Windows 8 - What's the verdict?

I have Win8 on one of my work laptops. It's an Lenovo Twist (touchscreen).
My take is this.  It's weird. It's as if in some sense it wants to be a tablet OS, and in another sense it wants to be normal Windows.  You can either have the new Metro style, or you can have the traditional Windows style interface.

Having said that, even when you are in the traditional Windows style UI, things have changed.  They have gotten rid of Window tool bar buttons. So, you don't have the minimize, maximize and close buttons on everything like you had in the past. Rather, you have to grab the window header and drag it all the way to the bottom of the screen. This in my opinion is a HUGE fail! You will find that it's more difficult to navigate at first. There is no "Start" button. However, you can go find Win8 add-ons. I did this immediately. Don't recall the name of the start button add-on that I found, it was free and very slick.

Regarding Sonar and Win8?  Not sure really.  I did load Sonar onto that computer, but I've not really done anything with it.

I have a co worker who said he hated Win8 at first, but forced himself to spend a weekend with it and now he loves it. Said it took some getting used to, but after getting used to it, says it makes sense. I'm personally thinking about making some significant upgrades to my home computer and when I do, most likely I'll put Windows 8 on it.   It's quirky in my opinion, but I suspect that Microsoft will listen to the heat they have taken and address some of the issues.
 
Is it a MUST upgrade?  Na, I wouldn't say so. Not from what I've seen. It is a shift though.

From my perspective, Windows 8 is merely Windows 7 with a new face. I suspect much will work the same, but as always in the software world, new is not always better. In Microsoft's history, the latest OS is nearly always problematic for many until at least the first Service Pack. X2b seems to have taken a performance hit in Windows 7, but maybe is more efficient in Windows 8. X2a was faster in Windows 7 for me. 

Windows 8 is working well here with X2a.  It is definitely a worthy upgrade from XP or Vista... from 7?

Here's what's better:
Task Manager
Explorer file management
Multi monitor task bar and desktop backgrounds
Power management
slightly improved performance

Here's what's annoying:
Start screen searches, in 7 all options appear, in 8 you have to select between programs, settings, and files
The charms menu in between multiple monitors is annoying
The metro apps are pretty, but pointless for a DAW.  Good thing they can be ignored.

Here's the rub.  You used your Windows 7 installation to purchase the $40 upgrade?  That means you'll have to replace that installation of 7 if you are ever to use that software.  So since you can't use it elsewhere, at some point you'll just need to take the plunge and upgrade that DAW.

Technically, the license for 8 replaces 7 so a dual boot with both isn't really allowed, but it would probably work and that sort of thing isn't really what MS is concerned with.

The Windows 8 ISO installation (provided you did download the ISO file and burn it) doesn't actually need the previous version of Windows installed first, you can do a clean install.  It does seem to track the hardware profile though, I replaced a motherboard and hard drive and attempted to clean re-install my Windows 8 upgrade from the disk and ended up spending 45 minutes on the phone with MS to get it activated.

As long as you're not blatantly pirating the installation, customer service will probably help you activate if you're patient enough.

Windows 8 works well. The main thing to watch out for is hardware drivers. You'll more than likely need new drivers for some of your hardware, especially your audio interface.

Scott

--
Scott R. Garrigus - http://garrigus.com - SONAR X2 Power! - http://garrigus.com/?SonarX2Power
* Author of the Cakewalk Sonar and Sony Sound Forge Power book series: http://garrigus.com/?PowerBooks
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To align with most of the comments here, my setup is working great on W8.  Very stable, fast to boot and all round a good experience.  X2a running as good if not better than Sonar 6->8.5 on my legacy hardware. I use a couple of the metro apps because of their accessibility, but most is done on the desktop.

No UI mods installed - haven't found the need for them, not even the Start Menu is missed - mainly because they messed that up from Vista on.  It was great when you could control what was actually in the Start folders (per XP), but massively irrirtating after the internal logic took over.

