aglewis723
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WHY do we want a quiet computer?
Hello everyone,
I am in the middle of building a DAW system. I was just wondering, why do we want a "quiet" PC. Is it for noise bleeding into the room and hence into microphones as background noise? Or does it have something to do with interfering with the analog recording signal input? For instance, if I am recording sounds from an analog synth. Or does it effects mixdowns or something?
I am just wondering WHY we want quiet PC's.
Thank you and sorry for any ignorance :)
Adam
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spacealf
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/10 23:52:45
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If you have a video card with a fan and computer with a fan, the computer fan usually can make noise if it is operating at the fast speed. Very noisy in fact with some, because newer computers have more to deal with, and during high activity periods, the fan will start making a lot of noise. Now with my computer I usually have it on optimal or something like that not hi-speed because for normal general computing (usually including DAW but I do not use soft synths) the fan will be quiet enough, but I found out that if I change it in the BIOS to the fastest speed, the darn thing is very noisy. For computer games that may be needed to keep the computer cool (and video card maybe not as noisy but perhaps could be) during hi-speed stressful computer use. Then a lot of people seek low-noise fans when building a computer for a DAW because the fan will be virtually noiseless even when used hi-speed. I have not needed that yet, but I know my fan in my computer will make a lot of noise if I set it in the BIOS to the max.
Also some computers nowadays have way more in the computer than I do, so the fans can make noise just having the computer on. Yes, even normal fan operation can be noisy for recording but if you have a noise gate (and the only time I have to think about it is when singing) then with my use, since singing usually does not have such a dynamic range from soft to loud passages, then the noise gate will not let the noise through below a certain level. Say a voice singing has dynamics of 50dB then a noise gate set to 60dB will not let noise get through if the recording is loud enough into the DAW without distorting the signal.
Yes, a low-noise fan would be better for any DAW actually.
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aglewis723
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/11 01:13:03
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Thanks for the reply, but the answer is WHY do we want a silent PC? How does it effect recording music?
Is it for noise bleeding into the room and hence into microphones as background noise? Or does it have something to do with interfering with the analog recording signal input? For instance, if I am recording sounds from an analog synth. Or does it effects mixdowns or something?
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slartabartfast
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/11 03:55:24
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Yes of course it is for sound made by the computer being recorded by the microphone. Many home studios have the computer in the same room as the microphones, and making your computer quiet makes life easier in that case. If you computer is in another noise isolated room, as is common in professional studios this is more of a non-issue, unless the computer is located where the recordist will be annoyed by the sound itself. If your computer is producing electrical noise, that is another issue altogether, but when most of us are talking about a "quiet computer" we are talking about sound not electrical interference.
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/11 07:40:28
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aglewis723
Thanks for the reply, but the answer is WHY do we want a silent PC? How does it effect recording music?
An even more important consideration; How does it effect listening to music? best regards, mike
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aglewis723
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/11 12:28:58
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Thanks for the responses everyone. I am building my own computer, what steps should i take to make sure i have the PC as quiet as possible? Thank you!
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Mesh
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/11 13:54:25
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aglewis723
Thanks for the responses everyone. I am building my own computer, what steps should i take to make sure i have the PC as quiet as possible? Thank you!
If your internal components (PSU, CPU Cooler, case fans, SSD's etc...) are quiet to begin with, then you'll have a very quiet machine. I highly recommend Noctua CPU Cooler and case fans....they're almost dead silent. I just finished my build and the loudest compnents are my 4 case fans on my Rosewill Thor V2 Case at full speed (which the loudness is barely noticeable.) I can control the speed of my fans (two control knobs located outside the case) to lower the speeds in making it quieter. Once you get quiet components from the get go, you can pick a case that suits your fancy/needs.
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jbow
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/11 21:01:11
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Yeah, a sensitive condensor can and wil pick up the fan or hard drives spinning. OF course if you're micing a Marshall 1959 then don't worry over it. If you're micing soft vocals or quiet guitar... it could be a concern.
IMO,
J
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Jim Roseberry
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/12 05:57:29
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Why a quiet PC?
Sensitive mics (if in the same room) pickup/record loud computer noise.
Loud computer noise adds to the rooms natural noise-floor... making it more difficult to monitor/mix.
Once you're accustomed to working with a quiet DAW, a loud unit is annoying/distracting.
A quiet DAW is the sum of all parts.
(Buying loud components and playing them in a "quiet case" will not result in a quiet DAW.)
