konradh
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ins Files with Expansion Cards - RESOLVED
So, suppose I have an old synth (let's say a JV-1080) and I can find an ins file for it. Cool. But if I have four expansion cards, how do I add those to the file? I have the papers somewhere with the list of instruments. Same question about Kurzweil PC2R. I used to understand ins files but I seem to have forgotten and somehow they are no longer in Sonar. (I also need to add one for the Tyros 2 but there are no expansion cards involved.) Basically, I know nothing except the general concept. Thanks.
post edited by konradh - 2015/03/23 15:50:12
Konrad Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/ Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka. Rokit 6s.
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FastBikerBoy
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/18 17:04:45
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You can create your own INS file definitions. There is a video here that explains how to do that. It is number 8 in the playlist. HTH
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konradh
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/18 22:22:38
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Thanks, Biker Dude. So, I watched the video which is great, but I am still a bit unclear on a few points. Maybe I should work with it a bit before asking questions, but here are my confusion points. 1-The part about importing a file v creating an instrument was not clear to me. Wouldn't you need to do both? 2-Rather than adding patches one by one in Sonar (127x8 for the JV), would it make more sense to take an existing ins file and edit it in notepad to create the new file? 3-I have never been clear whether the synths I have are "Normal," "Controller 0," or "Controller 32." The ones I need to do are Roland JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R (same as PC2 but rack-mount), and Yamaha Tyros 2. 4-Let's say I found a file that appears to be correct for the four factory banks in the Roland JV-1080, how would I know how to label the new sections of the file? It looks like the existing file has headers like PR-A, PR-B, etc. I could guess that the new sections need EXP-A, EXP-B or something, but I might try a lot of things before I got it right. Same questions on the PC2R (although it uses different nomenclature)? Of course if someone had a file with all the expansion cards and knew the header format, I could swap them around to match the slots where I have installed my cards. Sorry to be an idiot, but this is quite frustrating.
post edited by konradh - 2015/03/18 22:56:09
Konrad Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/ Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka. Rokit 6s.
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FastBikerBoy
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/19 03:20:45
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konradh
Thanks, Biker Dude. So, I watched the video which is great, but I am still a bit unclear on a few points. Maybe I should work with it a bit before asking questions, but here are my confusion points.
That's a good idea, it does help get the concept across easier and once you've "got it" it will seem much easier.
1-The part about importing a file v creating an instrument was not clear to me. Wouldn't you need to do both?
Yes & No. You generally import existing INS files and create new ones from within the Sonar interface. Having said that there's nothing to stop you creating one in Notepad or other text editor and then importing that. I tend to use the Sonar interface for creating new ones. It can become a little tedious though especially if there's a lot of crossover between ins files. In that case it's probably easier and quicker to do it in a text editor and then import them.
2-Rather than adding patches one by one in Sonar (127x8 for the JV), would it make more sense to take an existing ins file and edit it in notepad to create the new file?
It can do, it depends on the patch names and frankly personal preference for editing. The advantage that the Sonar interface has it that it makes more logical sense (to me anyway). It doesn't matter though notepad will do the job.
3-I have never been clear whether the synths I have are "Normal," "Controller 0," or "Controller 32." The ones I need to do are Roland JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R (same as PC2 but rack-mount), and Yamaha Tyros 2.
That info should be in the synth's manual somewhere. In reality I use normal for all of mine and it works fine. I have a Roland Sonic Cell and some older Casio keyboards/synth. I also use them for patch changing my BOSS GT-6 and Digitech Quad FX processor in a live situation. Normal works on all of them.
4-Let's say I found a file that appears to be correct for the four factory banks in the Roland JV-1080, how would I know how to label the new sections of the file? It looks like the existing file has headers like PR-A, PR-B, etc. I could guess that the new sections need EXP-A, EXP-B or something, but I might try a lot of things before I got it right. Same questions on the PC2R (although it uses different nomenclature)?
Not sure what you mean by the file headers but if they relate to the Bank names seen from within Sonar, they are created when you add the "Bank Change" number which is either in your synth manual or calculated using the method shown in the video.
Of course if someone had a file with all the expansion cards and knew the header format, I could swap them around to match the slots where I have installed my cards.
I'm not sure for reasons mentioned above. I have never created those bank names manually they are created by the process of assigning the bank change number.
Sorry to be an idiot, but this is quite frustrating.
Definitely not an idiot. It took me a while to get my head around them as well. If you need more help or have any more questions just ask.
