davdud101
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What should I back up?
Working on an entirely new build for my studio.... this is my first time, but I'm speaking with experienced folk to get tips on what equipment and stuff is the best, as well as for gaining information so that I can do a bit more myself next time.
But here's the question: What you guys typically back up when backing up your project files? Do you just do EVERYTHING at once? Or do you have some way to compress your entire projects folder, or perhaps only take project files for unfinished songs and everything else is exported audio files?
I want to see how you guys do it - so that I don't screw up!
Mics: MXL 990, MXL R80, 2 x MXL Tempo XLRs, Cobalt Co9, SM48, iSK Starlight Cans: Hifiman HE4XX, AKG M220 Gear: Cakewalk BBL - PreSonus Firepod - Alesis Elevate 3 - Axiom 49 DAW: Win10, AMD FX-8300, 16GB DDR3
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Slugbaby
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/03/30 17:44:07
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I save all my projects in 'Per Project Folders', and then just back everything up every couple of weeks to an external drive that is normally not connected to my DAW. With drives being so cheap, I don't bother compressing - more work than it's worth.
I don't worry about settings, applications, or samples. Those can be downloaded again from the vendors if the PC dies.
And when I finish a project (aka album that gets released for sale, or anything else that valuable), i'll take the mastered WAVs, put them in a USB key, and leave it in my safe deposit box (that holds all the important stuff in case my apartment burns down).
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bapu
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/03/30 20:49:45
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Matt said it best.
Backup what you can't recover form your vendors.
Compression of backed up files would only be of value if you were backing up to the cloud (and/or you pay for data bandwidth usage from you ISP). If you are backing up locally (to an external drive) chances are you are going to be backing up less than a TB and a TB external drive is dirt cheap these days.
Don't forget to take a C: drive image at least once a month and back that up to the external drive as well.
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BobF
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/03/31 01:00:56
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I have two backup jobs that run every night; OS is one, everything else is the other. These start with a full, then run incremental every night for 30 nights. Then the cycle repeats.
After two full cycles, the first cycle gets reduced to a synthetic full.
When the drive backup starts getting full (or when I feel like it), I swap it out. The backup drives are 3T.
Bob -- Angels are crying because truth has died ...Illegitimi non carborundum --Studio One Pro / i7-6700@3.80GHZ, 32GB Win 10 Pro x64 Roland FA06, LX61+, Fishman Tripleplay, FaderPort, US-16x08 + ARC2.5/Event PS8s Waves Gold/IKM Max/Nomad Factory IS3/K11U
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AntManB
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/03/31 16:03:52
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I do something very similar to BobF, with a mixture of full, incremental and synthetic backups of my data drives. For my system drive I take weekly images and keep the last few weeks worth.
My scheduled backups run using a different account to the one I normally use. My own account only has read access to the backups which reduces the risk of both accidental deletion and malware/ransomware affecting my backups.
AMB
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slartabartfast
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/03/31 21:22:03
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Another clear reason to backup in native file format, rather than some kind of compression, is that the loss of a small piece of data will only result in the loss of one file instead of the entire archive. And another reason not to use a proprietary backup file format, is that the data may be irretrievable somewhere down the line unless you have legacy machines and software available to unpack the brand name format.
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abacab
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/03/31 23:30:57
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slartabartfast
And another reason not to use a proprietary backup file format, is that the data may be irretrievable somewhere down the line unless you have legacy machines and software available to unpack the brand name format.
That's a valid and very interesting point! I have been using the native Windows System Image utility for several years, since Windows 7. Windows creates a VHD (Virtual Hard Disk) container for the image files. This can be mounted on the file system and browsed, individual files and folders can be copied if necessary. Great for disaster recovery and archiving old builds. This method has been working very reliably, but the only downside is that it is a manual process. No problems with this so far. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VHD_(file_format) But back to the point, I recently tried to open an old image archive that had been made with an older image program called "Power Quest Drive Image" (before it became part of Norton Ghost), that was in a .v2i format file. No luck, as I don't have PQDI or Norton Ghost installed to browse the .v2i file with. So it is down the line with that one right now... I also discovered something else regarding proprietary image formats. I have recently been researching replacement candidates for the Windows System Image. My big three choices have come down to Macrium Reflect, Paragon Backup and Recovery, and Acronis True Image. Guess what? Of those three possibilities, Paragon B & R seems to be the only one that can optionally make an image on a VHD file. The other two use a proprietary archive container. Paragon has a proprietary pVHD set as the default, as that supports compression and encryption, etc. But they also offer the user the option to switch the container to VHD, VHDX, or VMDK. 
DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ...
