Helpful ReplyWhy Not ProTools?

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vladasyn
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2017/11/25 03:38:54 (permalink)

Why Not ProTools?

Hey there
 
I am reading posts on multiple forums about switching to another DAW and nobody says- they will switch to ProTools. I was looking in to ProTools this spring when I built new Windows computer and needed new Audio Interface. Most of high end Pro level interfaces were for Mac or had ProTools HD compatibility. I was looking in to Antelope but their prices scared me away, and I went with MOTU Thunderbolt system. I use many hardware keyboards and needed MANY hardware inputs.
 
Because i was planning to use Sonar forever, I did not install any AU option for plugins. I have almost every software synth available on the Market. I need my DAW to have good 3rd party plugins implementation and good MIDI and Composer tools such as Step Sequencer, Piano Roll, Chords editor, Instrument tracks and so on.
 
Now that I need new DAW, I could give Protools a chance, but I dont have any AU installed. When i was installing my software synth and effects, I unchecked AU option every time. It would be impossible to reinstall everything as it took me 9 months to install everything- I am still installing some updates and libraries.
 
But my partner says- I should finally go "Pro" and get a real thing. I already paid for Cubase Pro- to me it is the best Pro that would work with VSTs and MIDI. Am I making mistake- should I go with ProTools instead? Why or why not? Thank you.  

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I am a female. Windows 8.1
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#1
Unknowen
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 03:51:43 (permalink)
Every plugin I've ever installed has ProTool options. you only have to install them.
I'm thinking ProTools just because its time, may as well go with the the rest and maybe I can pickup some mixing jobs for cash... as soon as I told someone "I use Sonar" it was over for that....
 
I've seen plenty of Dave P's and Warren H's video to jump into a mix with Tools...
Just savin pennys now until Spring! :)

Hay look,
Somethings are not locked in stone... lol 3/18/2019
#2
35mm
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 04:14:44 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby vladasyn 2017/11/25 05:01:33
For **** sake don't go Pro Tools. There is nothing pro about it... well, except all the pros use it. Seriously, my personal opinion, I was introduced to it years ago and hated it. I used to be an engineer in the analog days and got out of that when things went digital, I went digital too, but settled down and became a dad. A pro audio collage set up near me and every student I met said, "Pro Tools is great what do you use?" I would say, "Cakewalk. It's the best" They would say, "Oh really? That's not pro though is it?" I would say, "Oh yes it is if you know how to use it like a pro. Pro Tools is the worst pile of boll*cks out there but you have learned how to use it because you have to." This one ex student came up to me a few years later and said, "I'm sorry. You were right. Pro Tools is a pile of crap." The bottom line is that studios only use Pro Tools because it (somehow) became the industry standard the same way that a pair of crap sounding Yamaha NS10's became the industry standard. 'Industry standard' doesn't mean best. It means standard. Save your self the hassle and don't aim for standard! There are so many problems with switching to Pro Tools and once you have done it you just want to go back again.

Splat, Win 10 64bit and all sorts of musical odds and sods collected over the years, but still missing a lot of my old analogue stuff I sold off years ago.
#3
bobgassert
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 04:17:50 (permalink)
Pro tools is what most of the pros are using . Now that its 64 bit and plugin s are AAX 64 its time for me to finally ween myself off Sonar and just go for it ...

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#4
gprokap
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 04:30:29 (permalink)
Is you had a reason to use tools you'd already be using it.  It's the standard, but it's backward and ****ed.
#5
Frank Harvey
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 04:34:09 (permalink)
This Is Very Interesting...............
How many others are pondering Pro Tools ?
How many feel similarly to '35mm' ?
#6
larkvoz
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 04:50:05 (permalink)
Sonar Platinum and a decent laptop.  Good to go!
 
