Treefight
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V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
I realize this is probably the wrong forum, but for the V-Studio 700, the full monty (controller, interface, and Fantom VS), it seems like a sweet deal. My pretty obvious concern is compatibility/usability with X3. I checked the V-Studio forum and there is some info, but not much. The 700 is so outdated, but at this price, wouldn't the synth alone be almost worth it (?) I'm just wondering if X3 upgraders are noticing less compatibilities with the 700, especially re: the control surface, i.e., does it really control plugins better than, say, the MCU Pro? OR is it just another ACT controller? Does it work with channel strips? I would be using it for my "Studio B," as I have MCUs/XTs on my "Studio A." IS IT WORTH IT? Link: http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/VStudio700B Thanks!
post edited by Treefight - 2013/11/21 15:32:42
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Marcus Curtis
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/21 14:54:36
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Marcus Curtis
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 12:49:24
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I will say that when this was released it cost around $4,700.00. They want 1,500 for this and they are offering a free upgrade to Sonar X3 Professional which retails for $499.00. So really this will wind up costing about 1,000 for the audio interface. That is if you were to buy it separately and you don't already own X3 or an older version of Sonar.
I have the VS-100 which is a much more scaled down version of this. I can tell you that the preamps are rock solid and the drivers have always worked well with my system. What you should do is compare this to other audio interfaces that cost around $1000.00 to $1100.00. See if there is anything out there you would like better.
This deal is there because this has been discontinued. Cakewalk will still offer support for it. but this product line is not being developed any further. It does work well with Sonar X3.
It's worth is really something that only you can determine. I think it is a good deal. For me it would cost the full $1,500.00 because I already own X3. I am not gaining anything extra. First time Sonar users may find this an exceptional value.
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John T
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 14:07:16
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It's working well with X3, and a few bugs have been fixed, which I'm fairly impressed by, given that it's basically discontinued. However, the indications are that Cakewalk aren't going to do much more with it; Noel has been talking about open sourcing the V700 code. So... hmmm. It really is an excellent bit of kit, but what lifespan it will have is anyone's guess.
It's also worth noting that both X1 and X2 broke all kinds of functionality, and while it's more or less back to where it should be with X3, it's hard to feel confident about the future with it. I'm sure it will become less and less of a priority, and I know that internal testing of v700 compatibility is less than rigorous. (Sorry to say, but them's the facts).
That price is really a bargain for what you'll get, and as an overall setup it works really well. I'm just not sure how future proof it is. I use mine all day every day, I will say that. It will be painful when and if a Sonar update that doesn't work with it arrives. Indeed, as I say above, that's already happened more than once, and it was indeed painful.
Not trying to put you off, or criticise anyone, but I think it's best you go into it with your eyes open.
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John T
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 14:09:48
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At this point in time, it feels like a missed opportunity. A lower price point version, without the spurious video features and the Fantom synth could have really been big, I'm sure.
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Treefight
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 14:11:44
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Thank you both, what you've both said is kind of what I figured, but it's good to hear it confirmed.
The only other "selling point" for me would be the inclusion of the Fantom VS synth. However, it's hard (for me anyhow) to judge what it's worth because I can't find a direct price comparison with any other Fantom synths. Obviously it doesn't come with weighted, full-size keyboard, so that's a factor, but as far a sounds, etc., without knowing more, it would appear that it would add significant value (?) beyond just the interface (I do already own X3).
Any thoughts?
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tonydean
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 14:25:27
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Thanks for the up about this offer OP.
I have been waiting to buy this for a few years now. I always dream of having one of these, and I'm happy to hear it is working well with X3. This is the best price ever, and I think it might be the push I need to buy it now! I don't need the software, but the control surface and I/O is well worth the price alone, considering some stores still have it for over $4,000!
Cheers!
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John T
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 14:31:51
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I've never used that Fantom, so really don't have a view. I think there are some issues with 64 bit compatibility, but somebody else will know more than me on that.
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Rob[at]Sound-Rehab
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 14:55:20
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John T
I've never used that Fantom, so really don't have a view. I think there are some issues with 64 bit compatibility, but somebody else will know more than me on that.
likewise here. with all the cpu power these days and the zillion of great soft synth, i hardly ever even go to the fantom. i also agree that without the fantom and the whatever-link to video this unit might have sold more often if it had been cheaper when it came out (yet, i'm under the impression that they just threw the fantom in because that technology was fully developed and it didn't cost them much to include it but gave them an excuses to sell it at an higher price ... which may have been poor strategy). anyway, i bought my vs-set discounted a while ago and i'd do it again tomorrow for the price i payed, and would not think long about it at the current offer nothing is ever future proof if it is a digital gadget, no matter what price it comes. one day it will be superseded, one day there will be no more updates. yet, currently i rather stick to vs-700 and x2/x3 as it gives me an incredible environment to work with. i'm sure i'd give x4/x5/x6 a miss if they break the compatibility to the vs-700 (for as long as the vs-700 keeps functioning) my 50c.
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Treefight
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 15:03:55
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Thanks SR!
I'm particularly curious about plugin (ACT?) integration. The I/O, synth, faders, and knobs for X3 basic controls are a given, but I've yet to find a control surface for plugins in Sonar that is easier to use than a mouse. I've spent countless hours messing with ACT, Generic Control Surface, Automap, MCU, the Axiom protocol (can't recall it), and probably others.
Is it more than ACT? Does it work intuitively with channel strips (or at all)?
Thanks!