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davdud101
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/04/03 06:42:29
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Giving me loads of ideas, guys! I ended up deciding on the following arrangement:
- my 2tb external HDD, which will have all projects files on a 500gb partition (I'm using under 200gb for project files as of now, and tha's after 5 years of using Cakewalk projects, so this should definitely be sufficient for a while), leaving 1.5tb to mass storage (makes me nervous if this fails... I'll find a solution sometime down the road and hope for the best)
- a new 120GB SSD where I'll install Windows 10 and all of my software applications (those come up to less than 50gb, so I'm betting I'm hoping I don't pop far over 100gb with everything installed. I heard one ought to keep 25 or 20gb free on an SSD for it to work at its peak.)
- my 750gb HDD for which I'll partition 500gb for backing up the audio projects folder, plus two 125gb partitions
that are cyclically backing up the 120gb SSD.
What do you guys think? To me, the dangerous parts of this plan are 1) the idea of not being able to back up my mass of crud from the 2tb hard drive and 2) something happening where a cable or port for the 2tb drive decides to act up while I'm in the middle of working on something and 3) the SSD gets full some how (thought I don't really have THAT many applications, and I'm only looking to install mostly necessities rather than loads of junk this time around).
Mics: MXL 990, MXL R80, 2 x MXL Tempo XLRs, Cobalt Co9, SM48, iSK Starlight Cans: Hifiman HE4XX, AKG M220 Gear: Cakewalk BBL - PreSonus Firepod - Alesis Elevate 3 - Axiom 49 DAW: Win10, AMD FX-8300, 16GB DDR3
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abacab
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/04/03 13:34:01
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Just an opinion here, but I think I would prefer having my projects at least on an internal HDD. Maybe get a larger HDD? The SATA port has more bandwidth than USB. It is probably more reliable and with potentially less demand on the system performance. It is my observation that USB can be greedy. I only use external USB drives for file backup & images. My solution to worry about losing my stuff on my external USB drive was to get two of them (1.0TB each). Then I just copy select folders, except for images, from one USB drive to the other to mirror my file backups in case one USB drive fails. I rotate taking c: drive images between the two external USB drives. My setup: C: (SSD) > Windows; Program files and data, Cakewalk Project files; Documents; VST's. D: (HDD) > Cakewalk content; loops & samples; other music app content; archived installers & downloads (This stuff is static, not much change, but I do keep a copy on USB drive) E: & F: USB 1 & 2 > backups & images
DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ...
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davdud101
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/04/03 15:44:35
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abacab
Just an opinion here, but I think I would prefer having my projects at least on an internal HDD. Maybe get a larger HDD?
The SATA port has more bandwidth than USB. It is probably more reliable and with potentially less demand on the system performance. It is my observation that USB can be greedy.
I only use external USB drives for file backup & images. My solution to worry about losing my stuff on my external USB drive was to get two of them (1.0TB each).
Then I just copy select folders, except for images, from one USB drive to the other to mirror my file backups in case one USB drive fails. I rotate taking c: drive images between the two external USB drives.
Cool idea, abacab. Your suggestion sounds a bit more like the following - 1 - Get the 120gb SSD and an addditional 1tb HDD to use in conjunction with the 750gb HDD, totalling a little under 2 tb. 2 - The OS and apps are on the SSD, project files can be on the 750gb (perhaps partitioned into a larger sector and a smaller one where Cakewalk content, VST's and sound libraries and stored), 1tb sata drive can house all the additional garbage/mass media, and then EVERYTHING can be backed up onto the external 2tb drive, over night for example. Then it doesn't need to be plugged in constantly either. And it seems like all my free space'll equal roughly 800gb across all drives (not that that's saying much). Sounds effective to me! I was a little bit hoping that I could save some cash, but $50 for the security of all these projects is actually fine in the long run. Unfortunate thing being that I can't do it immediately because I don't have even the $50 to spend on a 1tb hdd RIGHT now - but in about a month or two, it should also be in my hands.
Mics: MXL 990, MXL R80, 2 x MXL Tempo XLRs, Cobalt Co9, SM48, iSK Starlight Cans: Hifiman HE4XX, AKG M220 Gear: Cakewalk BBL - PreSonus Firepod - Alesis Elevate 3 - Axiom 49 DAW: Win10, AMD FX-8300, 16GB DDR3
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abacab
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/04/03 16:00:21
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davdud101
Cool idea, abacab.
Your suggestion sounds a bit more like the following -
1 - Get the 120gb SSD and an addditional 1tb HDD to use in conjunction with the 750gb HDD, totalling a little under 2 tb.
2 - The OS and apps are on the SSD, project files can be on the 750gb (perhaps partitioned into a larger sector and a smaller one where Cakewalk content, VST's and sound libraries and stored), 1tb sata drive can house all the additional garbage/mass media, and then EVERYTHING can be backed up onto the external 2tb drive, over night for example. Then it doesn't need to be plugged in constantly either.
