Camel Toe
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Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
Recently discovering Windows 7 we found that it is a LOT more stable than XP. However, when a fair amount of VSTs are in use, the CPU meters in Sonar appear to be uneven. The top one is red lining and the others hardly in use. The overall percentage can be at 90% while Window's Task Manager claims only about 25% of CPU usage.
As this processor uses hyperthreading, 8 cores appear in Sonar. According to Windows, half of the cores are "parked" and not in use. Has anyone else tried pushing this particular processor in Windows 7? The load distribuition is fine in XP. It seems to be either an update being needed or a way to switch off processor parking. Any advice would be most welcome before the PC gets thrown out of the window!!!
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rickbail
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 08:08:10
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I noticed a similar issue, but in my case Sonar is indicating approximately 15% usage with the task manager showing 70%.
AMD Dual core 3800+ Nvidia 9600 GTOC 2 gig ram Sonar 8.3.1 Win 7
Rick
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Camel Toe
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 08:18:53
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i take it you did'nt manage to sort it out?
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daveny5
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 08:35:47
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Any advice would be most welcome before the PC gets thrown out of the window!!! Sure. Don't run a pre-production operating system like Windows 7.
Dave Computer: Intel i7, ASROCK H170M, 16GB/5TB+, Windows 10 Pro 64-bit, Sonar Platinum, TASCAM US-16x08, Cakewalk UM-3G MIDI I/F Instruments: SL-880 Keyboard controller, Korg 05R/W, Korg N1R, KORG Wavestation EX Axes: Fender Stratocaster, Line6 Variax 300, Ovation Acoustic, Takamine Nylon Acoustic, Behringer GX212 amp, Shure SM-58 mic, Rode NT1 condenser mic. Outboard: Mackie 1402-VLZ mixer, TC Helicon VoiceLive 2, Digitech Vocalist WS EX, PODXTLive, various stompboxes and stuff. Controllers: Korg nanoKONTROL, Wacom Bamboo Touchpad
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Camel Toe
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 08:41:56
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If you read above, XP is unstable with Sonar 8 hence the switch of OS. Vista isn't worth a w**k so we are only left with the pre-production option....Everything else on Windows 7 is great apart from this issue. Any stable, working system would be great and this is the closest we have yet found!
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g_randybrown
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 09:34:35
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Apparently that is Dave's favorite advice to give now...in fact he said it to me when I was having an issue with Windows 7....now I'm very happy with making the switch. As for your issue you may want to check this out Good luck, Randy
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rstollen
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 18:33:46
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ORIGINAL: daveny5
Any advice would be most welcome before the PC gets thrown out of the window!!!
Sure. Don't run a pre-production operating system like Windows 7.
Dave, why do you bother replying. By now, everybody already knows that you have a thing against bothering with Windows 7. Your usual "don't use it" is never the answer we're looking for. 
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slartabartfast
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 18:56:58
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F**k Windows 7. What's a w**k? ORIGINAL: Camel Toe
If you read above, XP is unstable with Sonar 8 hence the switch of OS. Vista isn't worth a w**k so we are only left with the pre-production option....Everything else on Windows 7 is great apart from this issue. Any stable, working system would be great and this is the closest we have yet found!
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John
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 19:09:54
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In this case Dave is right. All you that are running Windows 7 need to realized that its going to poop out on you and it will not be a permanent OS. I don't see why anyone would ask here about how to get it to work. It ain't gonna last. I wonder what you guys are thinking when you go to all this trouble for nothing.
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rstollen
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 20:06:42
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ORIGINAL: John
In this case Dave is right. All you that are running Windows 7 need to realized that its going to poop out on you and it will not be a permanent OS. I don't see why anyone would ask here about how to get it to work. It ain't gonna last. I wonder what you guys are thinking when you go to all this trouble for nothing.
