X3d crash (PC module fault) when clicking any bus in console view

So I upgraded to X3d about a week ago. I had this old project (from X2a producer) that I tried to open. I'm using mostly ProChannel modules for effects. For some reason, whenever I click any of the buses (whether they be master or otherwise) in console view, Sonar crashes. According to the log, it's usually a couple different PC modules (either the concrete limiter or the expander/gate usually). I've tried removing various modules and re-adding them. I've also tried re-loading the project in safe mode and excluding all of them, it still seems to crash.
 
The weird thing is that I can manipulate anything from the track view or the single channel strip without issue. But even if I just try to move a fader or hit solo or mute on the console, it crashes.
 
I'm not sure if this is related to X3d (I had X3c before) or that this is a project pulled in from X2. I no longer have X2 loaded as I did before (I wiped/rebuilt the box). I thought I had read someplace about people having certain problems with plugins when coming from X2. So far, I've been working with at least 5-6 other projects from X2 without any issues whatsoever.

Has anyone seen this?

to answer your first question - yes, so far this seems to be isolated to a single project. I was messing around tonight and actually thought I had it solved. I realized there were some VST plugins loaded on some of the buses (but disabled). They were from a long time ago, before I was totally comfortable using the PC modules. They'd long since been disabled, but I never actually deleted them. Once I deleted/saved, it seemed to work. But I just tried again before and it crashed. So I reset/rescanned all plugins. I went back into the project and made sure that every disabled vst was deleted out of every track. I saved and closed and reopened. If I click in the track view, then click anywhere on the Master channel (or any other bus) in the console, it still crashes. Here are the 2 windows evt log messages. The first is an error, the 2nd is informational.
 
1st:

Log Name:      Application
Source:        Application Error
Date:          12/24/2013 22:59:46
Event ID:      1000
Task Category: (100)
Level:         Error
Keywords:      Classic
User:          N/A
Computer:      lamia
Description:
Faulting application name: SONARPDR.exe, version: 20.0.4.278, time stamp: 0x52abb061
Faulting module name: ProChannelConcreteLimiter_64.dll, version: 1.0.1.64, time stamp: 0x4f1de4ce
Exception code: 0xc0000005
Fault offset: 0x000000000002bea4
Faulting process id: 0xe8c
Faulting application start time: 0x01cf012e0eff1d92
Faulting application path: C:\Program Files\Cakewalk\SONAR X3 Producer\SONARPDR.exe
Faulting module path: c:\program files\cakewalk\shared utilities\internal\ProChannelConcreteLimiter\ProChannelConcreteLimiter_64.dll
Report Id: 5f9a9b8b-6d21-11e3-826b-3085a99dee16
Faulting package full name: 
Faulting package-relative application ID: 
Event Xml:
<Event xmlns="http://schemas.microsoft.com/win/2004/08/events/event">
  <System>
    <Provider Name="Application Error" />
    <EventID Qualifiers="0">1000</EventID>
    <Level>2</Level>
    <Task>100</Task>
    <Keywords>0x80000000000000</Keywords>
    <TimeCreated SystemTime="2013-12-25T04:59:46.000000000Z" />
    <EventRecordID>3326</EventRecordID>
    <Channel>Application</Channel>
    <Computer>lamia</Computer>
    <Security />
  </System>
  <EventData>
    <Data>SONARPDR.exe</Data>
    <Data>20.0.4.278</Data>
    <Data>52abb061</Data>
    <Data>ProChannelConcreteLimiter_64.dll</Data>
    <Data>1.0.1.64</Data>
    <Data>4f1de4ce</Data>
    <Data>c0000005</Data>
    <Data>000000000002bea4</Data>
    <Data>e8c</Data>
    <Data>01cf012e0eff1d92</Data>
    <Data>C:\Program Files\Cakewalk\SONAR X3 Producer\SONARPDR.exe</Data>
    <Data>c:\program files\cakewalk\shared utilities\internal\ProChannelConcreteLimiter\ProChannelConcreteLimiter_64.dll</Data>
    <Data>5f9a9b8b-6d21-11e3-826b-3085a99dee16</Data>
    <Data>
    </Data>
    <Data>
    </Data>
  </EventData>
</Event>

