Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's?

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Rbh
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/02/12 20:55:02 (permalink)
I think part of the story is that Ns-10 are bass shy.... so you over compensate and mix a bass heavy track. Well mixing bass heavy became very popular. There in lies the hype - you make half decent sounding on them and you have a thumpin ass track. Conversely, you mix on a bass heavy monitor and when it translates to other systems - it sounds whimpy....hmmm must be the monitors fault. It usually comes down to knowing your room system and monitors over a long period of time.

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#31
digitalboy
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/02/12 22:44:00 (permalink)
"I think part of the story is that Ns-10 are bass shy.... "

The real problem for me is that the NS-10's are "tone shy" - completely toneless 

I can't think of a single redeeming quality that they might have....

What's the point in trying to mix on some speakers where so much of the audio information is going to be completely lost in the process ?

Yamaha would be doing us all a big favour if they recalled every single NS-10 and destroyed the lot  

post edited by digitalboy - 2012/02/12 22:45:02

Sorry - I don't use Autotune :)
#32
Gaffpro
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/02/13 02:29:47 (permalink)
Digitalboy: I'd love to hear your monitors....sounds like you took the bull by the horns...good for you...do you have a mixed song that you could put up?

Another reason I remember having to get NS10's in the 80's is that every commercial studio had them.....compatibility.....kind of like why you need Pro Tools if you go back and forth from home to a commercial facility, lol

If you listen to Natalie Cole's Unforgettable CD (don't remember the exact cd title)....all of the tunes were mixed through NS10's......but then again David Foster was in the room

Has anyone tried Dynaudio's? They are used at the Nashville facility (in the avatar photo)....I really liked them, but then again the chief engineer is stellar.....listen to any Jason Aldean cut.....fat sounding as all get out

I just want something where everything is flat, particularly not bass heavy monitors......ironically with the NS10's I never mixed bass heavy to compensate, I guess I just got used to them

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#33
Brandon Ryan [Roland]
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/02/13 03:41:20 (permalink)
Gaffpro


Has anyone tried Dynaudio's? They are used at the Nashville facility (in the avatar photo)....I really liked them, but then again the chief engineer is stellar.....listen to any Jason Aldean cut.....fat sounding as all get out

I really love Dynaudio monitors - always have. There's just something about them...

Someday maybe I'll get a pair.

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#34
Cactus Music
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/02/13 15:35:36 (permalink)
In defense of the NSM10, They will say you either love em or hate them, so leave it at that.

They sound pretty sad as a home stereo set ( I tried them) but all I can say is if you learn to trust them your mix WILL translate on to MORE other systems than most monitors that are out there. If you look closely at pictures of every major studio taken over the last 2 decades there they are sitting on the meter bridge.  Never alone, other much better monitors are also present. Lets just say that they were a tool that worked, and worked well for the majority of engineers.

 It was never a scam or a hype, only hobbyist fall for that kind of behavior. This is why they are a anonymity and always start a lively conversation. Hate em or love em, they will be missed by many.

PS, Bass is easy to add to playback via sub, or most any other monitor.  
post edited by Cactus Music - 2012/02/13 16:06:12

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#35
Dave King
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/02/13 15:59:02 (permalink)
Well it become a requirement that if you pose for a picture in a audio magazine there better be a pair of NSM 10's in the background or you'll have no credibility at all.

 
 

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#36
ChuckC
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/02/13 16:10:06 (permalink)
Digitalboy - Sounds cool , I'd love to see some pics of yer monitors, maybe hear a mix?  How much did you spend on the parts to make them?  I am very good with wood working and have also been considering building some monitors myself so I am intrigued!