I think it's an enthusiast and experimentation issue. Everybody who is using Windows 7 understands that it's temporary, and they just want to give it a try for whatever reasons. It's not like anybody is going to risk the operation of a pro studio on a Release Candidate operating system. Dave, can't you just ignore the Windows 7 threads? I know you don't like it, but just let it go.
post edited by rstollen - 2009/05/15 20:16:49
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John
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 20:26:28
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I think it's an enthusiast and experimentation issue. Everybody who is using Windows 7 understands that it's temporary, and they just want to give it a try for whatever reasons. It's not like anybody is going to risk the operation of a pro studio on a Release Candidate operating system. Maybe maybe not. We have enough issues with supported OSs I don't see why we need to open up another can of worms. MY point is that anyone using Windows 7 with Sonar is not in a serious situation. There are way too many other users that are still having issues thus we don't need to add this too. I have Windows 7 but I will be darned if I am going to waste this boards time with questions about it. It really is very off topic. Nothing we say is necessarily going to be true as time goes by anyway. And yes Sonar is a pro app. It behooves those using it to do due care in how they set it up. All the registrations of all the plugins will be lost. All the carefully made customizations will be lost. Why on earth should we encourage this sort of thing? Being a beta tester for Microsoft is a lonely job and should be. There are places that will want to deal with this. I don't think at this time it should be happening here. Obviously others have a very different point of view but I am in support of Dave's post and why he posted it.
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rstollen
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 20:34:06
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ORIGINAL: John
I think it's an enthusiast and experimentation issue. Everybody who is using Windows 7 understands that it's temporary, and they just want to give it a try for whatever reasons. It's not like anybody is going to risk the operation of a pro studio on a Release Candidate operating system. Maybe maybe not. We have enough issues with supported OSs I don't see why we need to open up another can of worms.
MY point is that anyone using Windows 7 with Sonar is not in a serious situation. There are way too many other users that are still having issues thus we don't need to add this too. I have Windows 7 but I will be darned if I am going to waste this boards time with questions about it. It really is very off topic. Nothing we say is necessarily going to be true as time goes by anyway.
And yes Sonar is a pro app. It behooves those using it to do due care in how they set it up. All the registrations of all the plugins will be lost. All the carefully made customizations will be lost. Why on earth should we encourage this sort of thing?
Being a beta tester for Microsoft is a lonely job and should be. There are places that will want to deal with this. I don't think at this time it should be happening here.
Obviously others have a very different point of view but I am in support of Dave's post and why he posted it.
I understand what your saying, and I agree with your point about anybody using Windows 7 is not in a serious situation. But I don't agree that it's a waste of the board's time. If "Windows 7" is in the subject, it's easy to just ignore it. Not to make waves  , but I think it's fine for the OS enthusiasts to exchange info here. My guess is that CW wouldn't mind also, as they may get a taste of the issues that users face with a beta or RC operating system.
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John
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 20:42:18
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but I think it's fine for the OS enthusiasts to exchange info here. My guess is that CW wouldn't mind also, as they may get a taste of the issues that users face with a beta or RC operating system.
And what is that going to do for them? I don't think they need or want us dealing with this before they have even said they will support it. That isn't a sure thing. Likely they will but they will not be supporting an OS that will self destruct in a few months. MS may have done a great PR coup in having this release but it does CW no good what so ever. Like I said its a matter that we can see as being of disagreement and not being disagreeable.
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rstollen
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 20:46:11
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I agree, I think.
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Silence Dogood
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 21:23:11
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John wrote: We have enough issues with supported OSs I don't see why we need to open up another can of worms. Dude, you're as bad as "Dave". If you aren't interested in actually contributing to the topic thread, then move on... Or are you the guardian of the topics, and I've just not noticed... Oh, that's right I just remembered, it's YOU (again). I think I've just been punkd.
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Rajay1
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 21:32:40
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ORIGINAL: John
In this case Dave is right. All you that are running Windows 7 need to realized that its going to poop out on you and it will not be a permanent OS. I don't see why anyone would ask here about how to get it to work. It ain't gonna last. I wonder what you guys are thinking when you go to all this trouble for nothing.
Now I'm really confused. Here I am just waiting on the release of Windows 7 before I build my new machine and you're telling me "it ain't gonna last"? I usually listen when you speak (E.F. Hutton) but c'mon, you gotta tell me more than that John.