Pro Tools and a decent laptop: No money left, no free time.
#7
BenMMusTech
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 05:16:54 (permalink)
Lol ProFools, look if you're a 'real' musician and you don't mind limited functionality beyond editing and mixing...then indeed ProFools is for you, but if you're a composer or a midi composer or indeed a hybrid muso/virtual composer as many of us are her in Cake land...then Pro Fools has nothing to offer. And I'm not even sure how anyone could edit using ProFools either. It is a dogs breakfast, particularly for those of us who like a visual representation of the timing of a piece...Sonar you can change the ruler, or have multiple rulers at the top of the track screen...Pro Fools gets really confusing for me in this regard. I'm not sure if they changed the colour of grey either...even since Sonar could be redskined with a darker colour...it is so much easier on the eyes. I've been bouncing tracks out of X3 over the last few weeks, dotting t's and crossing i's ;)...I can't access old 32bit DXIs included with Project 5, but going back to the grey is really hard on the eye. 
 
Finally, this idea of industry standard is like Crapple's clever lie - remember It Works. ProFools clever lie of - It's Industry Standard - has and does still cause so much damage to the creative industries in general because of homogenization - their dinky little plugin collection - horrible and ProFools in reality is nothing more than a digital mixing desk and recorder, the creative possibilities are limited in comparison to a program like Sonar, which has...had groove loops, a step sequencer, the prochannel for the newbs, a serperate midi page for midi composing - has ProFools even fixed this? The list goes on...ugh ProFools. I have all these audio production and music tech degrees, and I always refused to use ProFools. 

Benjamin Phillips-Bachelor of Creative Technology (Sound and Audio Production), (Hons) Sonic Arts, MMusTech (Master of Music Technology), M.Phil (Fine Art)
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#8
35mm
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 05:28:19 (permalink)
Pro Tools
It's a dog's breakfast.
 
New marketing slogan for Avid right there!

Splat, Win 10 64bit and all sorts of musical odds and sods collected over the years, but still missing a lot of my old analogue stuff I sold off years ago.
#9
Razorwit
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 05:52:01 (permalink)
Just my .02 - I like PT quite a bit, have for some time, particularly for the film editing and scoring work that comes through my joint. The only thing holding me back now from buying the upgrade to PTHD12 and moving over fully is their ridiculous 32 channel limit for ASIO hardware. If they would support all my I/O I'd probably move over fully. Try it out, you might like it. Horses for courses and all.
 
Dean

Intel Core i7; 32GB RAM; Win10 Pro x64;RME HDSPe MADI FX; Orion 32 and Lynx Aurora 16; Mics and other stuff...
#10
Frank Harvey
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 05:56:32 (permalink)
MORE INPUT PLEASE.......This is dashed good info !!
#11
hbarton
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 05:59:58 (permalink)
35mm
Pro Tools
It's a dog's breakfast.
 
New marketing slogan for Avid right there!


Wow, Glad I never went there - thanks for that.
 
Just curious of your thoughts - it always impressed me that, if you just wanted to be a "mix tech," then PT would be what you should know (so you could jump from studio to studio and get paid to mix). However, if you more of the creative type, then most other DAWs would be the better choice (and a lot cheaper in the long run). Since I never used PT, I am probably not aware of the unique features the PT software offers over the other DAWs (but it sounds like there are not many).
 
Take care,
 
h
#12
John
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 06:25:52 (permalink)
I think its to each their own. I think as a Sonar user I like to think I am independent. I don't need anyones approval for a choice I make using my own money. If some one is happy with PT so be it. What I think there is far to much of is bashing the other guys choice because its not yours. I went through the DAW wars a long time ago. It is a futile time wasting exercise. If you can make good music using PT then you are doing the right thing.

Best
John
#13
Frank Harvey
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 06:37:23 (permalink)
hbarton
35mm
Pro Tools
It's a dog's breakfast.
 
New marketing slogan for Avid right there!


Wow, Glad I never went there - thanks for that.
 