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#37
digitalboy
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/02/15 18:02:08 (permalink)
ChuckC


Digitalboy - Sounds cool , I'd love to see some pics of yer monitors, maybe hear a mix?  How much did you spend on the parts to make them?  I am very good with wood working and have also been considering building some monitors myself so I am intrigued!
Here's a link to the main speakers that I built a gazillion years ago now...I built three pairs of the ME2's with twin 8" subs using the Scan Speak 21W/8555-01 in each sub...
 
http://www.nutshellhifi.com/Ariel.html
http://www.nutshellhifi.com/ME2txt.html#me2 
 
The bass in that system is controlled by a very high tech method...There is a sock in each sub port  
 
The ME2's are sealed...
 
I also built some 2 way speakers using the Scan Speak 18W/8543-00 and the D2905/9000... 

I've been building amps for many years now - from Class A heaters,to sweet sounding mosfet A/B designs etc and I was blown away when I heard the Gainclone amps.
 
It also fitted in perfectly with my "green",low energy philosphy and my love of minimalism...
 
I have built many Gainclones now,using most of the available chips and they all sound good...
 
There's one point to point design that uses the most minimal approach and it is very cool.... 
 
http://dogbreath.de/Chipamps/GainCardCopy/GainCardCopy.html
 
These amps also sound great as a clean power amp for guitar ...Well they work for me...
 
Do the Google thing and you'll find heaps of info on these amps...
 
You can get great kits here http://www.audiosector.com/ and here http://chipamp.com/
 
The LM3875 started it all,but the LM3886,LM4780 and even the LM1875 work fine...
 
There's also the TDA series - great sounding mosfet chips - TDA7293,TDA7294 etc....
 
Once again there may be newer chips available,but these are what I was playing around with...
 
I can post some mixes at some stage,but if you're going to listen to them through NS10's,there's no point  
 
These DIY systems can sound better than many of the sexy looking "Hi-Fi" offerings out there...
 
Pick great sounding source material ( "Steps" by Pat Coil - Sheffield Lab - is one that comes to mind) and then close your eyes and listen....
 
That's a good place to start.....

 
BTW...Many of the Dynaudio speakers use Scan Speak drivers and they only ever use the best quality components..

post edited by digitalboy - 2012/02/16 19:32:12

Sorry - I don't use Autotune :)
#38
bobguitkillerleft
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/01 09:12:12 (permalink)
Speechless http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_sacat=0&_from=R40&_nkw=yamaha+ns10m+studio&_sop=3
I recorded an album with an early band,and most of the monitoring was done with the NS 10's,and even though the studio was fairly inexpensive,they had massive expensive looking corner/ceiling mounted 3 three ways with 15" bass drivers as well.
 
I actually remember the band especially the guitars sounded surprisingly good considering what I'd heard said[negatively]about these speakers,but I must say I'm thoroughly repulsed at the price they now go for second hand,i.e. link.
 
When this thread was written[I had to modify my link as I just discovered it now[Feb. 4th 2014] led to a basic home page of everything and anything on ebay whereas when I pasted it back in Nov.02 2012 it did lead to $800+ sets,now thei're even more.
 
Not too long after this thread,there was a Japanese fellow selling sets for around $200 AUD a pair,qute reasonable considering but freight to Adelaide was another 200+,which was lot considering I got some 5" Rokits sent from San Jose for less,and as they're powered they're a LOT heavier,though I still kind of wished I'd sprung for a pair of the 2 hundred ones now,hindsight is annoying hey.
 
Like Cactus,I don't believe for a second they couldn't replicate them fairly easily but just don't,which does irritate,as I do have this nagging want for a set,since I actually did like them that week in that studio back in 89,but there is no way I'm forking anymore than a few hundred max,since they are just bookshelf home stereo speakers,and that is the most they"re worth especially with mold on the yellowing speaker cones,and magnets falling off in transit,and of course pre blown,due to age.
Bob
post edited by bobguitkillerleft - 2014/02/03 14:29:54

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#39
Ham N Egz
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/01 13:19:25 (permalink)
RE: REISSUE the NS10 type speaker

Mr Uli Behringer, the gauntlet has been thrown down...

you even include a sheet of tissue paper with each speaker..