Rajay SPE6.2.1,GS3Orch,GVI,Reason3.0,StylusRMX,Trilogy,VGuitarist2, Battery3,B4II,CoolEditPro2.1,TranslatorPro,IBM M51 P4530 3GHzHT 4GBDDR 80GBSATA,2xWD149GBFW,KurzweilK2500XL,Event 20/20,2xMackie 1604,Delta1010, MidiTimepiece AV, MX8,On and on....
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John
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 21:49:41
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Now I'm really confused. Here I am just waiting on the release of Windows 7 before I build my new machine and you're telling me "it ain't gonna last"? I usually listen when you speak (E.F. Hutton) but c'mon, you gotta tell me more than that John.
LOL no. The Windows 7 RC is a temporary OS. Don't build your new computer using it. Wait till the full version is released. Or use Vista. Your post has made this whole thread worth while if only to inform you of the situation.
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Tom Riggs
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 21:55:05
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I think John is referring to the fact that the windows 7 Rc will time out and have to be reloaded.
I thought of that myself. I have done some light testing of windows 7 on a separate partition just to get a feel for how it is going to work. In my case I am happily plugging along with Vista sp2 x64 and sonar 8.3.1 x64. For me things are working pretty well no major complaints on vista and windows 7 is ok as far as I have tested it but I have not spent much time using it.
To the OP I would suggest that it seems that windows 7/sonar is not liking the 8 core system. The suggestion that you head over to the windows 7 forums to search for a solution or ask for help is a good one IMO. If/When you get it fixed report back and let us know what you had to do.
As for the purpose of the thread
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timboe
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 22:04:35
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Oh dear, posts like this are why people still think Win 98 is the best o/s ...... The Win 7 RC is *the* most stable and bug test o/s ever released and its not even final - no O/S, not 95, 98 98SE, ME, XP or NT have ever had the stress and rigour testing that the Win 7 RC has so far had, and as I say, its still not even final. If you think these other o/s are more stable than the current Win 7 RC then (i) you havent used Win 7 RC and/or (ii) your hardware / software / drivers are still not yet ready for Vista / Win 7 [ remember that Win 7 is simply an evolution (not revolution) from Vista and if your gear is Vista compliant, its also Win 7 compliant ]. For DAW purposes, Vista SP2 x64 and Win7 RC x64 are both as good as each other - like I've said before, if you are worried or paranoid about the fact the Win 7 is still only a RC, then run Vista SP2 [x64 for both] Win 7 has been " feature locked " since the BETA was finalised - all that is happening now is the "public" are being asked to look for bugs [ MS are doing the same internally ] - no new features have been added since the BETA - the RC is rock stable. Anyway, pardon my frustration, but to the op's question. Win 7 was designed ground up to be much more "system aware" - one of these features is " CPU Parking " - brilliant for everyone but a massive disaster for DAW's. Its not direclty "disablable" via system controls - it may be in gpedit but to be honest, I havent yet looked - but guess what though - there is a very easy fix. The Fix Open " regedit " - go to EDIT / FIND .... search for " Parking " [ without the " " ] and delete every mother-key on the left hand side of the screen containing this reference- use F3 to keep finding / searching for the next entry once you delete one. From memory, there will be around 4 or 5 mother-keys you will not be able to delete [ dont worry about these ] and there will be around 4 to 6 mother-keys that you will be able to delete ... once finished - F3 will tell you there are no more entries to find, close regedit, do a full cold shut down and re-boot - problem fixed. All up it will only take you about 30 seconds to find and delete all the entries and "turn off" this "feature". How to I know the above ? We've been running Win 7 RC x64 for 3 weeks now in our smaller "virtual-studio" [ S 8.3.1 ] and it has been running in a highly spec'd Core i7 and running massive Sonar projects at 0.7ms and 1.5ms latencies - projects that have the cpu meter [ all 8 cores] hovering around %70 - its doing all this dropout-free, glitch-free, crackle-free. And heres the best part, the above regedit fix was only 1 of 5 "tweaks" done - the only other 4 tweaks were to disable the Windows Search Service, disable the Windows Superfetch Service and disable all USB and disable the AutoRun - everything else [ Aero inlcuded ] was left untouched / stock. Maybe in future, could we keep the comments to "informed" comments rather than "assumptions" and only comment when you have installed it, and given it some real-time production time [ real world use ]. As I've said before, if your hardware / software / drivers are now / already Vista compatible, there is no reaosn to not be running Vista SP2 [ x64 ] or Win 7 RC other than personal preferecne [ which is totally fine ], but enough of the Vista SP2 / Win 7 RC arent as stable / good as XP comments - its just wrong and very misleading. tim
post edited by timboe - 2009/05/15 22:23:38
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John
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 22:06:54
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Tom my posting here was in defense of Dave only. I just went a little too far in why I thought he was right. In a way I pushed this beyond where it needed to go. Thanks for bringing me back to some sort of balance.
