Waves Element 2 and CPU

I love Waves Element 2. I loved the first one and was stoked to get a free update to Element 2 recently. I think this is one of the best sounding analog modeled synths out there. Try an all-synth project with nothing but Waves Element and you can get some real ear candy going. 
 
However it really does choke on my machine (which is quite powerful), even if I just have a couple of instances, usually when I turn on unison (either 2 or 4 voices). I start getting crazy clicks and pops. Which is odd, because I look at my CPU activity meters in Sonar and they're still fluttering away around the 20-30% area. Nothing is spiking or even getting past 50%. So why is Element having so much trouble? It's not just the sound either - the interface gets kind of laggy, and unlike every other synth I have which features totally smooth controls, Element's knobs are sometimes very jerky and laggy (mind you, I find a lot of Waves UI's to behave like this in Sonar). 
 
So what's the deal then - how come I can run sometimes a dozen or more synths without a hitch (often CPU hungry beasts like Reaktor) but this little old Waves Element thing is choking and spluttering? Anyone else find this? 

scook

sharke
I look at my CPU activity meters in Sonar and they're still fluttering away around the 20-30% area. Nothing is spiking or even getting past 50%. So why is Element having so much trouble?

Which CPU meter mode are you looking at in the Performance Module?

I always have it set to audio processing. But typically I will close all other apps down when I'm using Sonar, so there is negligible CPU activity elsewhere in the system. 

After reading this I decided to give Element 2 a quick try (I've had it for a while but don't use it very often).  I loaded it up, found a preset with Unison on, Leads E2->FM Leader (MW), dropped in a Melodyne created MIDI file that is pretty much play a ton of notes (OK not exactly "real music" but always good for testing).  Started playback.  Bang, SONAR's audio engine stops unexpectedly, after maybe a bar or two.  The CPU never got much above 6-10%.  Sure enough every time I tried playing the audio engine would stop.  But not a CPU problem.
 
So I open Reaper and load the same preset and same MIDI clip.  Reaper plays it just fine.  CPU never gets above 6%.
 
SONAR's audio engine will stop like that if it gets bad audio data, seems likely that Element is generating something SONAR doesn't like and causes SONAR to throw a fit.  I suspect Reaper just handles it better.
 
Either Waves or Cakewalk need to look at and fix this.  I also suspect both sides will point at the other and say "It's not us, it's them".  It is not a CPU overload and I doubt there is anything you can do.

Well I'm not sure it is bad audio coming out of Element.  I put Element into an instance of Minihost Modular and fed it the MIDI stream but hooked the audio output to nothing and it still causes the SONAR audio engine to stop unexpectedly.  Still not seeing a CPU spike though.  Someone from Cakewalk would have to look at it to tell why the audio engine stopped.  I suspect starting with them would be the best choice.
 

I think I will contact both Cakewalk and Waves. Maybe they can work together to improve things. It would be in both their interests given that Sonar is a major DAW and Waves is one of the leading plugin developers. 

I'm now noticing more issues with Waves. I have a project with the SSL E-Channel used on all tracks and Sonar seems to be turning off the "analog" switch on them. I'm continually having to turn it back on. 

About 2 years ago or so I spent many rounds with Waves support because controls in Q10 would move by themselves.  There never was a resolution but at some point it stopped happening.  At the time I decided it must have been my mouse driver.  Did drive me crazy though.
 
On this Element 2 issue I decided to try stripping down the project and remove all my bus framework that my default template has but I was surprised to find that after I did that, the clip would play.
 
So I narrowed it down to having T-Racks Stealth Limiter in the project.  If the Stealth Limiter has the Inter Sample Peak Limiter set at x16, SONAR's audio engine will stop.  Any other setting and the clip plays through.  Now for the crazy part, it doesn't matter if the T-Racks Limiter is in the audio path or not.  If I feed Element directly to my sound card but have the limiter on a bus that is receiving no sounds, the audio engine still stops.
 
If I add Stealth Limiter to the project in Reaper, the sound breaks up and distorts (which seems kind of odd since it's not peaking on any meter) but the audio engine doesn't shut down and it doesn't crash. 
 
Which makes me very confused.
 
Doesn't seem to matter if the Element UI is open or not, though it's GUI could easily be at fault.  And of course requiring another plugin be present in order to get a bug to happen pretty much means no one will look at it.