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bvideo
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/19 11:17:34
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My Roland JV80 "works" with the Normal setting or with the Controller 0 setting, but the manual says it uses only controller 0. The bank numbers are a little weird: the card bank number in the manual is 80, internal is 81. The numbers Sonar needs are 10240 and 10368, so bank number times 128. You can set the bank names as you wish, but the numbers need to follow the synth rules. Unfortunately, Sonar displays the bank number and name together in the widget, in Sonarese. Edit: I see that the Sonar help has an example for the JV1080 and it resembles the JV80, as might be expected.
post edited by bvideo - 2015/03/19 12:25:50
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konradh
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/19 15:50:58
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Konrad Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/ Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka. Rokit 6s.
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konradh
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/19 18:41:34
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So, I have found the standard JV patch list. I can type in (or really cut/paste/format) the patch lists for the expansion cards. What I don't understand is 1-what the headers should be for each section and 2-how to tell Sonar "OK, this group is EXP A, this one is EXP B, etc."
Same situation for the PC2R. It's like there is a lot of information for some of the detailed steps, but I'm missing the big picture.
PS, I tried to start my old machine that has Sonar 2 and the old INS files so I could export them, but, of course, Windows just decides "Oh, this machine is too old--I won't let it start anymore."
Konrad Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/ Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka. Rokit 6s.
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drewfx1
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/19 19:33:24
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The section ".Instrument Definitions" in the .ins file defines what bank change messages select a given bank. The names after the "=" sign there point to the bank name in [ ]'s above the list of patch names in the ".Patch Names" section.
 In order, then, to discover the limit of deepest tones, it is necessary not only to produce very violent agitations in the air but to give these the form of simple pendular vibrations. - Hermann von Helmholtz, predicting the role of the electric bassist in 1877.
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drewfx1
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/19 19:38:51
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In order, then, to discover the limit of deepest tones, it is necessary not only to produce very violent agitations in the air but to give these the form of simple pendular vibrations. - Hermann von Helmholtz, predicting the role of the electric bassist in 1877.
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jatoth
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/19 20:18:37
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I have used the InsMaker utility to create ins file from my Kurz K2500XS which is fully loaded with expansions as well as samples. Maybe it will work for your synths. http://www.fumph.com/?page_id=13
John X3e Producer, Sonar Platinum, Sweetwater CreationStation i5 3.1gHz, 12 GB RAM, 500GB SSD OS drive, 1TB SSD audio drive, 1TB archive/misc drive, dual 22" monitors, Windows 7x64, SaffirePro40 (firewire), MOTU MIDI Express XT, Behringer BCF2000, dbx 586, Samson Servo 120a, Yamaha HS80M, Auratone 5c Cubes, Sennheiser HD650, Sony MDR 7509HD, Sony MDR 7506, Kurzweil K2500XS, Roland XP-30, Proteus 2000.
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konradh
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/19 23:55:39
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Thanks, jatoth and drewfx1.
For the JV-1080, I have the following expansion cards:
SR-JV80-01 Pop
SR-JV80-02 Orchestral
SR-JV80-16 Orchestral II
SR-JV80-10 Bass & Drums
For the Kurzweil PC2R, I have this:
Kurzweil PC2 Orchestral ROM Expansion Board
Konrad Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/ Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka. Rokit 6s.
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FastBikerBoy
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/20 03:04:32
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konradh
So, I have found the standard JV patch list. I can type in (or really cut/paste/format) the patch lists for the expansion cards. What I don't understand is 1-what the headers should be for each section and 2-how to tell Sonar "OK, this group is EXP A, this one is EXP B, etc."
Same situation for the PC2R. It's like there is a lot of information for some of the detailed steps, but I'm missing the big picture.
The "groups" are banks defined by the bank number. in the ins file. In the .Instrument Definitions section of the file as mentioned by drewfx1. Here's an example. from an ins file
.Instrument Definitions
[Roland Fantom XR (Patch)]
Patch[15488]=Fantom-X GM2 Capital
Patch[15489]=Fantom-X GM2 Var #1
Patch[15490]=Fantom-X GM2 Var #2
For example in the top line the 15488 is the bank number in decimal. That is preset by the synth manufacturer. You may find that number in the manual as is (decimal) or you may need to calculate it. It (the number) depends on the synth and whether the CC#0 (MSB), CC#32 (LSB) or both are used for bank changing. I explain the whole assignment process at around 7:12 in the video I linked to. That shows how to do it within Sonar, but all that does is create the section of the ins file quoted above with preset names. These can be edited in the file in a text editor. At around 8:00 the calculation method is explained. IIRC correctly that was for one of my Casio keyboards which uses just the CC#0 for bank changing. Each patch list in the manual includes a bank change number. The calculation is (CC#0 x 128) + CC#32. The casio CC#0 for the bank being added in the video is 71. This equates to the........ 71 x 128 = 9088. If CC#32 was used as well it would be added to that. In this case it is zero (or unused) so 9088 is the bank select number that Sonar requires to change banks. I hope that all makes sense.