All in I think MS have done a pretty good job with W8.  So long as they don't kill the desktop entirely I'm happy.

I have yet to read where a poster has complained of Windows 8 being buggy or giving poor performance. 

Those that have an objection to it are referring to the Modern UI formally known as Metro. However once one gets past the Start screen it really is the same windows we know and love with many improvements. 

I really like it.  

My pc is switched off at the wall when I turn it off (due to everything plugged into the USB ports not shutting down) but it still boots up in seconds. I can't believe it is hibernating if it has no power.

Grum.

redbarchetta

Having said that, even when you are in the traditional Windows style UI, things have changed.  They have gotten rid of Window tool bar buttons. So, you don't have the minimize, maximize and close buttons on everything like you had in the past. Rather, you have to grab the window header and drag it all the way to the bottom of the screen.
 
 
This is for METRO apps not for the desktop.   Right clicking provides some links.  Printing from the Metro apps is WAAAYAYYY Stupid.
 
 
The desktop is pretty much the same.  No start button.   Can use add-on replacements.   Classic Shell is one. Up to date, and going.
 
 
Changing settings to use Adobe reader, Windows media player,...  keeps the focus in the desktop.
 
Running 8.5.3, X1, and 2 with windows 8 64.   After X2a and a "newer" driver for the sound card all is well.
 
There are lots of stupid bits about w8, just as there is about the Sonar X series: settings moved, lots of extra clicks,...   But it is possible to minimize these.
 
I have a number of clients who are upgrading computers and OS's for older comps. Some stuff is way better/easier. Some way stupider.
 
But no more annoying than the un-fixed bugs and stupid pieces of w7.  (Windows explorer dropping folder tree to bottom,...)  And the search interface and functionality are still as useless as with vista and 7.

 
 
(As usual: the piece-of-crap forum software refuses to work correctly)

grumbleweed4162


My pc is switched off at the wall when I turn it off (due to everything plugged into the USB ports not shutting down) but it still boots up in seconds. I can't believe it is hibernating if it has no power.

Grum.

Hibernate doesn't require power like suspend does, the RAM contents are saved to a disk partition and simply reloaded to RAM when powered back up so the system state is retained.  Much faster than reloading everything from scratch.  If you've got a laptop hanging around, put it in hibernate then pull the battery, when you power it back up it should return from hibernate without error.

jm24


The download upgrade works fine for reloading on the same machine, or a new computer.  Unfortunately, most users did not create the ISO and then create the DVD.

Here's another thing I found out the hard way.  I purchased the upgrade from a pair of Windows XP 32 bit machines.  


Problem #1, the ISO download option is not available because XP does not have a built in method to deal with ISO files.  Workaround: open the upgrade link confirmation e-mail on a Windows 7 machine and act like you're going to install, the ISO download option will appear where you can grab it then cancel the installation.


Problem #2, the ISO downloaded was for the same version being upgraded only, namely 32 bit.  The problem was the machines were 64 bit capable, and I was intending to update them very soon to run full 64bit with over 4G ram so 32 bit wasn't going to cut it for me.  There was no workaround for this problem, so I did kick the extra $15 to get a DVD from MS.  I only had to buy it once though, since the same media worked to install 64bit on both machines using their respective licences.


And you will be spending some quality time on the phone with customer service if you attempt to install on a new computer.  That's effectively what I did when I updated the motherboard, processor, memory, and a hard drive and used the same license to re-install.  A "Upgrade license cannot be used for a clean install" error popped up and forced some crazy back and forth with customer service.  Ironically, it seems to be the fresh hard drive that caused the problem, since I did the exact same thing to another computer, with the exception of using the same OS HDD, that time I did have to call, but the automated response line worked.

Ha!  At least they didn't stick to their guns and make me re-purchase.  The EULA does pretty explicitly deny what I did :)

That Office 2013 single hardware license if BS... luckily it appears they're backing off that.  It's still single machine, but they'll let you transfer.  That move is clearly to push 365 subscriptions.