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#40
Dave King
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/01 15:23:11 (permalink)
Wow. Nice price for that pair. I have a pair in mint condition. Makes me think...

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#41
ChuckC
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/02 13:51:23 (permalink)
The one on the right looks like the cone is screwed up.

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#42
Kev999
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/02 17:46:51 (permalink)

NS10s, ProTools, Apple Macs,...

It's funny how professionals choose gear that no self-respecting amateur would want to be associated with.

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#43
Gaffpro
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/03 11:16:55 (permalink)
Ns10's translate well...that's why I'm keeping mine.....sure they're bright, bass shy,etc. but I still love 'em

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#44
Cactus Music
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/03 11:41:52 (permalink)
Proof. I just posted some songs all mixed on the NMS10- everyone agreed they sounded good on their systems too. If there's another monitor that does that for me then I'll buy them. 

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#45
Cactus Music
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/03 11:43:59 (permalink)
Double
post edited by Cactus Music - 2012/11/03 11:50:12

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#46
Gaffpro
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/04 16:04:12 (permalink)
Ditto that............again, there's a reason that they're still used in major studios.....I think the people that constantly bash them haven't really used them for any length of time....I'd rather mix on them then some powered bass heavy monitor any day of the week

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#47
Dave Modisette
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/04 19:22:03 (permalink)
Got a set of NS 10Ms myself and I don't see me getting rid of them.


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#48
Ozz
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/04 20:41:51 (permalink)
I remember reading an interview some years ago with a well respected engineer, who As luck would have it, I can't remember, stating the reason everybody used the ns10ms, was because everyone ELSE was using them, and not because they were any good.  ;)

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#49
EricDeluxe
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/04 22:55:56 (permalink)
I have never heard or tried NS10 myself, but I understand that many find them very good and they are still used in many professionell studios. 

When I purchased my monitors; Yamaha HS50m, some people I trust, in regards to music gear, compared NS10 with HS50. I compared HS50 with serveral well-known brands, including KRK, Adam, Genelec and Focal. 

For My liking Yamaha beat them all! I prefer a clean and "honest" sound. In mixing this is key for me. I did find e. g. Genelec lacking some "clearance" with too much bass. I understand that people like different sounds, but for me, I go with Yamaha any day:)

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#50
Gaffpro
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/05 11:15:32 (permalink)
Yes, a few engineers have said that about NS10's..........I came from the world of commercial studios long before I had a home rig and bought NS10's to be compatible with the studios I was working in (Criteria, TK, New River, and a few others back then). But over a short period of time, I learned how to use these speakers and actually trust them even today. Yes, they have a high mid bump and again are bass shy......but if they sounded so bad, no one of any commercial caliber would be using them.

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RNC 1773, DBX 163x, Joe Meek VC3Q compressors
DBX 263x deesser
Neumann U87, TLM 103, AKG 214, CAD E100s 
Peluso 2247SE 
AT4050 and 4051
Shure KSM27, SM7, SM57, and UnidyneIII (from the 60's)
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#51
Cactus Music
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/05 12:09:48 (permalink)
Like I said, the proof is the fact that once you have used them and trust them, ALL your mixes translate to ALL other systems, I don't know why this is and don't care. It just works. The people who bash them just don't get it, no problem. It's what ever gets the job done and if you have monitors that do the same for you, that is most excellent. I'm sure there must be others one would think. 
post edited by Cactus Music - 2012/11/05 13:08:52

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#52
Ham N Egz
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/05 12:43:23 (permalink)
Interesting discussion on NS10s over on the womb even Ethen Winer chimes in..
 
NSFW some "earthy language" in the replies

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#53
Zeth
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Re:Why did Yamaha stop producing the NS10's? 2012/11/23 11:34:55 (permalink)
A Company in the UK make a repo of the NS10's
These are the SN10. You can find them at Studiospares.
www.studiospares.com
They also make an amp which fits directly on the back of the speakers to drive the units. I have not tryed them however the report i hear are most faverable.
#54
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