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jatoth
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/20 09:43:15
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Konrad,
I've used the insmaker to create ins files for a Roland X30, Proteus 2000, and my Kurz X2500XS.
It grabs all of my installed samples and custom programs on the Kurz as well.
Should work for your synths. I've also tweaked the resulting ins to display custom patch names.
John X3e Producer, Sonar Platinum, Sweetwater CreationStation i5 3.1gHz, 12 GB RAM, 500GB SSD OS drive, 1TB SSD audio drive, 1TB archive/misc drive, dual 22" monitors, Windows 7x64, SaffirePro40 (firewire), MOTU MIDI Express XT, Behringer BCF2000, dbx 586, Samson Servo 120a, Yamaha HS80M, Auratone 5c Cubes, Sennheiser HD650, Sony MDR 7509HD, Sony MDR 7506, Kurzweil K2500XS, Roland XP-30, Proteus 2000.
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bvideo
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/20 12:20:00
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konradh
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/20 15:53:46
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OK, here is where I am lost.
I THINK that when you are in DEFINE, in the left panel of the instrument definitions, you have to say something like "11928 = PRESET BANK A, 11930 = PRESET BANK B," or some such. Then in the ins file, you have a list of patch names underneath a bank like this:
[PRESET BANK A]
1=Piano
2=Organ
whatever and etc...
The problem is that when I look at existing instruments in Preferences, the bank names don't seem to match what's in the ins file. So......
Please tell me if this is correct:
1-I calculate the Bank Numbers (e.g., Orch Expansion 1 is in slot B and acc to the manual that would be bank 1098 or whatever).
2-In the left side of DEFINE, under the instrument name, I would enter all the banks (e.g., one would be 1098=ORCH EXP B)
3-Then in my *.ins file, which has to have the proper headers, I would have a section that starts with [ORCH EXP B] and Sonar would magically find the right spot in the flat file.
So frustrating because I did all this years ago, but now the documentation seems to be very detailed on each specific topic but a-does not give the big picture and b-does not seem to be aimed at someone who has to create or edit an ins file.
Konrad Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/ Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka. Rokit 6s.
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FastBikerBoy
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/20 16:17:48
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Personally I have only ever assigned the patch name file to the instrument file using drag & drop. I.e. drag the patch name list across and enter the bank number when prompted, as per the video.
I find the whole process of creation and assignment much easier from within Sonar rather than using a text editor. I have edited existing files that way though.
Is there a reason you don't want to create or edit from within Sonar? It seems to over complicate the whole process trying to do it externally.
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konradh
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/20 22:39:50
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Here is my reason: it seems easier to copy/paste a long list of patch names into a text file (ins file) than to drag them one by one into Sonar.
I am certainly not against using your method, but with 800-900 patch names for just one synth, copying from the manufacturer's pdf into a text file seems easier. (I can do find and replace to format the list as needed.)
I am open to your method, though. Thanks for replying!
Konrad Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/ Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka. Rokit 6s.
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FastBikerBoy
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/21 05:31:40
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Yes I understand that but my point (which I don't think I've made clear) is create the file in Sonar and then add the patch names later in the editor.
That way all the more complex formatting is already done by Sonar and you only have to copy and paste the patch names.
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soundsubs
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/21 12:56:12
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I agree with OP, this is confusing as hell (and I'm an engineer by day)
For my Fantom XR and Proteus 2000, I had to chase down .INS files from the internet and piece them together. Finally, I came up with a big text file and just deleted the expansion cards I didn't have. Then I imported that into Sonar. It was painful, and new versions of Sonar make you re-do it, so i get to re-learn it every year.
It seems it wants you to have a single Instrument --like "Fantom XR" and then inside that Bank Change info and the Bank names.
Then under there, the patch names inside the banks.
