X2 trial - Disappointed. Very.

Happily using Producer 8, but decided to give the new a try. Very disappointed. Seems like everything is made larger and very unnecessarily consumes more screen real estate, so that I can get far fewer tracks and layers (now lanes) showing. Seriously, cut down by 50% or more, checking X1 vs 8 side-by-side. Yech. Haven't got to all the promised whiz-bang yet in "increased work-flow", but so far, I dont like what I see. And what happened to custom user toolbars. Why would anyone decide to get rid of that. Good golly molly, I dont want that huge new control bar thing stuck at the top nor floating around my screen. What were they thinkin'? Thats my 2...

X2's user interface is pretty nice if you're using a large monitor/s.
If you don't like the Control Bar, it can be hidden.   

Like any new platform...you have to adjust and get used to it. Pro Channel is absolutely awesome and I happen to like take lanes. Jumping from 8 to X2 will have quite a learning curve. Once you get the hang of it you will NOT regret it. I jumped from 8 to X1...it did take some time, but not as much as you think...

Yes, but one needs control bars, just not that huge thing which feels like a big ol' stick jammed in my eye. Steals way too much real estate. Also, where is the Save button. Couldnt find one...so that means I haave to hit File-Save. Man, I hit Save a lot. Always considered that a "good" habit. Now its a two-step process.

not another save button person, come on now, CNTR+S does it faster than clicking an icon.
you don't like it, hey that's cool, im sure you will be happy with your copy of windows XP and sonar 8 in 2023.
you said you just downloaded the demo of x1 ?
how did you do that ?

hey now!!! don't be hating on the folks who like the save button!!! Heck, why not remove all buttons and just use keystrokes!!! LOL!

Yes, but one needs control bars, just not that huge thing which feels like a big ol' stick jammed in my eye. Steals way too much real estate. Also, where is the Save button.

 
It's already been mentioned, but, if you can get in the habit of using the mouse *and* keyboard, you'll find things go way faster.   For example: "C" for Control Bar display, Ctrl+S for Save, F11 for Full Screen, "D" and Shfit+D for docked views, etc.    But if you're only ever using the mouse to access the UI, then yeah, I can see how not having an icon for everything could slow things down.
 

Hmm, I didn't even realize there wasn't one until this came up.

twanger


Seems like everything is made larger and very unnecessarily consumes more screen real estate, so that I can get far fewer tracks and layers (now lanes) showing.

That is an over riding first impression when opening X1 and X2 for the first time. Its been debated at length and I think its been proven by the many screen shots posted that in reality there is little difference between X2 the versions once X1/X2 are set up to optimize the number of tracks displayed. Cakewalk's default template is horrible and really contributes to this impression. I have the multi dock and browser completly minamised with the multi dock set to open up to full size when opened.
 
Auto Track Zoom, introduced in X2 is a really great feature that helps manage screen real estate. Its one of my favorite features. Somebody is going to jump in and say screen sets soon, this is also a very power feature in managing the screen real estate.
 
The removal of toolbar icons, and the save icon in particular, has also been discussed ad-infinitum There is a add-on that restores a toolbar called Duckbar Despite liking toolbars in preference to shortcuts I elected to stay with the standard X2 and work out how to get around without it. If you really don't want to reach over to the keyboard, clicking on the file menu and save only takes a minuscule amount of time in any case, its hardly going to significantly affect productivity dispite passionate arguments about the virtues of cntl-S and toolbar icons.
 
If you're prodominatly a mouse user one feature you will like is click on the top right had corner of a clip and be able to launch Piano roll, event list, staff view of step sequencer.
 
In short, its worth persevering, you may or may not end up prefering the new interface to 8.5 but you will find it does not stop you from doing anything, and there are a lot of great new features.
  
 

djoni


can someone paste a list of essential shortcuts? ...sorry for hijacking the post

See this thread http://forum.cakewalk.com/tm.aspx?m=2794133
 

If you dig in with an open mind there'll be a lot of "A-Ha" moments when changes suddenly make sense. I realise everyone's different  but I couldn't go back to the "old" program now. My work speed has jumped espotentially since the "X" series was released.

As always though there's choices, upgrade, stay using 8.x, or move on to another DAW. I can make music using any of those choices although the upgrade path was and is my preference.

Screensets, auto track zoom and the keyboard the shortcuts "d", "c" and "b" can all make a big difference to screen "real estate".
 
It just takes a while to get it set up the way that best suits you.  I opened up a project in Sonar 6 recently, and can't believe how cluttered it now looked to me.

Man, I must be the odd man out that doesn't care much for Pro-Channel. It's pretty neat to look at, and if you only use Sonar's basic plug-ins, it is pretty useful and doesn't crash the DAW, but if you use 3rd-party plug-ins, or some of the other's that come with Sonar that aren't natively planted in ProChannel, it's quite redundant and "disconnected" from Sonar IMO.

More, if you wanted to use, say the Type 76 compressor, you have to open ProChannel to use it, and you have to save that setting separate from your track's FX bin unless you use the FX bin in ProChannel (they're not the same, which is a shame--very slapped in).

I only use ProChannel for the FX bin in X2, which I didn't even know about until after I bought the X2 upgrade from X1, but it's a bit more work to use than if Sonar just provided a larger FX bin on the track in Console View. 

Otherwise, Take Lanes issues aside (which I won't dig further into that crater here), and the gawdy colors used in the Tracks View (thank you Cakewalk fro providing the X1 color scheme as a custom theme!) X2 is quite good. I certainly like the non-destructive work-flow and Automation Lanes, not to mention Audio-Snap, Screensets, and Sonar's tolerance to bit-depth and sampling rate changes. 

I felt very similarly regarding screen real estate usage efficiency when migrating from 8.5.3 to X1 - I struggled with my 2 20" monitors, which had suited me just fine for years.  I would agree with someone's point above that I don't like Sonar's default template at all - and have found by creating a few default screensets into a default template that suits my personal taste, I've gotten past the real estate concerns. 
 
I prefer mouse clicks to shortcuts, as my keyboard retracts into my desk and don't want to pull it out everytime to use a keystroke shortcut - so  would like customizable quick icons at the top of the screen like most software products in the world have, but oh well, such is life - I've gotten past that and now click file - save.

Admittedly, I'm not leveraging some features within the skylight UI (multidock and quick access to the browser), but by setting up a couple screensets, I can easily switch to views across all available screen real estate to display just the console view, just the track view or a mix of both depending on what I'm doing.  I'd agree the ProChannel is a BIG reason to upgrade.  It's allowed me to stop worrying about most 3rd party plugs, which pays dividends in stability, price, integration, screen real estate, etc.
 
Give it time - you may feel similarly, but I would seriously recommend creating a default template you feel comfortable with and include some different screensets within that default template (screensets are project-specific, so by saving them to your default template, you'll have them for all projects).
 
Hope that helps.
Russ
 

Thank you...

Glyn Barnes

djoni


can someone paste a list of essential shortcuts? ...sorry for hijacking the post

See this thread http://forum.cakewalk.com/tm.aspx?m=2794133