What sample rate should I use?

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TomN
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2008/09/24 23:34:09 (permalink)

What sample rate should I use?

I know this will be a limitation of my PC and other factors, but I am just wondering what the generally accepted, normal, standard, common sample rate is to use.
It looks like I can select one at the beginning of a project, which I assume will cover everything I record. And then I have the option to select it again when I export.

So what should I start at and what should I export at?
Is it possible to export at a higher rate than the original project rate? Is that good or bad to do, possible or not or have no advantage?
And in general for posting MP3 files on Soundclick what should I use for the project sample rate and the export sample rate to keep things up to par?

If any of these questions don't make sense, it's only because I don't even know what I don't know.

PC is a Dell with a 2ghz thingy inside of it. I upgraded to 1 Meg of RAM.

On a side note:
What's the deal with using seperate drives for your program vs your audio files or whatever it is? Can that be a partition or does it have to be a physical drive?
And what's the best way to divide things up?
All that being said, I haven't been having any latency issues or glitches or anything like that. So I think I am good with my resources. I am doing pretty simple instrumental stuff with a Drums, Bass and a handful of doubled guitar tracks with effects added. Most tracks so far has only be about 12 running at once. I don't remember the sample rate I used however. Maybe it's really low and that's why.


post edited by TomN - 2008/09/24 23:36:34
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    SteveStrummerUK
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    RE: What sample rate should I use? 2008/09/25 08:30:48 (permalink)

    Hi Tom - these are my views, some of the guys with much better technical knowledge will no doubt chip in with their help.

    So what should I start at and what should I export at?

    For good quality recordings in GT3, you can't go far wrong with setting your default New Project values to Sampling Rate: 44100 and File Bit Depth: 24. Apart from the higher 'quality', one of the many benefits is the 24bit setting will allow you to record with much more 'headroom' than 16bit and means you don't need to record so close to the 0dB clipping level.

    As to the higher sampling rates available, I've tried using 48000 but I can't tell the difference so I've gone back to 41000; it also means you don't another conversion to make when you export your file - see next answer.

    For exporting, it really depends on what you want to do with the stereo file afterwards.

    For most purposes such as creating .wav files which you can burn to CD or to encode into mp3 files for uploading to the web, export at Sample Rate: 44100 and Bit Depth: 16 - this is what commercial CD's are made at and is currently the 'red book' standard for making CD's that will play in most standalone CD players.

    Exporting at 24 bit is the way to go if you have a media player that can play these files, you have an mp3 encoder that can handle 24bit wave files or if you are intending to get your projects mastered by a third party.


    Is it possible to export at a higher rate than the original project rate? Is that good or bad to do, possible or not or have no advantage?

    You can, but there's no point - you won't increase the quality of whatever you've recorded at a lower rate.


    And in general for posting MP3 files on Soundclick what should I use for the project sample rate and the export sample rate to keep things up to par?

    You should still record your projects at 44100/24bit Tom - the better the quality of your original recordings, the better the quality of the wave files and mp3 files you eventually convert it to.

    As to the export rate, this really depends on your mp3 encoder - if like C-Dex, it can convert 24bit wave files to mp3 then export at 24 bit, otherwise 16bit wave files can be encoded by most conversion programs.


    If any of these questions don't make sense, it's only because I don't even know what I don't know.

    LOL - they make sense Tom, even if the answers don't!


    PC is a Dell with a 2ghz thingy inside of it. I upgraded to 1 Meg of RAM.

    More RAM would be an advantage but you should be able to work reasonably comfortably with what you've got. To check your PC specs, select Start, right click on (my) Computer and choose properties from the options.


    On a side note:
    What's the deal with using seperate drives for your program vs your audio files or whatever it is?

    This is definitely a good idea, especially if your PC's resources are getting stretched in your projects.

    At the most basic level, if both your audio files and GT3 are on the same drive your system will be slowed up as two different parts of your drive often need to be accessed a the 'same' time. This, of course isn't possible but in normal operation you won't be aware of it. However, once your system starts to get stretched, you well might. Allowing GT to access two drives means true simultaneous operations can take place.


    And what's the best way to divide things up?

    If you do have a separate drive, the general consensus is to keep your programs, i.e. GT3, on your OS (Windows) drive and store your audio on the other/s.

    You can set up all these pathways and defaults quite easily in Options > Global > Audio Data


    Can that be a partition or does it have to be a physical drive?

    I'll leave that one to the experts Tom, personally I use another drive.


    All that being said, I haven't been having any latency issues or glitches or anything like that. So I think I am good with my resources. I am doing pretty simple instrumental stuff with a Drums, Bass and a handful of doubled guitar tracks with effects added. Most tracks so far has only be about 12 running at once. I don't remember the sample rate I used however. Maybe it's really low and that's why.

    GT3 defaults to 44100/16bit Tom so I would suggest that if you've never altered these values, that is what your previous projects were recorded at.