Inside of that txt file is this:
; ----------------------------------------------------------------------
.Instrument Definitions
[Fantom XR ]
Patch[11200]=Fantom XR PRA
Patch[11201]=Fantom XR PRB
Patch[11202]=Fantom XR PRC
Patch[11203]=Fantom XR PRD
Patch[11204]=Fantom XR PRE
Patch[11205]=Fantom XR PRF
Patch[11206]=Fantom XR PRG
Patch[11207]=Fantom XR PRH
Patch[11208]=Fantom XR PRI
Patch[11072]=Fantom-X PRESET Rhythm 001-040
Patch[15360]=Fantom-X GM2 Rhythm Sets 001-009
Patch[11904]=SRX-01 Dynamic Drum Kits 1-41
Patch[11776]=SRX-01 Dynamic Drum Kits Drums
Patch[11908]=SRX-05 Supreme Dance 1-128
Patch[11909]=SRX-05 Supreme Dance 129-256
Patch[11910]=SRX-05 Supreme Dance 257-312
Patch[11780]=SRX-05 Supreme Dance Drums
Patch[11919]=SRX-08 Platinum Trax 1-128
Patch[11920]=SRX-08 Platinum Trax 129-256
Patch[11921]=SRX-08 Platinum Trax 257-384
Patch[11922]=SRX-08 Platinum Trax 385-448
Patch[11791]=SRX-08 Platinum Trax Drums
.Patch Names
[Fantom XR PRA] 0=1:So true...
1=2:ConcertPiano
2=3:Warm Piano
3=4:Warm Pad Pno
4=5:Warm Str Pno
5=6:BealeSt Walk
6=7:Rapsody
7=8:JD-800 Piano
...
(((((continues this way))))
126=127:BluNoteStrat
127=128:FS Funk Gtr
[Fantom XR PRB]
0=1:GK Dubguitar
1=2:& Scratchee
(((((continues this way))))
Every single time, I have to manually type in the bank change number, incrementing by 1 each time.
Sonar Platinum | modular synthesizers galoreWin 10 // Dell Xeon's | RME UFX | Maschine 2.3 | Virus TI | Roland System-1
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bvideo
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/21 20:18:09
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soundsubs
... It was painful, and new versions of Sonar make you re-do it, so i get to re-learn it every year. ...
If you don't want to just overwrite the newly-released master.ins file with your old one, you can import from your old one (or from any other one you find, e.g. at lilchips). The import function lets you choose which instruments you want to import. Not to say relearning it isn't good once in a while ...
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FastBikerBoy
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/22 04:25:38
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bvideo
soundsubs
... It was painful, and new versions of Sonar make you re-do it, so i get to re-learn it every year. ...
If you don't want to just overwrite the newly-released master.ins file with your old one, you can import from your old one (or from any other one you find, e.g. at lilchips). The import function lets you choose which instruments you want to import. Not to say relearning it isn't good once in a while ...
The system I use (for several things not just ins files) is I have my own directory of ins files. After a new install I simply delete the installed ins file directory and copy my own in. I use a total of seven hardware units inc drum machines, that all have ins files and I have only ever created them once. The whole process takes a few seconds to do. HTH.
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konradh
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/22 17:59:15
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I have been struggling with this all week-end.
I have a JV1080 ins file that I created. I took an existing JV1080 ins file that had the standard present banks and then I added all my expansion cards. When I try to import this into Sonar, Sonar says there are no instruments in the file—but I cannot see any difference between my file and sample files.
Also, in Define I think you have to list all the bank numbers and names like this:
10371 = JV-1080 PR-D Patch Names (GM)
10752 = SR-JV80-02 Orchestral 1-128
etc
I have tried clicking to add these but after I hit enter they are not there.
OK, so here is what I have:
1-an ins file I made with everything in it.
2-notes so I know the exact bank numbers for each bank and card in the synth.
What I can't get to work:
1-Can't get Sonar to like my ins file.
2-I am ridiculously unclear on the steps. I THINK you import your ins file, the add an instrument, and then add the bank numbers and names under the instruments--but I can't get this to work.
I do not want to enter every patch name manually when I have already done some work and written some formulas to create the properly formatted list of patch names, Surely there is a way to get this into Sonar.
PS The Sonar help has enormous detail but the big picture is not clear and I can't find where it describes what headers or formatting are required in the ins file.
Konrad Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/ Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka. Rokit 6s.
