tomixornot
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When to use condenser microphone's low cut switch
I'm planning to use a pair of Tascam pencil (TM-PC1) condenser mic for recording a piano performance next week. Previously I had set on the low cut switch for voice and guitar recording with good result. How about piano recording (indoor, no fan or aircond blowing directly) ? Set it flat, and use Sonar PC-EQ low cut (if required).. or set the low cut on ? Thanks!
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Leadfoot
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Re: When to use condenser microphone's low cut switch
2014/06/08 05:47:48
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Personally I would leave the low cut off. You can always adjust it in Sonar afterwards.
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re: When to use condenser microphone's low cut switch
2014/06/08 08:19:53
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The decision of when to use a mic's onboard pad switch can include consideration of where the pad is in the circuit. Some pads are placed so that they protect the mic's on board preamp/impedance converter from over load distortion or clipping and some pads are placed so that they just turn down signal that is already overloaded. In other words, some mic's pads don't provide any more benefit than a pad on your pre amp, mix console or I/O box.
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bitflipper
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Re: When to use condenser microphone's low cut switch
2014/06/08 11:33:19
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For me the default is to have the filter engaged. Turning it off is the exception and needs some justification. it usually comes down to two factors: what's being miked and how far it is from the mic. If the miked instrument contains no useful low frequencies, then the decision is easy. Acoustic guitars, most brass instruments, strings, hand percussion, electric guitars, snares & overheads - none of these things benefit from capturing very low frequencies. All of them are going to HPF'd in the mix anyway. If it's a human voice, the filter should always be on, IMO. There is never any need to pick up anything below 80 Hz. Those low frequencies are always going to be extraneous noises, pops and proximity-effect woofs. Sure, you can filter them out after the fact, but if you're recording through a compressor you'll definitely want to remove them at the source. They may also determine how much gain you can get from the mic pre, since a low-frequency pop can easily have twice the energy of the main vocal and cause unexpected clipping. If a microphone had a fixed low-cut filter that I couldn't turn off, I'd be OK with that 95% of the time.
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rumleymusic
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Re: When to use condenser microphone's low cut switch
2014/06/08 11:51:27
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The fundamental of the lowest note on a piano is about 27.5Hz, well below the filter setting of most microphones. I always record flat on piano, though I will routinely use a low cut filter on higher instruments, and if needed in post. How are you planning on recording the piano, what style of music?
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Guitarhacker
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Re: When to use condenser microphone's low cut switch
2014/06/08 12:40:32
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bitflipper If it's a human voice, the filter should always be on, IMO. There is never any need to pick up anything below 80 Hz.
Unless you are recording Barry White. Yeah, I tend to leave the filter on. You don't need the low end noise. I still tend to HP the tracks.
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spacealf
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Re: When to use condenser microphone's low cut switch
2014/06/08 13:31:19
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C1 the first "C" above the low "A" ( which was mentioned as to Hertz - 27.5) is 32.703 Hertz. The "C" an octave above that which is C2 is 65.406 Hertz which is still lower than the low "E" string on the guitar which is E2 at 82.407 Hertz. If the piano player is not going to hit notes in the last Octave and a Half on the piano then the low-cut switch is not even being used. C5 or middle "C" is 523.25 Hertz. Why don't you ask how low the piano player will be playing on the keyboard, but then if the room is bassy perhaps or anything like that then the low notes will be natually louder anyway, although - which is a good answer?? Then perhaps you can decide whether to use the cut on the mic or not depending on how loud a dB setting it can handle. As mentioned in other posts (positions and room and all of that).
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AT
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Re: When to use condenser microphone's low cut switch
2014/06/08 13:41:12
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Case by case basis, depending upon the instrument - and room. As stated above, most instruments and vocalists not named Barry don't produce anything below 80 Hz, although the switch may have some effect above that frequency. Room noise, rumbles and bass build-up in the room can all require the switch. Piano, no, usually. Honkeytonk, maybe.
