen like crazy to find your stuff. But having that in place - they could do like Faderport, have single motorized fader for the active track working. Console 1 is really overpriced for hardware of today for just a few buttons. Gibson/Cakewalk console could ship for $500 or so, now made in China - the rest is in Sonar. [/Off Topic a bit]
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williamcopper
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Re: Understanding differences between active and selected tracks - is it how you want it?
2015/04/04 11:21:56
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Just to chime in, I agree the select stuff is another bad design decision ... but I'd made so many 'feature suggestions' that I've just learned to waste the clicks and figure out for sure what is selected before doing any thing damaging. At least for "delete tracks" they now indicate "how many tracks" ... wish they'd add that little feature for "wipe track(s)" too.
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azslow3
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Re: Understanding differences between active and selected tracks - is it how you want it?
2015/04/05 04:43:33
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lfm
[Off topic a bit:]
Control surfaces....
I tested Personus Faderport, but it was no benefit at all. This previous/next principle doesn't work so well. Track view has some tracks hidden, others in folders - and ýou had no idea where you were at.
Softube Console 1 is on the right track in my view, one button to immediately put you on a tracks strip(at least by modulo 20, you have to shift page). To bad it isn't running as daw controller, and also select the track for you. Maybe that is enhanced by now.
I talked to Steinberg about VST plugin standard to have a call that a plugin can ask to open up gui for it. Then you could make controllers that do what Console 1 do - in Sonar and other hosts - make a controller open any slot directly. You could really make low cost controller that don't need 24/32/48 fancy motorized faders. It would be such a treat to just position on any track with a simple controller like Novation Launchpad mini or something - up to 64 tracks and be there in a sec - and if you like throw up the strip as a default. So keeping projects the same - bass on 1st track, drums on next 10 tracks and similar way you would soon have in your backbone which button to press without looking - what a thrill.
[/Off Topic a bit]
Sorry for commenting on Off Topic part, but somehow related. What is called making the strip "current" from CS is yet another animal. It is a kind of focusing without really showing that has happened. Doing such CS focusing in combination with key simulation and other operations give the way to "focus" and "select" strip. That is how Mackie Control plug-in implement that. You can open GUI of any plug-in from CS. That is related to current "focus". So focus "Track 12 FX 5" (so ACT context is switched to it) and/or open its GUI works.
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gswitz
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Re: Understanding differences between active and selected tracks - is it how you want it?
2015/04/05 06:40:09
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I have thought it has to do with the multi-point touch functionality. It was never necessary when working with Controllers. It showed up at the same time as multi-point touch. A toggle to disable the focus/selected separation should also reduce touch to a single point. Since you can touch 10 tracks at once, which track should get the focus/selection. If every time you touch a different track to turn on mute or solo, the track shown in the Inspector changed, it would be a serious problem. I did find this selection/focus scheme extremely confusing when it was first introduced. It caused me to change the fader on the wrong track many times. For me, it was the most confusing when I was working on an automation envelope in a track, but the track had not taken the Selected role. At this point, having used it this way for years, it no longer confuses me. I don't accidentally change the wrong track's parameters. One thing I do is set track icons and change track colors. These can be visible cues as to which track is currently in the inspector without having to read the label at the bottom. While I feel I understand the reason for the separation between focus and selection, I wonder if a better way of handling the division between the two won't present itself in the next few years. Personally, I can't think of an easy solution. I think many people don't realize how complicated it must make the application to have a possible 10 threads that can run concurrently (one for each finger). It makes the threading for the finding of the VSTs on startup seem trivial. Or the threading for the drawing of the wave-forms. Notice that communication between the main thread to the drawing thread was just added to advise the drawing thread to pause work while the main thread leaned heavily on IO for playback/record purposes. I must say, the touch nature of the app is REALLY intuitive. It's so cool. Sometimes, I have trouble with touch. Consider the flyout EQ. I have trouble adjusting Q with pinch. Touch works fine for gain and frequency, but I've learned to go to the nob to adjust Q. In general I think touch is awesome. It is especially great when the leader of the band you recorded is sitting at the desk with you and she can twiddle the nobs and faders at the same time you do.
post edited by gswitz - 2015/04/05 06:46:10
StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen. I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
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