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konradh
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/23 00:45:33
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EDIT: THIS IS *ALMOST* RESOLVED. =============== After posting this was resolved, I discovered one problem. My expansion card have up to 256 patches, so Roland uses one bank for 1-128 and another bank for 129-256. For some reason, in my Sonar event list, patch names don't show up if I select one of the banks that has patches 129-256. Everything looks right in preferences. I will investigate. Maybe I have some obvious error, but, if so, it is the same error for all 4 expansion cards. Thoughts are welcome. =============== I believe this is resolved. I created an *.ins file, finally got it in the right format, and, once I imported this, everything was automatically OK. The file has to have two sections. One section is for patches and looks like this: .Patch Names [JV-1080 PR-A] 0=001:64voicePiano 1=002:Bright Piano 2=003:Classique 3=004:Nice Piano 4=005:Piano Thang etc. One section is for the Instrument/Bank definitions. In my case, it looks like this: .Instrument Definitions [Roland JV-1080:Patch] Patch[10368]=JV-1080 PR-A Patch[10369]=JV-1080 PR-B Patch[10370]=JV-1080 PR-C Patch[10371]=JV-1080 PR-D/GM Patch[10752]=JV-1080 XP-A Orch I 1-128 Patch[10753]=JV-1080 XP-A Orch I 129-255 Patch[10754]=JV-1080 XP-B Pop 1-128 Patch[10755]=JV-1080 XP-B Pop 129-145 Patch[10756]=JV-1080 XP-C Orch II 1-128 Patch[10757]=JV-1080 XP-C Orch II 129-256 Patch[10758]=JV-1080 XP-D Bass & Drums 1-128 Patch[10759]=JV-1080 XP-D Bass & Drums 129-204 Patch[10240]=JV-1080 User Patch - =1..128
For each one of these banks in the .Instrument section, there is a section in the file with the patch names. I will be happy to send this ins file to anyone who wants it. The name of the bank and the name of the patch list must match:
For example, I have a list of patches with this as the header: [JV-1080 PR-A]
I also have a bank in the instrument section with the same name: Patch[10368]=JV-1080 PR-A Of course, you have to know how to calculate the bank number and the Sonar help actually explains that pretty well. (This varies by manufacturer.) I found some pdfs online with all the patch names for the JV-1080 and all the possible expansion cards. I pasted those names into Excel and wrote some formulas to format them correctly before pasting them back into the ins file. Thanks again to everyone for the patience and help. Konrad
post edited by konradh - 2015/03/23 00:55:38
Konrad Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/ Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka. Rokit 6s.
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bvideo
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/23 00:53:21
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Do you have a place where you could post your current version of the .ins? I'd look at it if you do. I've just somewhat refreshed myself on those files, partly triggered by your original post.
Note, if you want to see the general layout for just one instrument, you can export one to a file and then make your own file resemble it in structure. To export, right-click an Instrument name in the Instrument tree and choose Export from the menu to display the Export Instrument Definition dialog box, navigate somewhere and save it to some new file. It gets a .ins extension.
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konradh
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/23 01:07:45
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bvideo, Not sure where to post it but I can send it to you (and thanks for the offer).
The file works great except for those banks that have patches above 128...and that just gave me an idea!
The patch list is in this format:
[JV-1080 PR-A]
0=001:64voicePiano
1=002:Bright Piano
2=003:Classique
3=004:Nice Piano
4=005:Piano Thang
so I have the HIGH patch numbers for the expansion cards like this:
[JV-1080 XP-A Orch I 129-255]
128=129:F.Hrn Sect2/
129=130:F.Hrn Sect3
130=131:F.Hm Sect4
131=132:F.Hrn Sect5/
132=133:F.Hrn Sect6
133=134:F.Hrn Sect7
134=135:F.HmSect8
I will bet I need to change this to make it like this:
[JV-1080 XP-A Orch I 129-255]
0=129:F.Hrn Sect2/
1=130:F.Hrn Sect3
2=131:F.Hm Sect4
3=132:F.Hrn Sect5/
4=133:F.Hrn Sect6
5=134:F.Hrn Sect7
6=135:F.HmSect8
I will try that in the morning: easy Excel formula to fix that.
Thanks
Konrad Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/ Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka. Rokit 6s.
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jatoth
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/23 08:35:56
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Konrad,
Didn't the insmaker utility work on the JV-1080?
Or were you just trying to learn the manual process?
John
John X3e Producer, Sonar Platinum, Sweetwater CreationStation i5 3.1gHz, 12 GB RAM, 500GB SSD OS drive, 1TB SSD audio drive, 1TB archive/misc drive, dual 22" monitors, Windows 7x64, SaffirePro40 (firewire), MOTU MIDI Express XT, Behringer BCF2000, dbx 586, Samson Servo 120a, Yamaha HS80M, Auratone 5c Cubes, Sennheiser HD650, Sony MDR 7509HD, Sony MDR 7506, Kurzweil K2500XS, Roland XP-30, Proteus 2000.
