Volume too loud after export to MP3 or WAV

I use MIDIs on stage, and of course there is an audible count at the start of every song, using a drum stick sound.
 
When I play the song from SONAR itself, everything's perfect.  But after exporting to MP3 or WAV, the count is very loud, it sounds like full volume!  The rest of the song is fine; only the count is loud.
 
Is there a way to fix that?

Cactus Music
Find the count in on the drum midi track and lower the velocity. 

Right, but that would mean doing the same for 200 songs.  Plus, why should I need to? It's fine otherwise.  Something about the export process is changing only that.  Was hoping someone would know why, and how to fix it.
 
FYI, the velocity is already down to 40.  That's low enough that it shouldn't be heard  like 127.

Cactus Music
Well 40 You should not be able to even hear it. What is it using for the count in.. the metronome? 
That might be what is happening. If you have Sonar set to count in it's possible the metronome is part of your export. If so then un checking that will be global to all songs. 
 
Because I master all my backing tracks in Wave Lab that is one of my tasks. I cut the song to 1 beat ahead of the first tick and I run a quick check of the level. I set all of mine close to the same at -30db RMS. 
I find a hi hat is less annoying if the audience is going to be hearing it. 

40 is quite low, but audible enough for me to hear thru the monitor on stage, and not bother the audience.  Hi-hats are lost to my ears in a noisy place.
 
The count-in is simply drum sticks (on a MIDI kit), no metronome involved during playback.  
 
Edit:  As a test, I deleted the count-in (the four stick hits); not the measure, not the CCs or anything, just the notes (G2 x4). Exported it to WAV, and it played with no volume fluctuation.  I half expected the first few beats to be super loud, but no, it was fine.  When I put those notes back in, the problem comes back.
 
So again... why would those first 4 notes be at 127 when exporting?  I can see no settings that would cause such a thing to happen.

What I do is place a 4 count beat wave file in the song at the beginning at a low volume at measure1 and start the song at measure 5 and export the entire project to MP3 or wave.
 
Works every time.


Just record a 4 count audio beat via a Mic, and export as wave and save it.  Now import it into your project at measure 1 and move your project back to Measure 5, bounce down the midi to audio just before exporting the entire project and you are set.
 
Another light bulb moment.
 
 
 
 

The best workaround I found for now is to change CC7 to a lower volume for the count-in, then put it back up for the rest of the song.  Still need to re-edit 200+ songs, but it's a faster edit than adding measures and all that.
 
Still... it's a complete mystery as to why only the count-in is exported full velocity.

Jesse G
No solution to perform on 200 songs at once, that would be a miracle.

LOL - well, I wasn't talking about a mass edit, I just wondered if anyone knows why the issue is happening, and how to stop it from happening.  I think that's the 4th time at least that I've said that; not sure why it's being ignored.

If the count-in is mixed into your songs, you are not going to be able to edit 200 songs at the same time.

I suggest, in the future, you paste an audio count-in measure ahead of your song on a separate track, and route it to its own bus, before sending to the Master Bus. You should then be able to set the output to whatever level you like on the sub bus.

In case you are already sending to a separate bus, make sure you are not outputting directly to your audio interface and that you are routing the sub bus to the Master Bus along with the rest of your audio.

When you mix down, you only want the Master Bus as your source. The mix should sound exactly like what you are hearing.

Musicman762
If the count-in is mixed into your songs, you are not going to be able to edit 200 songs at the same time.

Yes, I keep saying in my posts that editing 200 songs all at once is NOT my goal.
 

Musicman762
I suggest, in the future, you paste an audio count-in measure ahead of your song on a separate track, and route it to its own bus, before sending to the Master Bus. You should then be able to set the output to whatever level you like on the sub bus.

Count-ins vary between 4-8 beats, or 3-6, etc., depending on time sigs and all.  But I understand what you're saying.  My workaround mentioned in an earlier post will work for the time being, but I'll remember your suggestion for the future.