Just curious of your thoughts - it always impressed me that, if you just wanted to be a "mix tech," then PT would be what you should know (so you could jump from studio to studio and get paid to mix). However, if you more of the creative type, then most other DAWs would be the better choice (and a lot cheaper in the long run). Since I never used PT, I am probably not aware of the unique features the PT software offers over the other DAWs (but it sounds like there are not many).
 
Take care,
 
h





Hey!........Nice Summary 'h'.........and when I take a cursory glance at 'our' Sonar GUI ( Tracks Views,Console & the rest) ............It simply radiates 'CREATIVITY' ... whereas ..........(following my recent forced investigation) there is something essentially  'Plain Jane' about PT.
I know its about 'AUDIO' but SONAR was King Pin as far as I'm concerned in inspiring you to feel both comfortable and professional as you worked alone.....hours on end........ interfacing with your virtual studio.
I can not believe such a magnificent piece of software is being tipped down the toilet and will be relegated to the 'EXTINCTION' Exhibits at the 'ADVENTURE SCIENCE CENTER' - Nashville.
(ie:I believe that Nashville is where Gibson Head Office Resides).
Good Grief Charlie Brown !!
Cheers ........Frank....... Geelong .............Australia
#14
mudgel
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 06:37:42 (permalink)
I’ll be using PT more and more as it is part of my Slate Raven setup.

Mike V. (MUDGEL)

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#15
Unknowen
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 06:37:59 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby BJN 2017/11/25 14:41:33
well I just spent a few hours in protool... you can use it for free [protools first] no iLok needed....
After using Sonar for years... this seems like a baby toy DAW... too simple, not much of anything...
I was able to even by pass their "Cloud save" as they want to use everything you up load any way they want! lol
5 FX inputs per track/ buss.... 
Man! somehow!!! Splat needs to live on! I'm just doing to Snapshot my computers... then just buy some hard drives and install and pull them onto storage in case I need a fast fix... really this is a cheaper option then buy in pro tools.. 
I'll still look at other DAWs for fun! but... nothing with come close to my SPlat! :(

Hay look,
Somethings are not locked in stone... lol 3/18/2019
#16
mudgel
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 06:46:06 (permalink)
I would not normally take on PT but using it through Raven makes it a very accomplished piece of kit.

PT doesn’t natively have any touch yet with the touch overlay provided through the Raven software it’s entirely different.

Mike V. (MUDGEL)

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#17
richardskeltmusic
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 07:25:25 (permalink)
I used PT when I did a music degree three years ago, and got it on an educational discount. Most of the 10 of us on the course bought a copy, and it was good in that it was easy to transfer work between each other, and our laptops and the studios we recorded in. After I graduated I actually went back to Sonar because after 15 years I was happier in my established workflow and I couldn't work as quickly in PT as it took a little while to work out where functions were - though obviousy that got quicker as familarity grew (I also had it installed on a new macbook so was struggling a bit with MAC/PC functionality).  Those of my classmates who regularly use recording studios are still PT useers - because they really value the fact that they can simply hand their project to the engineer and at the end of their studio time take the file and work on it at home with no complications.  I choose to record at home and haven't been inside a studio since I graduated, so Sonar works for me.  FWIW I also have Logic as it was no-brainer cheap when I got my Macbook. 
 
I don't think any of the DAWs are rubbish.  Good music has been made on all of them. For sure they are different, but different to what you want isn't rubbish for someone else who is getting what they want.  Some individuals use diferent DAWS for different purposes, and its always easier to collaborate with someone using the same software. 
 