Thanks all for the feedback and an interesting thread!

It would seem that apart from the odd GUI, most people who have installed W8 are happy with it.  It appears to be very stable and seems to be an "updated" W7 under the hood with a new front end.

         Scott:  "You'll more than likely need new drivers for some of your hardware, especially your audio interface."


Drivers are THE most important things and I am pleased that Sonar has already released W8 drivers for my VS-100.  Not sure if there are W8 drivers for the Zoom so I'll have to take a look.

         Chuckebaby: "but windows 8 is faster, much faster for me anyways. ......you know me I build my own computers so I was               really surprised, this has been the easiest upgrade I have ever used.      its very close to windows 7 actually

As you know Charlie Roy, I built my own machine too - mainly thanks to you - and I am very pleased with its performance under W7 and with W8 drivers already available for the VS-100 the upgrade should be relatively painless.  

I have watched a few good videos on W8 and I have used it occasionally on my wife's netbook, so the change will take some getting used to, but it can't be more challenging than when I went from DOS3.3  to my Atari ST and then to Windows!!  I will probably upgrade.  I still have my original OEM version of W7 for system builders which I installed a few months ago, so I can always do a clean re-install back to that if necessary.

I guess as it has taken time for vendors to release 64 bit versions of their products, so it will take some time for vendors to take full advantage of the new GUI, so in that respect Cake are to be applauded.  Only time will tell if it was a smart move.

Gary

redbarchetta

Having said that, even when you are in the traditional Windows style UI, things have changed.  They have gotten rid of Window tool bar buttons. So, you don't have the minimize, maximize and close buttons on everything like you had in the past. Rather, you have to grab the window header and drag it all the way to the bottom of the screen. This in my opinion is a HUGE fail! You will find that it's more difficult to navigate at first. There is no "Start" button. However, you can go find Win8 add-ons. I did this immediately. Don't recall the name of the start button add-on that I found, it was free and very slick. 

Not sure where your min, max, and close buttons went, but I have them on every machine of mine that runs W8 (all three of them).  That may be something that Lenovo threw on there as a "feature".


I haven't bothered with the Start button replacements.  I made my start screen be exactly what I want.  I would hate to have to go back to the start menu now.


I think the best advice I could offer if you do end up going with W8 is to resist installing any add ons (like start button restoration) for a couple of weeks.  Spend some time learning how to work the new system and see if you want to go back to the old.

The start screen is modifiable. But so is/was the w7 start menu. And with the start menu ALL the programs are where they are supposed to be, where I put them.

The start wall will display ALL 130+ tiles for all the installed programs and utilities which requires scrolling and reading and time wasting. (MS Office, sonar 8.5, X1/2, misc utilities, driver access, manuals,...)

Just as with w7, I have the most used programs on the taskbar. And the secondary programs' shortcuts on the desktop and/or in a folder.

And I have added folders to the "start menu" folder and moved the shortcuts as is reasonable. And the full start-wall displays them as groups with the folder names.

The w8 start-wall is NOT a good replacement for a hierarchical menu structure.

The main problem with the start menu with 7 is the lack of the quick access link that was available with XP.  Partly this is because the ALL USERS start menu is in a buried hidden folder.
Using the start menu there is no way to add a folder, and no way to move more than one shortcut at once. This requires using a windows explorer (file manager) and un-hiding the folders, and then hunting about to find it.

This is the same for w8. It is a buried hidden folder. And the start wall does not provide a  way to create group headings and move more than one shortcut at once.

Pretty much like the Sonar X series: more clicks to get at stuff that used to be quicker to access.

And some really stupid stuff like: there are 2 dialogs for creating and modifying users. BUT, a password can ONLY be entered/changed from the metro interface.   Why move it???  Why not just make both screen completely the same???????????????? Idiots!