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Tom Riggs
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 22:23:59
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great post but I'm not clear on something. I am just searching the regestry and I find the work parking in a value on the right hand pane on regedit. On the left the Key has a different name. Is this what you mean by searching and deleting the parent key that contains objects with the word "parking" or do you mean the word parking is in the name of the parent key itself?
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timboe
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 22:26:07
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Hi John
I know what you mean and certainly no need to "re-balance" yourself - your posts around here are always great !!!
I just get a bit frustrated about this issue.
No-one was a bigger critic of Vista SP0 and Vista SP1 and with those on offer, XP was the "best" option - no two ways about it.
But from the first moment we started testing the Vista SP2 Pre-Release it was immedialty obvious something had changed - and changed big time for the better.
When the Win 7 BETA and now RC came out, things were just as good.
The PC DAW O/S we had all been waiting for was finally here.
Finally, MS had delivered the stable low latecny O/S we had been waiting for for years - personally, I'd given up, thinking maybe Win 8 may be the one.
Like I've said, if your hardware / software / drivers are Vista compliant - do a clean Vista SP2 [ or Win 7 RC install ] - you will not go back.
All the best John !
tim
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timboe
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 22:33:03
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ORIGINAL: Tom Riggs
great post but I'm not clear on something. I am just searching the regestry and I find the work parking in a value on the right hand pane on regedit. On the left the Key has a different name. Is this what you mean by searching and deleting the parent key that contains objects with the word "parking" or do you mean the word parking is in the name of the parent key itself?
Hi Tom " ..... On the left the Key has a different name. Is this what you mean by searching and deleting the parent key that contains objects with the word ..... " Yes - when you see a search hit / find in the right hand pane, it will actually be contained in a parent / mother key in the left-hand side pane - this is the one to delete as it will also delete the sub-parent / mother keys which are also related. Sorry if my explanations are a bit unlcear, but am trying to expalin as best I can. tim
post edited by timboe - 2009/05/15 22:43:34
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Tom Riggs
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 22:33:23
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sorry double post
post edited by Tom Riggs - 2009/05/15 22:56:19
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Rajay1
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 22:35:21
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I hope you aren't upset with me for my post. All I seek is knowledge my friend, and you've given me some. I've watched every new OS release since the Commodore 64, where I started with computers that is, and each one was heralded as the best thing since sliced bread. (I'm 60) Since I'm not a tech (in fact I'm technically challenged) I try to read every post I can that all the beta testers post with regards to the potential bugs. The one about the cores sitting in park to me was one of the most serious issues. I've read of possible fixes in the test version but I'm waiting to see how the fix in the final release pans out with all the other fixes. I've seen over many years where one fix develops into another problem when other fixes are added. Many thanks for your insight. Not a problem for me if I have to network several XP 32s until I'm comfortable with the change. Getting older brings with it more patience thank goodness.
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timboe
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 22:36:19
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Hi Tom
I think you may have accidenlty double-posted.