    Give 24bit a try Tom, if your PC doesn't handle the extra information too well, you can always switch back.

    Hope that helps

    Steve

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    TomN
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    RE: What sample rate should I use? 2008/09/26 13:58:21 (permalink)
    Thanks for the excellent info. That's exactly what I needed.
    And based on your description of why to use two drives I would have to say using a Partition wouldn't work since it's the same physical drive.

    Thanks
    Tom
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    SteveStrummerUK
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    RE: What sample rate should I use? 2008/09/26 14:02:54 (permalink)
    No problem Tom.

    As I said before, I'm no expert on the technical stuff but from what I've read, partitioning your hard drives will speed up certain features as there are smaller areas to search when retrieving information but although I'm not completely sure exaclty why, the general concensus is that two drives is the way to go.

    Steve









    post edited by SteveStrummerUK - 2008/09/26 14:03:48

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    aoresteen
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    RE: What sample rate should I use? 2008/10/01 18:56:47 (permalink)
    I don't know a lot about GT but I do know quite a bit about computers.

    You should record your audio on a seperate drive that is on a SEPERATE controller. Why? Each interface type (IDE, SATA, SCSI ect.) all have a quoted transfer rate. For Ultra SCSI III that is 80 MBs. If you have mutiple devices on the SCSI chain they SHARE the bandwith. With two drives on the SCSI chain each would get half of the bandwidth (40 MBs) if they are both being used at the same time.

    IDE interfaces can have two devices (Master & Slave). If you have two IDE drives and they are on the same port, they share bandwidth. Always make your hard drives are set as MASTERS and other IDE devices are set as SLAVES (CD/DVD drives, Zip ect).

    With SATA you have to dig deep to find out how many controllers the motherboard has and how the ports are spread out over those controllers.

    By keeping each drive on it's own controller with no other drive, the sole drive can get all the bandwidth available on that controller.
    post edited by aoresteen - 2008/10/04 11:39:09

    Tony
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    cjlinus
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    RE: What sample rate should I use? 2008/10/01 19:05:53 (permalink)
    Tony,

    That's really good to know information. Thanks.



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    SteveStrummerUK
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    RE: What sample rate should I use? 2008/10/01 19:52:21 (permalink)

    Yeah, thanks Tony - nice explanation.

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    TomN
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    RE: What sample rate should I use? 2008/10/02 00:16:14 (permalink)
    Very cool info. But I may just have to ask how to make that happen once I have a second drive.
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    SteveStrummerUK
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    RE: What sample rate should I use? 2008/10/02 09:49:41 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: TomN

    Very cool info. But I may just have to ask how to make that happen once I have a second drive.

    Hi Tom

    For the sake of this example, let's assume your PC's current hard drive is 'Drive C' and your new external drive is called 'Drive X'

    As it's generally accepted that your programs should be on the same drive as Windows, we'll be leaving Guitar Tracks where it is, at Computer>HDD(C)>Program Files>Cakewalk

    The folder you'll want to move to your new drive is the Cakewalk Projects Folder, found separate from the Cakewalk folder at Computer>HDD(C)>Cakewalk Projects

    Once you have your new drive installed, it should be a simple matter to drag the Projects folder in Explorer View from your C drive to your X drive; it's new address will be Computer>HDD(X)>Cakewalk Projects

    At this stage, if you have a separate default folder that GT always opens when you select File>Import Audio you can drag that folder across as well.

    Now, the next part of the process is to set up GT so it knows the new location of the Project Folder so that it will be able to open your saved projects and also so it knows where to save future projects. If you've moved the go-to 'Import Audio' folder, you'll need to tell GT where this is too.

    Open GT and from the menu bar, select Options>Global and click on the Folders tab.

    Click on the browse button next to the Project Files field and navigate to the Cakewalk Projects folder you recently dragged to the X drive - the new address will be Computer>HDD(X)>Cakewalk Projects

    Similarly, if you have moved your 'Import Audio' default folder across, use the browse button to select it's new location in the Wave Files field.

    Finally, still in Global Options, click on the Audio Data tab - for both the Global Audio Folder and the Picture Folder (which are both inside the main Cakewalk Projects folder and so are already on your X drive) you need to browse again to their new location to let GT know where they are; the addresses will be HDD(X)>Cakewalk Projects>Audio Data and HDD(X)>Cakewalk Projects>Picture Cache

    Once you're done, click OK and restart GT3 - you should now be good to go.

    Steve

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    TomN
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    RE: What sample rate should I use? 2008/10/02 21:36:44 (permalink)
    Ah yes. I will need to do that. But I am also referring to all that IDE, Primary, secondard, SATA, SCSI mumbo jumbo. That's the part I'll have to check on.
    But don't worry about explaining it now. I am not having an resource issues and don't plan to make any changes soon. I am so far only doing very small, guitar trio kind of instrumentals.
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