I am going to start going into studios again and I will probably pick up PT where I left off.  If I was starting from scratch I would ask myself whether I need to work with other people, if I did I would use what they use.  If I was working solo I would find out what the most common DAW was used by musicians who worked in the same fashion (eg EDM vs live studio work).  Any migration needs an open minded approach to adapting your workflow to the strengths of the new environment, and finding new ways to get to the end result of good music. 
#18
Frank Harvey
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 08:16:33 (permalink)
ANY MORE PRO TOOLS VS SONAR COMMENTS ?
#19
djwayne
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 08:33:30 (permalink)
Pro Tools system requirements ask for a i5 processor., my computer has an i3 processor. So I'd have to replace my computer to use Pro Tools. Nope.
#20
dubdisciple
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 08:46:29 (permalink)
Pro tools is a great choice if you are planning on spending a lot of time in higher end studios that are mainstays for major label acts. The definition of pro is wider than it used to be. Many professionals use other DAWs besides pro tools, however, the bigger names often have tons invested into hardware specifically made to work with PT. Fortunately more and more high end hardware is compatible with other systems.

If you are doing most of your recording and mixing at home/yoir own studio and you are not running a studio geared towards major label acts as clients, your choice of DAW comes down personal preference. I always found Sonar to be several steps ahead of PT on features.
#21
mosspa
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 08:58:18 (permalink)
Seriously, if you are contemplating moving to Pro Tools, look at Mixcraft.  It may not be the "industry standard", but it is more functional, much easier to assimilate (like, it's so intuitive that RTFM is really optional for most), and it's a hell of a lot easier on the pocketbook.  I am currently using Sonar as my main DAW, mostly because of its integration with Addictive Drums, the step sequencers, and I've been with it since it was only a MIDI sequencer.  In my opinion, all of the DAW alternatives have pluses and minuses when compared to Sonar.  Choosing among them is really a function of the Sonar-like functionality you require for your personal workflow, their suitability for your system (i.e., if you have a lot of VSTs and VSTis, don't choose Digital Performer), and the slopes of their learning curves.  I jumped on-board the 'abandon ship' mentality a lot of people are exhibiting here over the past few days, and tried several other DAWs.  Then, I came to my senses and realized that: (1) Sonar is never going to get worse that it already is, and I'm quite satisfied with it except for a few personal niggles; (2) I will always have access to what I currently have (i.e., I trust that before the servers are dead, a means of providing me with new system authorizations will be provided); (3) Mixcraft, my secondary DAW, will continue to improve and make Pro Tools look like the industry joke it really is; and (4) I'm really getting too old to try to master another modern DAW of any complexity rivaling Sonar's.
 
I booted Sonar up tonight and it worked identically to the way it worked last week.  I, then, loaded Alchemy and realized it functions just like it did before the Apple buy-out (better, actually, because I now have acquired all of the expansion packs).  After a few glasses of wine I thought about how lucky I am to have been given the opportunity to have participated in the ride from Twelve Tone Cakewalk 2.0 to SONAR Platinum as it currently exists.  I'm now planning to stick with Sonar and Mixcraft and just ride out the storm.  What's funny, though, is in my couple days of panic, I never even thought about Pro Tools as an acceptable replacement for Sonar.

John

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#22
THambrecht
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 10:46:23 (permalink)
I have checked ProTools a few days, and for me it has a very bad workflow.
Some of my customer said, that they have to work with it - but they hate it.
I think ProTools is good when you have to record a band or orchester as engineer and mix it. But not for composing and creating own music.
Specially for our work Cubase seems to be the best. It has a very good clip management, batch naming of clips and batch export. Offline rendering and so on.
Everyone has different needs.

We digitize tapes, vinyl, dat, md ... in broadcast and studio quality for publishers, public institutions and individuals.
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#23
tonydude
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 10:46:58 (permalink)
Because its pants.
#24
stombs
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 15:05:43 (permalink)
This is a bit of a weird one for me because I've only last week got Sonar Home Studio with Computer Music magazine. Pro Tools is my regular DAW. I have the vanilla version. While I claim to be no wizard with it, I'm still in the ironic position of knowing next to nothing about Sonar, on this Cakewalk forum, and quite a lot more about Pro Tools. For that reason, I can't really compare the virtues of Sonar with Pro Tools. What I will say is users who are used to one particular DAW often take time to get acclimatized to another - this often leads them to trashing the new DAW - because their mindset is used to their familiar method.
 
