Corling
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When I FREEZE a track with HIGH LATENCY plugins, does it FREEZE with ZERO Latency?
Quick question --
Say I have a vocal track going through a bunch of VST FX that add --- 4,000 samples of latency.
When I FREEZE that vocal track and its FX rack, does it FREEZE with zero latency?
But the question gets more complicated --
IF I set Sonar to record the audio with an OFFSET of 4,000 samples so I can hear the result in-sync -- then when I FREEZE the track does it realize I recorded the audio with an offset or is there a risk that in getting rid of the plugin latency, the audio would again become out-of-sync?
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Brandon Ryan [Roland]
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Re:When I FREEZE a track with HIGH LATENCY plugins, does it FREEZE with ZERO Latency?
2011/01/11 13:14:24
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When you freeze a track with a plugin it renders and unloads the plugin and therefore removes any latency introduced by that plugin and in turn affects the plugin delay compensation in that the system accounts for that plugin no longer introducing latency into the system In short, it's all automatic and you shouldn't have to worry yourself with it. 
"The sky above the port was the color of television, tuned to a dead channel." WG SONAR Platinum | VS-700 | A-800 PRO | PCAL i7 with SSD running Windows 8 x64 | Samsung 27" LCD @ 1920x1080 | Blue Sky monitors with BMC | All kinds of other stuff
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Corling
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Re:When I FREEZE a track with HIGH LATENCY plugins, does it FREEZE with ZERO Latency?
2011/01/11 13:18:49
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Thanks for the reply Brandon!
But what if I record with a *Manual Offset* of 4,000 samples -- which would allow me to monitor the audio in-sync for tracking -- doesn't freezing the track then re-introduce the delay that I "fixed" for monitoring purposes with the manual offset?
Searching the Sonar X1a help file for "delay compensation" produces no results -- it would probably be good to give more documentation on this detail because it does matter.
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brundlefly
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Re:When I FREEZE a track with HIGH LATENCY plugins, does it FREEZE with ZERO Latency?
2011/01/11 13:33:11
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But what if I record with a *Manual Offset* of 4,000 samples -- which would allow me to monitor the audio in-sync for tracking I'm not sure what you're after with this. Adding a Manual Offset just increases the amount by which recorded audio is compensated after recording; it will not affect anything in real time while tracking. If you need to track with plug-ins that require PDC, you should activate Live Input PDC Override (now Shift-E) so that input monitored tracks are not subject to the added delay. But ideally, you should avoid using plug-ins that require PDC until after tracking is complete.
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Guest
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Re:When I FREEZE a track with HIGH LATENCY plugins, does it FREEZE with ZERO Latency?
2011/01/11 13:41:43
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No, it takes it a few seconds to freeze. 
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Corling
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Re:When I FREEZE a track with HIGH LATENCY plugins, does it FREEZE with ZERO Latency?
2011/01/11 13:50:18
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brundlefly
But what if I record with a *Manual Offset* of 4,000 samples -- which would allow me to monitor the audio in-sync for tracking
I'm not sure what you're after with this. Adding a Manual Offset just increases the amount by which recorded audio is compensated after recording; it will not affect anything in real time while tracking.
If you need to track with plug-ins that require PDC, you should activate Live Input PDC Override (now Shift-E) so that input monitored tracks are not subject to the added delay.
But ideally, you should avoid using plug-ins that require PDC until after tracking is complete.
AHHHH . . . I didn't know that manual offset was only a monitoring offset and not a clip offset. I think I have a clearer understanding of the latency situation now. Thanks!
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Corling
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Re:When I FREEZE a track with HIGH LATENCY plugins, does it FREEZE with ZERO Latency?
2011/01/11 13:59:31
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Although as an addendum, it WOULD be nice to have a real-time plugin-delay-compensation METER [probably just a real-time sample number] next to each plugin in the FX rack.
Each track should have a delay compensation meter (in samples) next to each plugin AND a gross (or net) delay compensation meter at the END of the FX rack . . . just so it's possible to visualize the audio engine's signal chain in keeping everything in-sync.
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brundlefly
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Re:When I FREEZE a track with HIGH LATENCY plugins, does it FREEZE with ZERO Latency?
2011/01/11 14:01:24
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AHHHH . . . I didn't know that manual offset was only a monitoring offset and not a clip offset. I would put that the other way around. Real-time monitoring is unaffected, but the clip will be moved earlier in the timeline than it was actually recorded by the amount of the manual offset. Normally only a very small Manual Offset (on the order of 3 to 30 samples) is required to compensate for any unreported/hidden input latency in your interface.
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Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
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Re:When I FREEZE a track with HIGH LATENCY plugins, does it FREEZE with ZERO Latency?
2011/01/11 17:01:05
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Plugin delay compensation keeps the audio of individual tracks in sync with one other when some of them have plugins with delay.
At playback time this is done by SONAR's playback engine and it is identical to what happens when bouncing tracks. So essentially if your tracks sound in sync on playback you will get the identical result after a bounce. IOW the playback of the original tracks would phase cancel with the bounced output.
The record offset is only applied at record time not playback time so is independent of bounce or playback.
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EricDeluxe
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Re:When I FREEZE a track with HIGH LATENCY plugins, does it FREEZE with ZERO Latency?
2011/01/11 21:17:35
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Hey I am not sure if this can be related, but anyway.. I couldn't bounce to track correctly, which I believe to some point have similarities with Freeze tracks. Maybe your problem can be solved in the same manner. In the Virus Snow setup guide for Sonar the following is said "To bounce audio tracks, you need to disable “Fast Bounce“ in the Export Audio dialog box" I did that and also checked Live input in the Audio dialog. It works perfect now.
post edited by ErikDeluxe - 2011/01/11 21:21:45
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