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bvideo
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/23 09:11:34
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That sounds right, patch numbers end at 127. If you have the right bank numbers for patches 0-127, just add one for the bank number for patches 128-.... The higher numbered patches are the performances, after subtracting 128. Edit: the bank numbers for the patches are 10752,4,6,8 and for the performances 10753,5,7,9
post edited by bvideo - 2015/03/23 09:36:21
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soundsubs
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/23 13:47:54
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Wouldn't it be great to get an "Export All Ins Settings" from Sonar? That way we can set it up once and forget it.
Also, this would help in troubleshooting, as we could take a look at users like the OP and help out.
Sonar Platinum | modular synthesizers galoreWin 10 // Dell Xeon's | RME UFX | Maschine 2.3 | Virus TI | Roland System-1
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konradh
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/23 15:46:59
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Thanks to everyone. This issue is resolved. (Note to jatoth: Insmaker says it does not support the JV1080 or the Kurzweil PC2R. Well, actually, it lists the synths it does support and says it will not work with any others. Thanks, though.)
Here's the drill:
1. Create a ins file.
2. INS file must have a section called .Patch Names and one called .Instrument.
3. Under .Patch, you list the MIDI program numbers and the patch names (see below).
4. Under .Instrument you list the synth banks (see below).
5. Then, all you have to do is import this into Sonar and then assign the imported instrument to one or more MIDI ports/channels.
6. I ran into trouble in two spots:
• It was not clear to me in the sample files I saw that you defined the bank numbers within the INS file.
• The JV-1080 expansion card has patches that go up to 255, but an event list can only go up t0o 127, so the INS file has to have a translation like this:
[JV-1080 XP-D Bass & Drums 129-204]
0=129:Fat Rock KIT
1=130:Ringer KIT
2=131:DynaPicc.KIT
3=132:Whammer KIT
4=133:BigBalladKIT
5=134:Fat PunchKIT
6=135:Fat Funk KIT
I will send the JV1080 file to anyone who wants it. Of course, it has my particular expansion cards, but it may help you create a file for your synth.
Note that I searched online for pdfs with patch names for my synths, pasted those into Excel, and then wrote simple little formulas to put them into the required format as shown below. If you synth just needs simple numbers with no translation (like "0=Piano" instead of "0=001:Piano") and your banks only go up to 127, you should be able to paste directly into the ins file with no manipulation.
For the record, you guys all gave me great advice; unfortunately, there were just little pieces specific to my situation I had to figure out. Thanks!
***Examples of Patch and Instrument Sections***
.Patch Names
[JV-1080 PR-A]
0=001:64voicePiano
1=002:Bright Piano
2=003:Classique
3=004:Nice Piano
4=005:Piano Thang
5=006:Power Grand
6=007:House Piano
7=008:E.Grand
8=009:MIDIed Grand
9=010:Piano Blend
10=011:West Coast
11=012:PianoStrings
12=013:Bs/Pno+Brs
etc.
.Instrument Definitions
[Roland JV-1080:Patch]
Patch[10368]=JV-1080 PR-A
Patch[10369]=JV-1080 PR-B
Patch[10370]=JV-1080 PR-C
Patch[10371]=JV-1080 PR-D/GM
Patch[10752]=JV-1080 XP-A Orch I 1-128
Patch[10753]=JV-1080 XP-A Orch I 129-255
Patch[10754]=JV-1080 XP-B Pop 1-128
Patch[10755]=JV-1080 XP-B Pop 129-145
Patch[10756]=JV-1080 XP-C Orch II 1-128
Patch[10757]=JV-1080 XP-C Orch II 129-256
Patch[10758]=JV-1080 XP-D Bass & Drums 1-128
Patch[10759]=JV-1080 XP-D Bass & Drums 129-204
Patch[10240]=JV-1080 User
Patch =1..128
Note that I don't know what that last line (Patch=1..128) is for, but it was in all the samples and doesn't seem to hurt anything.
Konrad Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/ Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka. Rokit 6s.
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bvideo
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Re: ins Files with Expansion Cards
2015/03/23 18:54:08
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Well done! konradh
...
Note that I don't know what that last line (Patch
- =1..128) is for, but it was in all the samples and doesn't seem to hurt anything.
...
That should display as Patch[ * ]=1..128 (without the spaces) but the forum code discombobulated it. The asterisk means it's the default patch list when no bank has been specified.
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