 
2nd:

Log Name:      Application
Source:        Windows Error Reporting
Date:          12/24/2013 22:59:51
Event ID:      1001
Task Category: None
Level:         Information
Keywords:      Classic
User:          N/A
Computer:      lamia
Description:
Fault bucket 150795621, type 4
Event Name: APPCRASH
Response: Not available
Cab Id: 0

Problem signature:
P1: SONARPDR.exe
P2: 20.0.4.278
P3: 52abb061
P4: ProChannelConcreteLimiter_64.dll
P5: 1.0.1.64
P6: 4f1de4ce
P7: c0000005
P8: 000000000002bea4
P9: 
P10: 

Attached files:
C:\Users\brainstem\AppData\Local\Temp\WERA238.tmp.WERInternalMetadata.xml
C:\Users\brainstem\AppData\Local\Temp\WERAE01.tmp.appcompat.txt
triagedump.dmp
C:\Users\brainstem\AppData\Local\Temp\WERB074.tmp.WERDataCollectionFailure.txt

These files may be available here:
C:\Users\brainstem\AppData\Local\Microsoft\Windows\WER\ReportArchive\AppCrash_SONARPDR.exe_96b698c4796ca208db24b37a6cad3f090d2e1bd_dacac975_0e30b5d0

Analysis symbol: 
Rechecking for solution: 0
Report Id: 5f9a9b8b-6d21-11e3-826b-3085a99dee16
Report Status: 4104
Hashed bucket: 6b648f92c147738836119391d6a72e7f
Event Xml:
<Event xmlns="http://schemas.microsoft.com/win/2004/08/events/event">
  <System>
    <Provider Name="Windows Error Reporting" />
    <EventID Qualifiers="0">1001</EventID>
    <Level>4</Level>
    <Task>0</Task>
    <Keywords>0x80000000000000</Keywords>
    <TimeCreated SystemTime="2013-12-25T04:59:51.000000000Z" />
    <EventRecordID>3327</EventRecordID>
    <Channel>Application</Channel>
    <Computer>lamia</Computer>
    <Security />
  </System>
  <EventData>
    <Data>150795621</Data>
    <Data>4</Data>
    <Data>APPCRASH</Data>
    <Data>Not available</Data>
    <Data>0</Data>
    <Data>SONARPDR.exe</Data>
    <Data>20.0.4.278</Data>
    <Data>52abb061</Data>
    <Data>ProChannelConcreteLimiter_64.dll</Data>
    <Data>1.0.1.64</Data>
    <Data>4f1de4ce</Data>
    <Data>c0000005</Data>
    <Data>000000000002bea4</Data>
    <Data>
    </Data>
    <Data>
    </Data>
    <Data>
C:\Users\brainstem\AppData\Local\Temp\WERA238.tmp.WERInternalMetadata.xml
C:\Users\brainstem\AppData\Local\Temp\WERAE01.tmp.appcompat.txt
triagedump.dmp
C:\Users\brainstem\AppData\Local\Temp\WERB074.tmp.WERDataCollectionFailure.txt</Data>
    <Data>C:\Users\brainstem\AppData\Local\Microsoft\Windows\WER\ReportArchive\AppCrash_SONARPDR.exe_96b698c4796ca208db24b37a6cad3f090d2e1bd_dacac975_0e30b5d0</Data>
    <Data>
    </Data>
    <Data>0</Data>
    <Data>5f9a9b8b-6d21-11e3-826b-3085a99dee16</Data>
    <Data>4104</Data>
    <Data>6b648f92c147738836119391d6a72e7f</Data>
  </EventData>
</Event>

So here is your smoking gun....
 
<Data>c:\program files\cakewalk\shared utilities\internal\ProChannelConcreteLimiter\ProChannelConcreteLimiter_64.dll</Data>
 
Same version as me...
 
Suggest deleting the concrete limiter in the tracks, bounce the tracks, delete the original tracks, saving project as a bundle file, closing, opening sonar, open bundle, save project, carry on.... And hope :)... 
 
Cheers...

