audio mixing question

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John6528
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2011/02/05 18:47:48 (permalink)

audio mixing question

In full symphony orchestra what is a normal db spread between softest and loudest? In a range of 100 I have about .8 for soft and 100 for loud. Sounds decent on monitors but terrible on good speakers with sub woffer.

Have never mixed all the way down with full orch.

And... what is the easy way to lessen the range?
thanks

John

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Miroslav Philharmonik , Nanosynth
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    ChuckC
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    Re:audio mixing question 2011/02/05 20:32:24 (permalink)
    I have never mixed any project as big as that but I am guessing if you need to pull the dynamics in a it & good compressor should really help out.

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    #2
    John6528
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    Re:audio mixing question 2011/02/06 18:48:09 (permalink)
    Yeah... a compressor. I've never used one. How do you do thsat?
    John

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    #3
    Bristol_Jonesey
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    Re:audio mixing question 2011/02/07 07:38:22 (permalink)
    Google is your friend........................

    CbB, Platinum, 64 bit throughout
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    Kalle Rantaaho
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    Re:audio mixing question 2011/02/07 07:48:20 (permalink)
    And just like in rock or other music styles, you can import a reference track into SONAR and compare the waveforms and dynamics.

    At tweakheadz.com you find well written guides on effects and everything computer recording related.

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    Rothchild
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    Re:audio mixing question 2011/02/07 08:27:22 (permalink)
    Orchestras have huge dynamic range (just imagine you could go from solo piccolo to everyone smashing away FF, kettle drums, Euphoniums the lot).

    Bear in mind that compressors limit dynamic range and the whole point of an orchestra is that their range is huge (and going from quiet to loud is exciting!), why limit it? (and particluarly if you don't know what you're doing with one). My understanding is that the people who record orchestras try to capture as much of the dynamics as possible and are unlikely to use compression for this type of recording.

    You question is a little unclear, do you have a recording of an orchestra or a midi arrangement of one? If it's the latter you're going to have to pay a lot of attention to detail, picking a suitable verb / ambience etc voicings and panning to make a good sounding fake.

    Child
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    Bristol_Jonesey
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    Re:audio mixing question 2011/02/07 11:37:40 (permalink)
    Totally agree Child.

    I've done a couple of orchestral pieces, and haven't used compression on either of them.

    Tried it.

    Didn't like it.

    Took it off.

    The only concession I made was on my master buss, just to get the overall levels up a bit.

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    John6528
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    Re:audio mixing question 2011/02/07 17:55:19 (permalink)
    Rothchild


    Orchestras have huge dynamic range (just imagine you could go from solo piccolo to everyone smashing away FF, kettle drums, Euphoniums the lot).

    Bear in mind that compressors limit dynamic range and the whole point of an orchestra is that their range is huge (and going from quiet to loud is exciting!), why limit it? (and particluarly if you don't know what you're doing with one). My understanding is that the people who record orchestras try to capture as much of the dynamics as possible and are unlikely to use compression for this type of recording.

    You question is a little unclear, do you have a recording of an orchestra or a midi arrangement of one? If it's the latter you're going to have to pay a lot of attention to detail, picking a suitable verb / ambience etc voicings and panning to make a good sounding fake.

    Child


    Realized using Philharmonik vst. When set volume to hear the pianissimo the double forte is way too loud on my regular system. (scares the cat, wife starts yelling) Also kind of muddy but it sounds ok over monitor speakers (M-Audio BX5a). Regular (surround sound) is paradigm Phantom v.3. My own composition. Guess I will ding around with it some more. I got it to sound just dandy with the monitors and ear phones then disappointing when put to cd and played on the tv room system. Back to the drawing board.
    John



    Sonar 8.5 64, Win 7 64
    Asrock X58 Extreme3, I7-950, 12G ram
    OCZ Vertx3 120, Vertex2 90, WDM 1T
    Focusrite Saffire
    Yamaha P-70 Keyboard
    M-Audio Midisport Uno
    Miroslav Philharmonik , Nanosynth
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    Rothchild
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    Re:audio mixing question 2011/02/08 03:28:18 (permalink)
    Hi John,

    Ok well first off I'm afraid I'm something of a midiot, so I'm more likely to be able to offer only general help. Did you see this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamics_%28music%29 there's a little table on there that relates dynamic notation to midi velocities (which is what I guess you're referring to when you mentioned .8 to 100?)

    For me this q seems to boil down to whether you want it to sound realistic or 'nice'? Pianissimo (according to the page above) is 'softer than a speaking voice' and FF is 'speaking loud'. Multiply that up across a whole orchestra and the latter is quite a loud noise!

    Not withstanding that my cat has a nervous temperament but he'd probably jump at me speaking loudly to him (I'll decline to comment on my (or your) wife ;-))

    Something I'd recommend, to help consistently achieve a good volume balance, is to calibrate your monitoring environment with an SPL meter (Check out the K-Metering system). Working to a consistent SPL in your room will help you make better judgements about what's (relatively) quiet and what's loud.

    Hopefully someone will weigh in with some particular tips about the miroslav vst and midi sequencing but hopefully some of this will be of use.

    Child
    #9
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