Even a budget build can be quiet...
You just have to be careful which components you select.
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kristoffer
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/12 06:21:38
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Go with Jim's advice on this one, he know's his stuff :)
Or, if you have the possibility, just put your DAW in the next room.
Then you could have the baddest, meanest and loudest fans/components you'd want. And you will not hear it.
I've never understood the need to have your DAW literary on your lap, anyway :)
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/15 11:25:14
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The only item now producing noise from inside my pc case is the CPU fan.
I'm tempted to swap it out for a different model, but I've sort of backed myself into a corner with the case.
Most of the 3rd party coolers I've seen are quite tall and my case is a 4U rack mountable.
Anyone have any suggestions?
Cheers,
Jonesey
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Jim Roseberry
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/15 11:53:13
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Bristol_Jonesey
Most of the 3rd party coolers I've seen are quite tall and my case is a 4U rack mountable.
You're options for large/quality 3rd party coolers are pretty limited. As you mentioned, most of the top-tier air coolers are too tall for a 4U Rack... and there's typically not enough space to mount the radiator/fan for a water-cooler.
post edited by Jim Roseberry - 2013/07/15 11:59:13
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spacealf
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/15 12:35:16
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Because people try and get rid of noise. They use headphones (and do not want extra noise in those) or they use a room that is actually more quiet than other rooms in the house, and some people want peace and noiselessness than noise all the time. (or they live in a big city that never sleeps!) But you can have noise in your recording if you wish it, so do what you want to.
post edited by spacealf - 2013/07/15 12:36:46
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paulo
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/15 14:14:54
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I think the question is really why would you want a noisy one ?
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/16 17:00:31
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Jim Roseberry
Bristol_Jonesey
Most of the 3rd party coolers I've seen are quite tall and my case is a 4U rack mountable.
You're options for large/quality 3rd party coolers are pretty limited.
As you mentioned, most of the top-tier air coolers are too tall for a 4U Rack... and there's typically not enough space to mount the radiator/fan for a water-cooler.
Yeah it's pretty crowded in there already with 3 x hard drives in silent sleeves Thanks Jim - I might think about getting a new case and move the whole lot over.
CbB, Platinum, 64 bit throughoutCustom built i7 3930, 32Gb RAM, 2 x 1Tb Internal HDD, 1 x 1TB system SSD (Win 7), 1 x 500Gb system SSD (Win 10), 2 x 1Tb External HDD's, Dual boot Win 7 & Win 10 64 Bit, Saffire Pro 26, ISA One, Adam P11A,
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Goddard
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/17 02:34:56
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You might look at "top down" coolers with horizontal or angled folded heatpipe heatsink arrangements and top-mounting fans rather than vertically-oriented tall ones with side fans.
The classic example back when was probably Thermaltake's Big Typhoon model but since then many other makers have offered top-down coolers for height-restrcted applications. One thing toi be aware of, they can be a right pain to mount due to the sometimes rather limited access.
Fwiw, I've been pretty happy using Scythe's coolers in such applications over the years. Quiet.
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Jim Roseberry
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/17 10:35:54
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Goddard
You might look at "top down" coolers with horizontal or angled folded heatpipe heatsink arrangements and top-mounting fans rather than vertically-oriented tall ones with side fans.
The classic example back when was probably Thermaltake's Big Typhoon model but since then many other makers have offered top-down coolers for height-restrcted applications. One thing toi be aware of, they can be a right pain to mount due to the sometimes rather limited access.
Fwiw, I've been pretty happy using Scythe's coolers in such applications over the years. Quiet.
Socket 2011 (SandyBridge-E) and socket 1150 (Haswell) both run hot when over-clocked. The Scythe units are great for SandyBridge/IvyBridge... but they (and many other lower-profile 3rd party coolers) are not adequate for running high-performance SandyBridge-E or Haswell in a cool/quiet manner. In a rackmount (or other small form-factor situation), heat build-up can be an issue (especially if you're working with 80mm exhaust fans). It's a delicate balance between desired performance, keeping temps in check, and keeping noise to a minimum.
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jjthomas
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/17 16:04:28
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Why not? I just retired a noisy video card. My last build was designed to be a quiet computer. I really enjoy sitting at my computer and not having to listen to the fans spinning.
Getting a quiet computer put together really was not that hard.
-JJ
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Goddard
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/18 00:01:25
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Jim Roseberry
Goddard
You might look at "top down" coolers with horizontal or angled folded heatpipe heatsink arrangements and top-mounting fans rather than vertically-oriented tall ones with side fans.