See my response above in Post # 23
tim
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John
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 22:43:03
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Tim I shouldn't say this but I agree with everything you said about Win 7 and Vista. I have found it to be much better in its responsiveness then Vista. This is true only of the RC it is not true of the beta. This is I believe due to a number things. The most important is it is better optimized for desktop computing then Vista is. What I mean by that is there is very little waiting for anything to happen. Disks pop up faster. Directories read faster and so on. Right now I think it will be a killer OS. You are wrong though on Windows 7 being finalized. The code is but what it will come with is still up in the air. Some things will be in different versions just as they are in the various versions of Vista. We need to wait and see just what they have in mind. But by and large we are in a good place as far as OSs are concerned. BTW Vista is still much faster then XP.
I know I am going to regret the above but it should be said.
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timboe
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 22:46:51
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ORIGINAL: Rajay1
I hope you aren't upset with me for my post. All I seek is knowledge my friend, and you've given me some. I've watched every new OS release since the Commodore 64, where I started with computers that is, and each one was heralded as the best thing since sliced bread. (I'm 60) Since I'm not a tech (in fact I'm technically challenged) I try to read every post I can that all the beta testers post with regards to the potential bugs. The one about the cores sitting in park to me was one of the most serious issues. I've read of possible fixes in the test version but I'm waiting to see how the fix in the final release pans out with all the other fixes. I've seen over many years where one fix develops into another problem when other fixes are added. Many thanks for your insight. Not a problem for me if I have to network several XP 32s until I'm comfortable with the change. Getting older brings with it more patience thank goodness.
Hi Rajay1 I certainly wasnt upset with anything you or anyone else wrote but I think I may have been a bit heavy-handed / blunt in my responses - so for that I should and do apologise. Please do note that the " CPU Parking" feature is not a bug or problem with Win 7 - it is deliberatly and intentionally there and working exaclty as intended, so there wont be a " fix" if you know what I mean. All that will be needed, is that this will be on the list of " must-do-tweaks " when using Win 7 for a DAW - a bit like the list of tweaks we all now do for XP or Vista DAW's. In terms of XP, again, if it does what you want, then I'll be the first to say stick with - I'm a big believer in the old saying, " if it aint broke, dont fix it ". All the best Rajay1 and thanks for your post - gave me a bit of much needed senible perspective. thanks, tim
post edited by timboe - 2009/05/15 22:58:53
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Rajay1
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/15 22:57:33
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I'll see you guys later. Thanks for the lesson but you're gettin' all mushy on me now. I'm going to say 100 hail Marys and have a drink! See ya! BTW, still have that 5 1/4" sequencer disk for the commodore if anyone wants it. 2MB FREE!
post edited by Rajay1 - 2009/05/15 23:17:19
Rajay SPE6.2.1,GS3Orch,GVI,Reason3.0,StylusRMX,Trilogy,VGuitarist2, Battery3,B4II,CoolEditPro2.1,TranslatorPro,IBM M51 P4530 3GHzHT 4GBDDR 80GBSATA,2xWD149GBFW,KurzweilK2500XL,Event 20/20,2xMackie 1604,Delta1010, MidiTimepiece AV, MX8,On and on....
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g_randybrown
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RE: Windows 7 CPU Problem in Sonar 8
2009/05/16 09:36:48
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Please do note that the " CPU Parking" feature is not a bug or problem with Win 7 - it is deliberatly and intentionally there and working exaclty as intended, so there wont be a " fix" if you know what I mean.
All that will be needed, is that this will be on the list of " must-do-tweaks " when using Win 7 for a DAW - a bit like the list of tweaks we all now do for XP or Vista DAW's.
In terms of XP, again, if it does what you want, then I'll be the first to say stick with - I'm a big believer in the old saying, " if it aint broke, dont fix it ". Hey Tim, One thing I did notice about Win 7 vs Vista 64 (SP2) is that when loading my older projects (pre-Win 7) into SP8 that not only was the percentage of cpu that SP8 used being lower (5-8%) but that the usage of the 4 cores (Q6600) were much more evenly distributed. That said, do you think if I disabled the "parking" I would see even better performance? Thanks very much, Randy
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