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Rob[at]Sound-Rehab
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 15:12:13
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Treefight
Is it more than ACT? Does it work intuitively with channel strips (or at all)?
yes, it works quite intuitively. i'm a happy camper. I had some issue with it not retaining my ACT mappings, but John T pointed me to the fix. Ever since it's really smooth i.e. direct access to PC modules & sends for the selected strip & ACT for active plug-in & quickly jumping between plugs for the vs-700. You can even remap the PC knobs (as a few of them are not set to what you personally might favor) ... there isn't a lot of mouse involved in mixing (editing is a different story, but I don't think that there's anything faster than the mouse when it comes to edits)
post edited by FreeFlyBertl - 2013/11/22 15:19:16
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John T
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 15:21:11
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The channel strip control section maps to ProChannel modules. You step through the modules of the selected channel by pressing the EQ button on the console. I use this constantly. It's very nicely implemented.
It's related to my greatest irritation, mind you. You can set up the console so it only shows channel strips shown in the on-screen console view. So you get rid of redundant midi track strips for mixing, and your physical console layout is nice and neat.
However, this got broken in X1 or X2, and never fixed, and if you use it that way now, it gets hopelessly confused about which ProChannel strip it's controlling. Since I use MIDI + Synth track rather than simple instrument tracks, this means I've got an extra completely redundant strip mapped to the console.
These are the kind of irritations I'm expecting more and more of as Sonar gets updated. Like I say, they're not working on it, or even testing on it as far as I can tell.
Again, I'm not trying to put anyone off, but it's quirky, and grows more quirky with each Sonar release. There will be a point when it's simply too painful to use.
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Rob[at]Sound-Rehab
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 15:31:44
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John T
The channel strip control section maps to ProChannel modules. You step through the modules of the selected channel by pressing the EQ button on the console. I use this constantly. It's very nicely implemented.
It's related to my greatest irritation, mind you. You can set up the console so it only shows channel strips shown in the on-screen console view. So you get rid of redundant midi track strips for mixing, and your physical console layout is nice and neat.
However, this got broken in X1 or X2, and never fixed, and if you use it that way now, it gets hopelessly confused about which ProChannel strip it's controlling. Since I use MIDI + Synth track rather than simple instrument tracks, this means I've got an extra completely redundant strip mapped to the console.
very true. and unfortunately not a among the few fixes we've seen lately i usually work around this by moving all MIDI tracks to folders at the lower end of TV (right-hand side of console view) when tracking is done, synths are frozen and mixing gets serious. this way MIDI tracks are on the far right (usually separated by a dummy track labeled "-----" to indicate where audio strips end and MIDI/archive land begins) ...
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John T
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 15:36:36
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Yeah, there are workarounds. I wouldn't want to overstate the case. But without rancour, I will say this: Cakewalk's ongoing effort to keep the console functional from X1 onwards has been extremely thin, bordering on careless, and that was when it was a live product. I realise that's not exactly the nicest thing in the world to say, but I can't imagine anyone from Cakewalk exactly denying it either. They have patched up the odd thing here and there too, but often anything up to six months after it got needlessly broken.
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John T
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 15:41:13
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On a more positive note: The I/O really is excellent, and doesn't really have any of these kinds of issues. It's essentially the same as Rolands Octa Capture, and remains fully supported by them as part of that series. That'll keep on trucking long after the console is a doorstop.
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Rob[at]Sound-Rehab
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 15:45:24
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☄ Helpfulby John T 2013/11/22 21:11:34
I definitely agree ... and keep my fingers crossed that we see an occasional fix ...
But as I said I'm currently more attached to the vs than future x series upgrades (as I don't see any affordable CS solutions that would work any better). The new comping and VST3 made me go for X3, but if they had broken the vs-700 like they did in X1a-X1c I would have stayed with X2a, which I'm still quite happy with ...
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Rob[at]Sound-Rehab
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 15:48:32
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John T
On a more positive note: The I/O really is excellent, and doesn't really have any of these kinds of issues. It's essentially the same as Rolands Octa Capture, and remains fully supported by them as part of that series. That'll keep on trucking long after the console is a doorstop.
and chaining the vs-700r with octa-capture makes a brilliant multi I/O system with zero latency monitoring for up to 4 different headphone mixes (which is a feature that the vs-700r is actually lacking ... yet, you can again work around with a beefy DAW that can run heavy load on really small ASIO buffers)
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John T
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/22 21:12:12
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Ah, you can do unique headphone mixes with an Octa? I didn't know that. Might have to get one.
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Rob[at]Sound-Rehab
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Re: V-Studio 700 and X3? Worth it on sale for $1500
2013/11/23 04:28:12
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John T
Ah, you can do unique headphone mixes with an Octa? I didn't know that. Might have to get one.
Yes, you can and it's quite flexible actually. The OC provides 8 analogue INs and 2 digital ones, which you can route fully flexbile in the OC DSP direct mixer to 4 separate headphone mixes, plus you can send e.g. another 8 mono channels (or 4 stereo channels) from the DAW, which I usually use to send mix stems and feed them to each headphone mix at different levels. I actually take it a bit further and also feed the digital OUT of the vs-700 into the digital IN of the OC, which allows me to also get all vs-700 INs and ADAT INs (which are connected to the vs-700) into the OC headphone mixes (vs-700 and ADAT arrive at the OC as one single mix controlled by the vs-700 direct monitoring mixer). This way you can have a multi-mic drum set coming in via the vs-700 and ADAT channels, the drum mix routed to the OC, plus you have another 8 INs from the OC to track whatever you feel like with each muso getting his own mix. Mind you, with all these options the routing sometimes gets a bit overwhelming, so it's good to have some templates saved and a few things documented ...
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