is wood finish good for studio acoustics?

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offnote
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2012/10/11 02:29:07 (permalink)

is wood finish good for studio acoustics?

I am building my new studio in basement and I want to put wooden paneling in the walls and ceiling
since it'll be warm and I have seen some studio made in woods already. Any tips how to put panels to get 
most of the sound damping effect? Should the wood be painted, what kinda wood etc 
thanks
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    mattplaysguitar
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/11 02:42:52 (permalink)
    I don't know, but I'm interested. I think HOW you mount the panels would be very important. As in resonance. You could also set them up to perform some diffusion too. Or maybe you want some helmoltz resonators. Set them up with maybe an inch spacing between pannels with bass traps behind. Might help tame the lows without cutting out too much highs.

    I think this can be a big topic with lots of options on how to use wood effectively. Can you post some more details? Like dimensions and positioning of everything and budget etc.

    A smooth finish will reflect more high frequencies. A non lacquered finish would be definitely a little deader. I guess it would be fairly noticeable.

    Density of wood will surely be the main factor in types of wood response. I think you tend to see higher density woods in studios. Stronger reflections and probably give a better sound than a softer wood, I suspect.


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    offnote
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/11 05:16:26 (permalink)
    mattplaysguitar


    I think this can be a big topic with lots of options on how to use wood effectively. Can you post some more details? Like dimensions and positioning of everything and budget etc. 



    dimensions are roughly 23x15 feet and height 7.2. (or 7x4.5m height 2.20)- positions is still to be  think about since I don't have exact plans and improvising but it's going to be a rehearsal room for a small band as well as recording studio. Budget pretty much open but this is a hobby so I don't want to spent thousands :) 
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/11 08:28:19 (permalink)
    Wood paneling.... in a studio.. probably OK but you have to treat it as any other reflective surface... it needs to be balanced with the non reflecting surfaces...

    Wood paneling as a rehearsal space..... be sure it's nailed and glued down good..... if it's loose, it can cause buzzes and rattles that will drive you crazy. 

    Either way...pack lots of insulation behind it to damp it and fill the resonating cavities to keep the paneling from vibrating excessively. 

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    offnote
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/11 08:59:11 (permalink)
    good point, I didn't think about vibrating planks.

    Here are some samples I found on the net with wooden music room so it got to work.

     

     

     


    post edited by offnote - 2012/10/11 09:05:50
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/11 09:59:11 (permalink)
    The tree trunk thing is cool.....and besides looking cool, there are NO flat reflective surfaces. The planks are rounded, still appear to have bark which breaks up the reflective surfaces even more and the throw runs on the floor break up that surface..... and I'll bet it has a woodsy aroma to that room as well. 

    The bottom pic..... too much wood maybe......since it's all flat and it would appear to be a highly reflective room. 

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    AT
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/11 10:09:36 (permalink)
    Yea, Guitar, that last one looks ... woody.

    Many of the studios I've been in have lots of wood - but not all wood all the time.  The cheaper wood panelling is just a surface w/ no real weight to it.  It will reflect more sound than sheetrock and more frequencies.  Most studios have a mix or wood and something else on opposite walls less reflective or counter-spaced.

    A wood floor is always good and more useful.  A thick rug can be used against reflections, and in general the reflections go up to the ceiling.

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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/11 11:10:10 (permalink)
    I like the tree-trunk one. It might contribute some diffusion. But mostly it just looks cool.

    There is, however, nothing magical about wood, acoustically-speaking. Use it because it looks good and makes performers feel comfortable. Just be sure to glue and nail (or better, screw) as Herb suggested, to prevent rattles.


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    offnote
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/11 11:32:43 (permalink)
    bitflipper


    There is, however, nothing magical about wood, acoustically-speaking. 

    but I guess wood is way more absorbing sound then concrete or plaster wall, isn't it? 
    Also when I put very dense panels making uneven surface it will be even better.
    post edited by offnote - 2012/10/11 13:22:02
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    batsbrew
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/11 11:58:35 (permalink)
    no, smoothness of wood would be a factor for reflection.

    wood does not 'absorb' sound.

    only specially designed baffles, foam, traps, etc, 'absorb' sound.


    only MASS reduces sound transmission thru an object.

    a MASS of wood (say, 8" thickness) would start to 'STOP' sound, and even then, not as well as 8" of brick or concrete block, or even better, solid concrete panels.



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    offnote
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/11 13:21:35 (permalink)
    batsbrew


    a MASS of wood (say, 8" thickness) would start to 'STOP' sound, and even then, not as well as 8" of brick or concrete block, or even better, solid concrete panels. 



    no, don't agree -  I tested this since my basement's walls are made from almost 2 feet concrete and I have huge echo there, while in my old apartment with wooden panels no echo whatsoever. Wood absorbs sound well unless polished and painted.


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    dmbaer
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/11 14:05:49 (permalink)
    offnote


    batsbrew


    a MASS of wood (say, 8" thickness) would start to 'STOP' sound, and even then, not as well as 8" of brick or concrete block, or even better, solid concrete panels. 



    no, don't agree -  I tested this since my basement's walls are made from almost 2 feet concrete and I have huge echo there, while in my old apartment with wooden panels no echo whatsoever. Wood absorbs sound well unless polished and painted.