And it seems like all my free space'll equal roughly 800gb across all drives (not that that's saying much).
Sounds effective to me! I was a little bit hoping that I could save some cash, but $50 for the security of all these projects is actually fine in the long run. Unfortunate thing being that I can't do it immediately because I don't have even the $50 to spend on a 1tb hdd RIGHT now - but in about a month or two, it should also be in my hands.
That sounds like a plan! I feel you pain too, because my HDD and USB drives are about full. I think I need a 1TB HDD too, as well as an upgrade for the external drives to 2TB. But the budget keeps me putting that off. Fortunately, when I upgraded to SSD, I put in a 250GB drive, and that still has plenty of free space. My motivation in keeping lots of free space on the SSD, is that speeds up boot drive images, and they take less space on the backup drive.
DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ...
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BobF
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/04/03 16:13:49
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slartabartfast
Another clear reason to backup in native file format, rather than some kind of compression, is that the loss of a small piece of data will only result in the loss of one file instead of the entire archive. And another reason not to use a proprietary backup file format, is that the data may be irretrievable somewhere down the line unless you have legacy machines and software available to unpack the brand name format.
Rather than "back up" in native format, I make period archival copies of files I create; DAW projects. I consider this an archive function more than a back up because of the lifetime of the archives. They are never overwritten. They are duplicated, but never overwritten. As mentioned above, backups of things I buy are for convenience sake. The one and only time I had a proprietary procedure fail was trying to restore a sys image onto SSD via Acronis. As I was already miffed about the direction Acronis was going, I used that opportunity to ditch them in favor of Macrium Reflect. Reflect completed the restore to SSD with no problems. Note that no proprietary backup solution has ever left me in a position where I couldn't access my backed up files. Maybe I'm just lucky, but it's been decades, so I'm REALLY lucky.
Bob -- Angels are crying because truth has died ...Illegitimi non carborundum --Studio One Pro / i7-6700@3.80GHZ, 32GB Win 10 Pro x64 Roland FA06, LX61+, Fishman Tripleplay, FaderPort, US-16x08 + ARC2.5/Event PS8s Waves Gold/IKM Max/Nomad Factory IS3/K11U
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davdud101
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/04/03 21:47:31
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Update:
Managed to salvage an additional 130gb and a 250gb hard drive from my siblings' old computers. More system backup drives? The 250gb can probably be used for an additional 2 backups of the system drive (SSD). Can the power on drives be toggled from the BIOS usually? Then I can just manually power it up every time I plan to image the system drive.
Obviously I'm ultimately trying to have the fewest number of drives spinning at a time to reduce noise and power consumption. But when you're handed a free 380gb, might as well make use of them!
I'll probably throw the 130gb guy into an enclosure or something. Then at least it won't go to waste.
Mics: MXL 990, MXL R80, 2 x MXL Tempo XLRs, Cobalt Co9, SM48, iSK Starlight Cans: Hifiman HE4XX, AKG M220 Gear: Cakewalk BBL - PreSonus Firepod - Alesis Elevate 3 - Axiom 49 DAW: Win10, AMD FX-8300, 16GB DDR3
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abacab
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/04/03 22:29:49
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davdud101
Update:
Managed to salvage an additional 130gb and a 250gb hard drive from my siblings' old computers. More system backup drives? The 250gb can probably be used for an additional 2 backups of the system drive (SSD). Can the power on drives be toggled from the BIOS usually? Then I can just manually power it up every time I plan to image the system drive.
Obviously I'm ultimately trying to have the fewest number of drives spinning at a time to reduce noise and power consumption. But when you're handed a free 380gb, might as well make use of them!
I'll probably throw the 130gb guy into an enclosure or something. Then at least it won't go to waste.
You could probably use a SATA power switch ... https://www.amazon.com/s/...Ck%3ASATA+power+switch
DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ...
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davdud101
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/04/03 23:29:57
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abacab
You could probably use a SATA power switch ...
https://www.amazon.com/s/...Ck%3ASATA+power+switch
Never seen that before! But is it worth putting in another $30 for something like that? Seems like it can be done easier and for free (not that it's is that much, but it IS money that can be spent elsewhere. That $25 put towards a processor or RAM will make a far bigger difference!)
Mics: MXL 990, MXL R80, 2 x MXL Tempo XLRs, Cobalt Co9, SM48, iSK Starlight Cans: Hifiman HE4XX, AKG M220 Gear: Cakewalk BBL - PreSonus Firepod - Alesis Elevate 3 - Axiom 49 DAW: Win10, AMD FX-8300, 16GB DDR3
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davdud101
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/04/05 18:10:49
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The day is coming nearer - the day when all my ordered gear arrives. I actually have a couple more questions regarding backing up other stuff on the system.
