Whats the difference between a midi track and a soft synth instrument track?

     I know this must sound reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeal stupid but throughout everything ive learned ive never actually used a midi track. I use soft synths but i dont know anything other than the fact that a midi track and a soft synth instrument track are two different things. I first noticed that a midi track is alot more complex than i thought when i started learning to use the pentagon vocoder. Whats the difference between just a soft synth and a midi track? WHat all can you do with a midi track? whats the difference between a simple instrument track and a midi source? Anything at all that you find helpful to know about midi will be a appreciated. Also on a side note i still havent figured out how to use pentagon, if anyone can help me with that. thanks

FastBikerBoy


In short - A simple instrument track is a combination of a MIDI track and an Audio track. Much of the routing is hidden from the user. Easy to use but less control over options etc.

A MIDI track needs a corresponding audio track if you are using a soft synth.

What he's trying to say is that instrument tracks are for dumb people.
 
Uh, I mean Simple people...

The eternal fountain of Sonar knowledge...

Thanks Scott! I didn't know that.

garrigus

FastBikerBoy


In short - A simple instrument track is a combination of a MIDI track and an Audio track. Much of the routing is hidden from the user. Easy to use but less control over options etc.

Just a quick note... with the new Inspector in X1, you now have access to all Simple Instrument Track parameters via the Audio and MIDI tabs at the bottom of the Inspector. So unlike in 8.5, X1 gives you total control of these tracks now.

Scott

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Yeah thanks Scott. TBH I've always found Instrument tracks harder than to use than a MIDI an Audio track 'cos I never really knew how to change anything.

So, the old way, before X1 - you'd have to take a MIDI track, create an audio track from it with a soft synth, and link the two together - kinda like an instrument track does automatically?

say your doing transient work..you load up session drummer 3 to use as kick replacement..now all of a sudden you want to replace the snare to..do you just load up another session drummer 3 track and make your computer work harder???no,you insert a midi track and route it to session drummer and yse that synth instead.

Ok so you guys are explaining how a synth output track and midi track put together is an instrument track, but Im not sure the question posted has been answered...


A midi track is a track in there is nos sound, only data. Everything in that track is midi data that tells whatever the source is that the data is put into, what to do, such as what notes tio play, modulation, pitch bend data, velocity, pedals, etc... 
Midi being a data language, the track is simply what holds that language.

You need to make the output of the midi track set to be to the input of whatever softsynth you are wanting that midi data to be used by.

The synth output track is the track associated with the actual softsynth and puts the midi data "through" that softsynth for processing. It also can determine what output on the softsynth the sound created with the midi data in the softsynth comes out of (this is if a softsynth has multiple outputs).

One thing that is cool about having them separate is that you can see both the midi data and a waveform preview(when activating this view in the synth output track) at the same time.

I mainly use a hardware synth, a Roland Sonic Cell and I occasionaly use some sounds on my old Casio keyboard. It has a great sounding piano.

Thanks for all responses by the way

Just to add more to this thread:

MIDI is in a sense a "Control language". it can control;

Hardware. eg synthesizer, keyboards, control surfaace, lighting controllers, in fact just about any hardware that needs switching can be controlled by MIDI. often usesd in live shows to control lights, projectors and a host of other hardware devices. Of course the hardware needs an interface between the MIDI data stream and the device that translates the commands into action.

Software. eg softsynths and other control software that interfaces the above hardware.

So in our applications its usually used to write "music" in a form that is sent to either a software or hardware synth which, with a bit more processing converts it to the audio we hear.

So MIDI always has 2 components. the data (MIDI information itself ) and the device that translates/processes the data into action; in our case the action is converted to audio.

SONAR allows you to make this whole process more transparent and hide info from the user if they choose to by displaying a "Simple instrument" track. If you choose to see more of the information you can, either by using the Inspector or by using the older SONAR way of viewing things by showing a MIDI track (all the data) and an audio track (where the sotfsynth is inserted) which results from the MIDI data being processed through a softsynth.
 
If your MIDI data is controlling a hardware module (synthesizer, keyoard or sound module) external to SONAR, there is no need for an audio track for a softsynth. Instead you will likely have an audio track/s that recieves the incoming audio from the hardware module. If on the other hand, the MIDI is controlling a lighting rig and cueing the turning on and off of lights, dimmers and other device, then there would simply be a MIDI track in SONAR into which that DATA was written.
 
one of our forum members is in a band that puts on a full show where SONAR is used to automate controls for lighting, cuing projectors, sound modules and the keyboard player uses it to generate his live sounds as well.
 
MIDI, despite it's relative simplicity (as far as computer languages go), is a very powerful and flexible means of contolling a vast array of devices.
 
Hope this helps more than confuses.

rbowser


Going by how often questions are asked about it, the so-called "simple instrument track" can be confusing to recording newbies, because the user doesn't get a clear picture of what's going on.

Even with the added improvement of having both the audio and MIDI Inspector visible on a track, I still can't stand simple instrument tracks.  So set in my ways I guess - I just Gotta see the two separate things, the MIDI track, and the audio track, so I still work the "old" way.

RB

The termonology can get really wobbly sometimes. More than often the "audio output track" is called an "instrument track", and the name "soft synth track" is used for both the MIDI- and the audio output track by the posters and that can make questions rather confusing.
The fact that "Simple Instrument Track" is a monster for a name doesn't make it any easier.

Thought I'd chime in with my own explanation.  Before, if you wanted to use a soft synth the first track that was created for the synth was a MIDI track.  This is the track that tells the synth what to do, what notes to play, how loud, etc.  The input for this track would need to be some kind of MIDI controller (a keyboard) hooked into your computer via a MIDI input.  This is what you would specify as the soft synth's input.  If you didn't/don't have one you can create your own MIDI synth track several ways, the most common way being the piano roll.  Now that the synth has an input, it's output would be the soft synth's audio output.  But since this is a MIDI track you can't hear it.  The MIDI track is all operational data.  It is not hooked up to your computer's soundcard.  It needs to go into an audio track since,of course this is set up for audio and you had to hear the synth's audio output throught that.  So, you would then need to create an audio track whose input would be, can you guess?.  The soft synth.  You would then make the output of that track your sound card so you can now hear it.  This track is also where the synth's actual audio is recorded so you can mix it down.  the instrument track jusy combines these two track into one to make things simpler.  The two tracks actually exist but are hidden.

There are two buttons at the bottom the the track inspector, "Audio" and "MIDI". Click the "MIDI" button, to see the MIDI controls in the inspector.

It is easy to miss. I don't use instrument tracks so I had to poke around on the inspector to figure it out. Here is the doc http://www.cakewalk.com/D...pectors.2.html#1203625 the page before shows the Audio/MIDI tabs in image 173.

When Sonar first started using instrument tracks I would use the split instrument track command so that I could see everything, then put them back together again into the simple instrument track after editing. That way I could get things going quickly but still have the extra control if needed pretty easily.