stevec
I've often thought that track folders should be given bussing characteristics. 
Though not really related to the topic of this discussion, I just had to "+1" this idea.  Folders acting as busses would be sahweeet!
 
  YO SteveC
 
I think this is a capitol thought!
In a roundabout fashion, you CAN do this in ACID PRO by assigning folders to a bus then drawing the automation lines, etc within the bus track ...
 
IF>..SONAR does this, please do let me know!

Mod Bod


I didn't run into the disappearing clip sections bug because I usually eliminate layers as I am comping.  It seems that a lot of folks are using layers in such a way that a normal track is virtually a "sub-bus".

This demonstrates the need to look at busses in the new DAW paradigm.  It's no longer like a mixer where the busses reside at the right hand side of the console.  A bus should be able to live anywhere on the DAW console or track view.  I've often thought that track folders should be given bussing characteristics.  And further than that, nested folders are needed with the same attributes. 

Absolutely yes yes yes.

I indeed use layers such that a track becomes a virtual bus.

Clip is to layer what layer is to track what track is to bus.

That might not be the use they were designed for. But that's how uses and methods evolve.

If the diff between tracks and busses, and in turn, busses and folders, could be reduced to minimum, it would come full circle.

It's a different paradigm. It's powerful and liberating.

We're not in Hardwareville anymore. 

Blades


Regarding the Folders as a Bus thing: you can kind of do this with track layers.  For example, if you have ten layered parts of the same background vocal, instead of using the layers to control WHICH part to play, you just let them all play together (making value corrections as appropriate) and then you can add whatever effects you want at the track level and they will apply to all of the layers in the track without having to bus anything off anywhere.

Just an idea that I know I'm not the only one who uses.

You can bet I'll be reading up on track layers after I finish these commercial spots!
 
Thanks B!

MatsonMusicBox


Man ... gotta say one more time ... I just don't have that much problem or issue with automation in SONAR , and I do a LOT of it. I just kinda scratch my head at those who find it "unusable" or avoid it. Could it be improved? Sure ... but it's a LONG way from unusable or even a major PITA in my view. I guess I'd love to watch what some of you are doing or trying to do to see what the heck the big problem is. ???????

In my case it is a PITA, as explained in this thread:
http://forum.cakewalk.com...25&mpage=1#1823613

Briefly:
- It is extremely difficult to select nodes where there are multiple automation envelopes stacked up. Even at full zoom.

- No way to quickly bring  the selected envelope to view - hiding all the rest - for editing.  There is an option to hide one automation envelope at a time, but if I have lots of automation envelopes, it soon becomes very tiring having to hide one envelope at a time. By lots I mean this: http://img242.imageshack.us/i/automationmaze.jpg. Instead of hiding one envelope one by one, there should an envelope solo feature, to quickly solo the currently selected envelope, therefore hiding all the rest. This would get rid off all the clutter with one click. ( Please note, I know that groups of envelopes can be hidden, like volume, midi, automation envelopes, but it is not possible to quickly hide a selection of synth automation envelopes).

- there ought to be a 'node thinning' feature to make life easier and quicker.

As a heavy duty user of synth automation, I was hoping that Sonar 8 or 8.5 had some of these issues ironed out.
Perhaps none of them are a show stopper, but, why fight with the way software is designed? It soon becomes very tiring and annoying having to go through these issues hundreds of times per project.
I surely await a more advanced, streamlined and well thought out system.

Friendly bump for automation

I was able to bounce CC11 on a recent project using both Real Time and Fast Bounce (though PLAY doesn't seem to like Fast Bounce which was not an issue with Kompakt).  Even with Real Time Bounce, I still need to play the entire project once before I can have a successful render.  My grip now is with Portamento.  I can't get it to play the same way everytime, and I'm using all the controllers pertaining to this fucntion (CC5, CC65 and CC84).  No luck though :-(

JM are you able to use Portamento reliably?


Thanks!

Hi JM,

No, I didn't have to Bounce to Track, nor Freeze nor anything.  Just a straight up Export.  The CC11 (Expression) renders perfectly as I had intended.  What doesn't work for me, at least not consistently, is Portamento.  I tried using the different CC's that pertain to it, as I mentioned earlier.  The Controller to turn Portamento ON/OFF is CC65 and the one that controls it's Timing, or how fast it transitions from one note to another, is CC5.  These are both standard CC to any synthesizer, and are supported in PLAY.  I have no problems turning it ON/OFF, it just doesn't behave the way I want it to.

Since Portamento was not sliding from the note I had previously inserted, I tried using CC84, which is the controller that indicates the note from which the Portamento starts.  This controller is not documented in the PLAY manual though, so I'm not sure if PLAY supports it.  I guess I'll re-read the PLAY manual, although there's not much information about these things in it.

I'll be experimenting some more and see if I can find a solution to this.


Take care!

Jose,

I am betting you drew in your CC11 events, as opposed to using the Envelope tool in track view, right?

Good luck with your Portamento.. may want to try the forums at soundsOnline as well. May be some PLAY specific goodies over there someone can help you with.

Regards,

Jesse

Did you be sure and turn on portamento in the PLAY engine? Each patch can be enabled to respond to portamento or not ( think having it on probably ups the memory footprint or something). But if you just read the SO manuals I would imagine you did this.

I just thought of it and it might explain why you're not hearing much.

Jesse

Well, this is now 100% reproducable in my 8.5.2 SE setup.

1. have an envelope
2. Right click on it - no need to select anything in the menu that pops up
3. TADAA: the enveloppe is stuck and jumps back to its position no matter how hard you drag it.
4. Go ahead and restart Sonar to fix it