1) What do you do when it comes to applications that you want installed from your previous computer? Just look at a list of installed apps and note 'em down somewhere, then reinstall later? (That may well be the simplest and best option for me. It'd at least insure that all the software is up-to-date)
2) Where will I be able to redownload the fileparts for the installation of SONAR X3 again? I removed them from my Downloads folder to save space when I backup my system, but I'm assuming I should be able to get the back again.
3) Any important things I should look out for in this process?
Mics: MXL 990, MXL R80, 2 x MXL Tempo XLRs, Cobalt Co9, SM48, iSK Starlight Cans: Hifiman HE4XX, AKG M220 Gear: Cakewalk BBL - PreSonus Firepod - Alesis Elevate 3 - Axiom 49 DAW: Win10, AMD FX-8300, 16GB DDR3
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abacab
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/04/05 18:54:45
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davdud101
The day is coming nearer - the day when all my ordered gear arrives. I actually have a couple more questions regarding backing up other stuff on the system.
1) What do you do when it comes to applications that you want installed from your previous computer? Just look at a list of installed apps and note 'em down somewhere, then reinstall later? (That may well be the simplest and best option for me. It'd at least insure that all the software is up-to-date)
2) Where will I be able to redownload the fileparts for the installation of SONAR X3 again? I removed them from my Downloads folder to save space when I backup my system, but I'm assuming I should be able to get the back again.
3) Any important things I should look out for in this process?
1. When it comes you Windows, you generally can't move applications from one computer to another. You need to install applications using the supplied installer. The exception to this is if the app is truly "portable", in which case it is only supplied as an ".exe" file (that you can put anywhere and map a shortcut to it). If you have backed everything up you may find that you have some folders in "My Documents" where some applications store settings. I usually just copy all of "My Documents" over to my new build, just to keep it simple. The alternative is to take a survey and see what all is in there, and just move what you need. 2. You can get your Sonar X3 installer downloads and serials for any Sonar X series from your Cakewalk account on the website. 3. Since you are doing a new build, you will end up with a clean install of Windows and all of your applications. That's a good thing! Make sure you have all of your application installers and serials handy. Then make sure you have any specific hardware drivers that you need after the install. For example, the motherboard chipset, the graphics driver, the network driver, any audio or MIDI devices that you use, etc. I typically disable the on-board audio in the BIOS, and use only the custom drivers for my audio interface. Often the system drivers are shipped on a CD-ROM, but these may already be out of date. Check the vendors website for updates. There may also be a newer motherboard BIOS you wish to flash before you get rolling further with your setup. After you decide how you want to set up your Cakewalk folders and paths, and get that installed, you can copy the projects over from your old build. Good luck, and happy DAW building!
DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ...
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davdud101
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Re: What should I back up?
2017/04/07 17:37:39
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Sweet! I think today's the day. I'm going to at least back up my Windows 7 install twice - once on my 150gb drive, and once on my 2tb. Then tomorrow I'm going to assemble everything and install Windows 10 on my 750gb HDD (but the SSD comes in the mail on Monday, and then I'd have to reinstall Win10. Should I wait? I'm SO eager to put this thing together!!)
One important question before I continue - do I need to "re-backup" each time, or can I just copy all the files made from Windows' backup utility over to a different device? It might potentially save me time. UPDATE!!: Okay, I found a new solution. Given that I have an entire 555gb free on my main drive - and with how eager I am to get this darned thing GOIN' - why don't I just partition the old Windows 7 install install the new motherboard and its components, and then install Windows 10 right onto the free space of the same drive? It'd only be temporary, I won't need to back up anything (though I suppose I'll take my precautions anyway), and the disc remains bootable with both Win 7 and Win 10 until I'm ready to install onto the SSD on Monday. Then I can make sure I have all the necessary drivers and that everything runs smoothly, and still have it all done in advance so the once the SSD arrives, I just install Windows 10, reinstall the drivers and it's all ready to go. Since OEM copies of Windows are tied to motherboards and not hard drives, this should theoretically work fine, it seems. And in case I missed something on Win7, I can always just go through the painstaking process of reinstalling the motherboard and fix whatever need fixing. Does that sound feasible?
post edited by davdud101 - 2017/04/07 21:20:47
Mics: MXL 990, MXL R80, 2 x MXL Tempo XLRs, Cobalt Co9, SM48, iSK Starlight Cans: Hifiman HE4XX, AKG M220 Gear: Cakewalk BBL - PreSonus Firepod - Alesis Elevate 3 - Axiom 49 DAW: Win10, AMD FX-8300, 16GB DDR3
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