The classic example back when was probably Thermaltake's Big Typhoon model but since then many other makers have offered top-down coolers for height-restrcted applications. One thing toi be aware of, they can be a right pain to mount due to the sometimes rather limited access.
Fwiw, I've been pretty happy using Scythe's coolers in such applications over the years. Quiet.
Socket 2011 (SandyBridge-E) and socket 1150 (Haswell) both run hot when over-clocked.
The Scythe units are great for SandyBridge/IvyBridge... but they (and many other lower-profile 3rd party coolers) are not adequate for running high-performance SandyBridge-E or Haswell in a cool/quiet manner. In a rackmount (or other small form-factor situation), heat build-up can be an issue (especially if you're working with 80mm exhaust fans). It's a delicate balance between desired performance, keeping temps in check, and keeping noise to a minimum. Another viewpoint, testing a Scythe top-down cooler on i7-3960x: http://www.xbitlabs.com/a...-kama-cross-rev-b.html Btw, rackmount does not necessarily mean height restriction or a small form factor; a 5U (or even 4U) case can offer sufficient height for tallish cpu coolers and large (120mm) intake and/or exhaust fans and plenty of quiet airflow.
post edited by Goddard - 2013/07/18 00:03:08
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jm24
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/21 00:25:00
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After learning of the google research/observations about hard disks lasting longest when running in the recommended temp range I stopped trying to cool mine. The research indicates hard drives that are too cool/too hot die sooner. Mine were being too cool.
I have a fanless vid card, a giant ninja cpu cooler with 120mm fan, a 120 exhaust, and a 120 on the power supply. No intake fan.
the Hard disks run near the bottom of the recommended range. Cpu rarely hits 46 , and the case is usually 6+ degrees cooler. No central cooling in the house. Just big trees.
I do understand my little computer is not a match for the i crowd. But it is fairly quiet and cool enough.
Amd phenom 2 3 core, 25% OC , 3 disks, 8 gig rams in a standard case laying on its side in a rack on a piece of foamy.
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tfbattag
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/22 11:13:38
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Bristol_Jonesey
The only item now producing noise from inside my pc case is the CPU fan.
I'm tempted to swap it out for a different model, but I've sort of backed myself into a corner with the case.
Most of the 3rd party coolers I've seen are quite tall and my case is a 4U rack mountable.
Anyone have any suggestions?
Cheers,
Jonesey
I have a 3U rack mounted case, and I've been very pleased with my Zalman fan. Check Zalman CPU fans on NewEgg, and you'll see that they offer quite a few fans that lay flat. (BTW...I don't over-clock. It's a dedicated DAW only.)
post edited by tfbattag - 2013/07/22 11:16:13
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/26 05:49:41
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doncolga
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/30 20:35:40
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I just put my PC in a 4u rack...and I really like the rack, but it's ended up being noisier than my tower, which was pretty noisy anyway. So now I have three fans, three HD's, video card with fan. The rack case fans sure seem to move the air though. I just put it in another room and ran firewire, USB and video cables to it, and that's probably what I'll continue to do in the future. Nice and quiet here in the "control room".
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jm24
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/07/31 09:25:02
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3 fans? CPU, PS, case????? Or 3 case fans? Do you need all the fans running full on? Are you using speedfan or other app to check temps? I have my comp in a rack, but it is not touching the frame. It sits on a 2 inch foam pad on a rack shelf. Giant CPU HS/fan, PS fan, 1 case fan, 3 disks =============================== http://www.buildcomputers.net/hdd-temperature.html Then Google came along and published "Failure Trends in a Large Disk Drive Population", a research paper (on more than 100,000 consumer hard disk drives) that some consider to be the Bible on HDD failure. Some of the major findings include: Hard disk temperatures higher than 45°C led to higher failure rates. Disk temperatures lower than 25°C led to higher failure rates too. Older hard disk drives (3 years and above) were a lot more prone to failure when their average temperatures were 40°C and higher. This study also suggested that the effect HDD temperature has on failure rate is not as severe as previously believed. However, there was no mention of the effect of temperatures higher than 50°C (probably because Google kept their hard disk drives in server rooms with strict temperature controls). What is a Safe Hard Disk Temperature Range? Drawing conclusions from the Google paper, smaller independent studies and tech forum users: Hard Disk Temperature Less than 25°C: Too cold 25°C to 40°C: Ideal 41°C to 50°C: Acceptable More than 50°C: Too hot Hard disk manufacturers often state the operating temperatures of their hard disk drives to be between 0°C to 60°C - This can be misleading because what they mean is that your hard disk will function at these temperatures, but it doesn't tell you anything about how long they are going to survive at this range. - See more at: http://www.buildcomputers.net/hdd-temperature.html#sthash.6JAV1itJ.dpuf There are a few popular hard disk temperature monitor freeware, but we highly recommend CrystalDiskInfo - http://crystalmark.info/software/CrystalDiskInfo/index-e.html
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bapu
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/08/19 13:40:03
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I fond it was lot easier to destroy my hearing capability (when I was lad) so that the noise of a DAW is now moot (or is that mute?).