Forum error / double post, but I'll say this before people jump in and defend Cake again; in my case it was just the CE and, since I mostly stay away from the level controls, removing those had just a small impact on my mix. So even though it took me a while to figure out was wrong and try to fix it, that was the only time I lost and could have been making music or mixing. This was thankfully a private project but I do do this for a living. In Jeebus' case, if the recommendation/solution is to remove all Concrete Limiters and PC4K gates, he can very nearly restart his mix.

Yes, I did send my own error report with notes (the one time out of five the error reporter actually worked) and even contacted Noel who was on vacation.

Well the event viewer says it's the concrete limiter loud and clear.... and there must be a particular set of conditions causing it to crash looking at what already has been tried... ta

CakeAlexS
Well the event viewer says it's the concrete limiter loud and clear.... and there must be a particular set of conditions causing it to crash looking at what already has been tried... ta

yea, it seemed to crash before (I think) even when I removed it from the project. I'm also going to try and uninstall it and remove it from the project and see if that makes a diff. Oh, I also think one of the times, it happened with the expander/gate, too.

I know that it's only a workaround and not a real solution to the problem but...... I have been able to work without crashes by leaving the console inside the multidock, undocking the multidock and floating the whole thing to the second screen.  Seems to work for me.  In my case it will always crash SONAR when the console is undocked and floated by itself to the second monitor.....FWIW.....

Hello,
 
This is a known issue from X2 (When I first discovered it).. CWBRN-20140 was filed with Cakewalk on 10/03.  The issue is with CL on a bus when console view is on a 2nd monitor. Cakewalk has confirmed this condition.  Lets hope a fix is in the works.  There are other quirks when using multi monitor setups. Like if the browser is undocked to a 2nd monitor it does not retain its position upon reopening or if the screen set is changed but those types of issues are minor compared to this one.
 
My workaround for this issue is to have a screen set that keeps the console docked and switching back to my expanded desktop once my tweeks are done.  Bakers.. Help!

I'm also seeing this in X3D too. I echo Luna Tech in hoping it gets fixed very soon.  

So (dare I say it) are there steps to reproduce this every time from a new project in X3D as I am unable to reproduce (dual monitor setup here).... thanks...

That is a good question. I opened up a few files this evening that I had edited before and had Concrete Limiter on some buses and the Console view undocked (by itself). I worked on those a bit and never saw this issue. Some of these files were originally built in X1, carried through X2, and into X3 (I put the X version in the title and save the project before working in a newer version).
 
The Win8.x comment may have validity to it (and actually I have wondered that with some "bugs" I see posted regarding SONAR). Ironically, we have all been trained to accept the flaws in Windows but always reminds me of the joke years ago "What if Microsoft made cars?"

My issue was on Win 7 64 bit. Since removing ALL console emulators solved it in my case, and I could add them afterwards without problems, it seems more an issue of corrupted projects than one that is instantly reproduceable by floating the console to a second monitor (which I do all the time, and it's usually fine).

So from my view, the real bug is more likely to be somewhere in the save procedure. The rest would then just be insufficient error handling.

This problem goes back to X2. I'm not sure if it was in the original release of X2 or introduced with the a patch and touch support. I was hoping it would have been fixed in X3 but so far its in all versions. 
 
This is a very bad bug and needs CW to get it fixed very soon.
 
 

Vernon I followed the steps and your note however I had to create my own steps (in order to fill in the gaps)...
After testing via my guesswork it became obvious I'm never going to recreate this issue unless I have the specific steps.

I'm not sure what we are supposed to do, record, play back, can we be specific about what "switch to different tracks" means? Are we clicking on layout view (on the other monitor) or tracks on the console view, where are we clicking (the track numbers at the bottom, clips?). Could we be totally specific about this...
 
Thanks..

My Current steps...

1) Create new project (select normal template).
2) Insert 8 audio tracks.
3) Undock Console View and drag to 2nd monitor.
4) Expand Pro Channel in console view
5) Observe Console emulator BUS in the master bus plugin
6) Turn it on Console emulator BUS.
 
????
 
Much appreciated..
 

Nice one Brian...