To me the best thing about Pro Tools is the workflow. For some reason people often think it's complicated. It's actually one of the most straight forward DAWs you'll find. It's like a visual linear tape recorder. It basically has two, or perhaps three (including the Midi Editor), main windows. The Edit Window (with tracks and playlist) and the Mix Window. The third would be the piano roll Midi Editor. However, you can also switch a midi track to Notes in the Edit Window to give a midi lane throughout the duration of the song (I like this feature typically for working with drum/percussion patterns, where small pattern changes are required on the fly).
 
My favourite recent feature has to be Commit. Apparently, Pro Tools lagged beyond with Freeze. Now it has Freeze and Commit real-time bouncing. I always choose Commit. It's so easy. For example, you have an Instrument Track ready for audio. Right-click, review the options, Okay, done! The midi is faithfully reproduced as an Audio Track, and the Instrument Track is disabled and hidden out of view.
 
I also suggest that even if Pro Tools isn't the best DAW - due to it's wide use by professionals - it may still be the best one to learn. As somebody indicated above, just knowing how to use Pro Tools opens up doors and makes it easier when taking your work to a pro studio that uses it.
 
Some negatives to bear in mind: 
 
It's expensive. Subscription model.
 
AAX plug-in format only. Although now widely used (I now only buy AAX compatible plug-ins). The way around this is to buy a bridge plug-in. I regularly use 64bit VSTs by using Blue Cat's PatchWork or MB-7 EQ. Both are very good for much more than VST hosting.
 
No vocal align or pitch editor like Melodyne. I've noticed with the better Sonar packages, you get these. An alternative is to buy Revoice Pro, which covers both, is very good, and works well in PT. Expensive though. Waves Tune is often on sale and is a good pitch editor for PT.
 
iLok. This can be annoying, if not working. I've never had much trouble with it. Has some advantages too: software serials on your iLok can be taken with you and used at your destination; you'll no longer need to worry about avoiding iLok software, such as Revoice Pro and several others - you may prefer to put them on your iLok!
 
I hope that helps in some way.
post edited by stombs - 2017/11/25 15:31:58
#25
ChazEd
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 15:19:27 (permalink)
LOL lots of ProTools haters out there.
 
But hey, guess what? ProTools is stronger than ever.
 
In my opinion, the choice is easy:
 
Audio? ProTools.
 
Midi? Cubase.
 
Have a Mac? Logic.
 
Any of those are better than a zombified terminal vaporware just waiting the last nail in the coffin.

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#26
spacey
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 16:09:06 (permalink)
PT will be my next move when I make it.
 
 
 
 
 
#27
vladasyn
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 18:10:41 (permalink)
What is it about 32 inputs for Hardware? I have already 44. Deal breaker, I guess. 
 
 My favorite recent feature has to be Commit. Apparently, Pro Tools lagged beyond with Freeze. Now it has Freeze and Commit real-time bouncing. I always choose Commit. It's so easy. For example, you have an Instrument Track ready for audio. Right-click, review the options, Okay, done! The midi is faithfully reproduced as an Audio Track, and the Instrument Track is disabled and hidden out of view.

 
For me this is THE MOST important feature, also Sonar had it for years, new feature of Sonar is to instead of Freeze track and let it convert to Audio, just enable Record on the track and record the audio of software synth, and NOT have that synth disappearing when it done. 

https://soundcloud.com/vlada-astral 
http://vladasyn.wix.com/astral#
I am a female. Windows 8.1
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#28
mudgel
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 18:22:00 (permalink)
you can have more than the fixed number of inputs just not record more simultaneously. Or go HD. That’s what I did.

Mike V. (MUDGEL)

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#29
stombs
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Re: Why Not ProTools? 2017/11/25 18:30:00 (permalink)
Yes, 32 vanilla, but 256 HD.
 
http://www.avid.com/pro-tools/compare
#30
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