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Seth [DAWGURU]
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/08/21 02:17:43
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For me, recording voice over with a condenser mic, its the noise of the computer's fans bleeding into the recording that would be the issue ...
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Goddard
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/08/21 03:49:14
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Let's see...
A larger diameter cooling fan spinning relatively slowly (and quetly) can move the same amount of air (or more) than a smaller diameter fan spinning relatively faster (and loudly).
A DAW does not require a powerful 3D gaming graphics card (which consumes a lot of power and requres a fan(s) for cooling). A passively-cooled low power "business graphics" (think of stock traders and spreadsheet gurus) card providing good 2D graphics is quiet and cool, and can typically support multiple displays. As well, the integrated processor graphics in many recent Intel Core i cpu's is adequate for a DAW and can support multiple displays.
Recent motherboard chipsets and power regulators don't require separate cooling fans (not even on X79), nor do memory sticks, unless one is doing heavy overclocking and boosting voltages.
Efficient quiet running power supplies are available, in many of which the fan only runs when necessary.
A variety of quiet cases are available at reasonable prices.
HDDs can be mounted for quiet operation with sufficient cooling.
SSDs do not make any sound.
Heck, a Macbook Air doesn't make any sound and yet is plenty powerful enough for serious recording and mixing work, and can even run Sonar when bootcamped. As can a Mac Mini (although it has a fan which will spin up when it's worked hard). OTOH, an iPad won't run Sonar but it's silent and can be used for serious audio/MIDI work.
Point being, no reason for a DAW to make audible noise. As has already been mentioned, building a quiet DAW PC is possible even on a budget if one is careful about what components one selects and how they are installed.
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Seth [DAWGURU]
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/08/21 03:58:26
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Intake and outtake fans can be made to be virtually silent through the use of voltage regulators, but the wildcard is the PSU fan. Many PSUs are very quiet, but it always seems to be the loudest thing in all of my computers and there's no way (AFAIK) to manually regulate the fan speed. So, I guess, my point is that choosing a quiet PSU is arguably the most important part of building a quiet DAW, given that all the other parts are quite easy to make darn near silent. 
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Goddard
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/08/21 06:19:11
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There are silent (fanless) power supplies (one has resided in an HTPC here for years). But it's necessary to assure they are adequately vented and/or exposed to sufficient cooling airflow (e.g. from quiet case fans). Wih some better fan-cooled PSUs like Seasonic, even when the fan starts up its speed (and noise) remains quite low so long as the internal temp stays below a certain point. A PSU when top-mounted in a tower case and drawing its cooling air from the region around the cpu may tend to run hot and need to run its fan all the time and at higher speed, whereas when bottom-mounted in a tower case and drawing its cooling air from outside the case (through a case vent) it will tend to run much cooler and perhaps not even need to spin up its fan at all. In a rack/desktop case, using a PSU with a flow-through design (with a front rather than a side intake) and supplying adequate air flow from a quiet front intake fan(s) will help keep its fan from spinning up. This can also work in a tower case, with either a top or bottom PSU mounting, so long as cool air is communicated (tunneled) to the front of the PSU.
post edited by Goddard - 2013/08/21 06:22:12
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Old55
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Re: WHY do we want a quiet computer?
2013/08/21 12:13:46
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The "top down" CPU heat sink/fan combo has some merit. I have a big old Scythe heat sink (I think it's a Ninja). It does a great job of keeping the CPU cool, but I found I have to run my fans faster than I'd like because the chip set and other motherboard components aren't getting enough circulation because the heat sink fan is blowing the air above the components parallel to the surface of the mobo. Just something to consider.
post edited by Old55 - 2013/08/27 23:27:05
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