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bitflipper
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Re: When to use condenser microphone's low cut switch
2014/06/08 14:00:17
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Piano is a whole 'nother can o' worms. Sure, the lowest frequencies are way down there, but we don't actually hit them very often. Even when we do, it's still standard practice to roll off the lows in anything other than a solo piano performance. Again, it's partly about mic distance. A close-miked piano, especially an upright, will pick up unwanted pedal noises that can be somewhat alleviated by the low-cut filter.
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tomixornot
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Re: When to use condenser microphone's low cut switch
2014/06/08 20:32:20
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Thanks for the suggestions. rumleymusic How are you planning on recording the piano, what style of music?
It's a classical piano solo graduation performance - a baby grand in a moderately damped room (carpet and wall curtain) with about 100 seats. The room is relatively nice for music, except I'm worry about audience noise level. Last time when I did a recording, my camcorder picks up loud claps and cheers. This time, I shall be using a Tascam DP 24 portable recorder with 2 condenser mics pointing inside the piano lid - recording it clean (merge the audio with the video later). I'm thinking of placing the mic closer for better stereo imaging and to reduce audience noise - not sure if it's good idea till I test it out. I might add a third mic to pick up the room ambient. So, a solo piano performance seems to suggest recording it flat (no pad) ? I can still roll it later with Sonar.
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spacealf
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Re: When to use condenser microphone's low cut switch
2014/06/08 21:17:35
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Might want to look up the frequency response of the microphone you are using also (on a search on the Internet). Although the mic may say it goes down to 40Hz or whatever, still it may roll off on its own. There is a place that lists a lot of mics and also the frequency response (usually given by the company making the mic anyway, but still..................) May want to look a those if not included with the microphone.
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re: When to use condenser microphone's low cut switch
2014/06/08 21:34:18
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I guess I didn't read the subject... I thought it was asking about pads... :-) ... probably because I've been thinking about pads and mics.
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LpMike75
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Re: When to use condenser microphone's low cut switch
2014/06/09 21:18:26
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bitflipper Sure, you can filter them out after the fact, but if you're recording through a compressor you'll definitely want to remove them at the source. They may also determine how much gain you can get from the mic pre, since a low-frequency pop can easily have twice the energy of the main vocal and cause unexpected clipping.
Exactly.
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tomixornot
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Re: When to use condenser microphone's low cut switch
2014/06/09 22:53:33
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LpMike75
bitflipper Sure, you can filter them out after the fact, but if you're recording through a compressor you'll definitely want to remove them at the source. They may also determine how much gain you can get from the mic pre, since a low-frequency pop can easily have twice the energy of the main vocal and cause unexpected clipping.
Exactly.
Thanks. I'm shall be doing a test recording on the classical piano earlier on that day. It's going to be recorded clean, no effect, directly into the Tascam DP 24 (and later mix with Sonar). I'll check both setting and come up with a decision then. Since the Tascam can record up to 8 tracks at once, I might add a mic (mono) with the opposite setting for safety.. not sure if it's a good idea, but I think it won't hurt to experiment.
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Jeff Evans
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Re: When to use condenser microphone's low cut switch
2014/06/09 23:05:38
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I am inclined to agree with Daniel on this. Don't be in too much of a hurry to use a HPF with piano. Even though the player may not go down low, sometimes switching the HPF in will just slice off that beautioful depth you can get down low. It is better under certain circumstances to leave it out and record full range. The beauty of this is you can always use a steeper HPF lower down to remove any real subsonic material without effecting the low end of the piano much. If you record wiith the HPF on you may kill that very nice low end and no amount of EQ will get it back later. I sometimes leave it out even while recordiong a female singer and we know the gals are not going down as low as the guys are yet I still feel that sometimes leaving the HPF out on the female voice can have just a slightly more fuller sound to it. I find the HPF is more useful when the mic is put near something that has got an excessive amount of low end involved and it can just be the ticket for clearing things up and improving the sound in the rest of the spectrum.
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