Cactus Music
OK, so this is weird, The song sounds perfectly correct when played in Sonar, but after the export the Wave file version count in is obviously way louder? That's technically seems impossible. 

That's exactly what happens; and yes, it is on the bizarro side.
 

Cactus Music 
Just to trouble shoot.
Which drum VST are you using?
I would try inserting a different drum VST and put the count in on it's own track assigned to this and see if it still happens. 

 
Using the Roland SCVA for drums (and all other instruments).  Will try your suggestion and see how it goes.  But man... no matter which way I slice it, I'm gonna have to edit 200 songs... :-\

It's the Sound Canvas in VST form.
 
I can either start the drums at a lower CC7 value, then change it immediately after the count-in;
or simply lower the velocities of the count-in notes.  Those are the only two options I can see right now.

karhide
If you change the Sound Canvas instrument for the drums to a sound that is not drums and export does the issue still happen?

Yes.  I changed ch.10 to ch.1 (Piano), with the same result.  Count-in sounds like full velocity, the rest of the track is normal.
 
 
The count-in for most of my tracks uses a drum stick sound, velocity set to 40.  This works perfectly when played as .cwp files directly from SONAR/CbB during live performances (yeah I know, not the best thing to do, but it is what it is).
I have found that when I export the song to .wav, I need to lower the velocity of the count-in, but *only* the count-in.  The rest of the song is fine.  And that's just totally weird to me.  No idea why this happens, but at least I know that changing the count-in velocity works.
 
 

I play in a trio and use backing tracks mastered in Sonar which I then export as WAVs for use in an iPod played through the PA. I have count ins at the start of each.
I make each mix in Sonar by bouncing the tracks down to a 'Mix' track.  I then solo and Master that track using Ozone 8 in its FX bin.  I bounce that Mix track down to a 'Master' track. I solo that track and listen to it, checking it and ensuring it seems about the same level as all our other songs.  I usually tweak the count in bars as the Mastering process will have increased their volume, so I simply highlight those and use the gain adjuster in the Control bar, lowering their volume by 1,2 or 3 db as necessary.

Skyline_UK
I play in a trio and use backing tracks mastered in Sonar which I then export as WAVs for use in an iPod played through the PA. I have count ins at the start of each.
I make each mix in Sonar by bouncing the tracks down to a 'Mix' track.  I then solo and Master that track using Ozone 8 in its FX bin.  I bounce that Mix track down to a 'Master' track. I solo that track and listen to it, checking it and ensuring it seems about the same level as all our other songs.  I usually tweak the count in bars as the Mastering process will have increased their volume, so I simply highlight those and use the gain adjuster in the Control bar, lowering their volume by 1,2 or 3 db as necessary.

 
This is very similar to what I do. I never saw any point in not pre mixing my tracks. Once you have a "Band" that you use and come to terms with how each instrument sits in a stereo mix there seems no point in playing a multi track audio  or midi song live. 
 
I use the same Bass ( Ample)  and a custom drum kit (AD2)  for every song. Only things that are different after that are Piano, organ and the odd other instruments. 
For the bass and drums the velocity is always kept very close to my standard I've been using for 30 years. 
 
I export these mixes and then open them in Wave Lab to Master. 
First thing I do is see what the Peak level is. It should be 0.4 Db. If it is not, then something was not going through the Master bus and the Brickwall limiter. 
Then I  use the Global analyzer to see what the Average RMS level is. I want it to be around -14db and it usually is. 
Now I look at the intro and cut away any silence to leave about half second. 
I look and listen to the count in and adjust the level if need be which is rare. 
I then look at the end and cut away all silence. I like short fades so I can start the next song. 
 
When done all my songs are proofed through the PA system and it's very rare that I need to go back and adjust. 
I just re did over 100 songs using a new improved "Band" and this is by far the best tracks I ever made. I made one change where I have split the Bass out to the Left side and put everything else right. Every room is a little different so it's nice to have  more control of the low end.