    I have to challenge your assertion.  I'd be willing to bet the that the difference is what the wood is attached to.  Concrete isn't going anywhere and will be highly reflective.  Wallboard has some flexibility and can absorb some energy from sound waves hitting it.  I doubt the wood finishing contributes much one way or the other.
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    AT
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/11 17:46:57 (permalink)
    of course you have an echo in your concrete basement - there is no where for the sound to go - to be absorbed - except the ceiling.  It just bounces around until it peters out.

    Your apt. room was probably pretty small, making the echos more of a reverb.  And if it was made of sheetrock and wood frame there is some absorption going on, not to mention all the doors and windows for the sound to leak out of.  In the basement, no such leaks.

    Are you talking about reflection of sound or absorption?  In such a basement, wood paneling probably won't cut down on echoes/reverb much.  Your problem is reflection already - wood might change it, but not stop it.  Bass traps in the corner and stuff to absorb and diffuse the sound rather than bouncing it back off giant slabs.

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    bitflipper
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/11 18:37:06 (permalink)
    Yes, wood absorbs sound. So does concrete, as does everything. Just not enough to matter.

    It's all about density, and wood's pretty dense, as anyone who's chopped a cord of it can attest. In at least one proper scientific test that I know of, wood floors were compared to concrete floors and found to be almost indistinguishable from one another acoustically.


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    Kev999
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/11 19:46:56 (permalink)
    offnote
    batsbrew

    a MASS of wood (say, 8" thickness) would start to 'STOP' sound, and even then, not as well as 8" of brick or concrete block, or even better, solid concrete panels. 
    no, don't agree -  I tested this since my basement's walls are made from almost 2 feet concrete and I have huge echo there, while in my old apartment with wooden panels no echo whatsoever. Wood absorbs sound well unless polished and painted.
    You need to make the distinction between soundproofing (reducing the level of sound entering or leaving the room through walls/windows/doors) and acoustic treatment (reducing and controlling the reflected sound within the room).
    post edited by Kev999 - 2012/10/12 07:28:33

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    The Band19
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/11 23:15:02 (permalink)
    He said wood. heheh ahhh hehehe "Vibrating planks" Ummm, hehehehe.  Butthead! I think my plank is starting to vibrate!


    post edited by The Band19 - 2012/10/11 23:17:55

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    offnote
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/12 03:49:43 (permalink)
    I see you all are not to fond of wood in studio so what would you recommend instead? I'm still in a design phase,
    changes are possible but I wouldn't like to put egg's boxes on the walls...
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    batsbrew
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/12 10:23:18 (permalink)
    offnote: "no, don't agree"  

     that's ok... but i stand by my statement. it's relevant ONLY to this topic tho.and wood WILL work as a good reflective surface, provided you have taken care the rest of the room. i have worked on designing hvac for professional grade studios for colleges, and i learned a little bit.

    post edited by batsbrew - 2012/10/12 10:26:29

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    bitflipper
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/12 13:24:32 (permalink)
    I like wood. The older I get the more I appreciate it.


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    offnote
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/12 13:50:53 (permalink)
    batsbrew


    offnote: "no, don't agree"  

     that's ok... but i stand by my statement. it's relevant ONLY to this topic tho.and wood WILL work as a good reflective surface, provided you have taken care the rest of the room. i have worked on designing hvac for professional grade studios for colleges, and i learned a little bit.


    This will be my first studio so I'm not gonna argue here, maybe you're right or maybe I misunderstood you. 
    Maybe we clarify what it's good for music studio first, a good reflective surface or bad reflective surface  
    I thought that bad would be better plus absorbing.


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    batsbrew
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/12 14:00:42 (permalink)
    i use audimute products for sound absorption.

    http://www.audimutesoundproofing.com/

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    michaelhanson
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/12 15:27:23 (permalink)
    I like wood. The older I get the more I appreciate it.







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    dmbaer
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/12 18:49:02 (permalink)
    bitflipper


    Yes, wood absorbs sound. So does concrete, as does everything. Just not enough to matter.

    It's all about density, and wood's pretty dense, as anyone who's chopped a cord of it can attest. In at least one proper scientific test that I know of, wood floors were compared to concrete floors and found to be almost indistinguishable from one another acoustically.


    But I believe the OP is talking about wood paneling.  That has a very thin veneer of real (or maybe fake) wood over a quarter inch (or less) of some kind of plywood or composite material.  It will have the flexiility of whatever it's glued to.  Real 3/4" thick wood is another matter entirely.
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    bapu
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/12 20:02:29 (permalink)
    bitflipper


    In at least one proper scientific test that I know of, wood floors were compared to concrete floors and found to be almost indistinguishable from one another acoustically.

    So the problem is floors.


    Or, did I just make that up?


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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/12 20:54:36 (permalink)
    For a studio, a combination of spaces and wall treatment are advantageous. Many vocal and guitar booths are wood lined. But the ideal space would have reflective and non reflective options.

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    Kev999
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/12 21:43:47 (permalink)
    Does wood have much of a dampening effect?  Recent experience tells me yes.  I have just moved house a few weeks ago and my new music room has wood panelling 1.2m high on 3 walls and hardwood sliding cupboard doors on the 4th wall.  The sound is noticeably less lively and more focused than before.  The wood is the only significant thing that is different from the previous room, which was a similar size, with a similar sized window, similar carpet, same furniture, same gear, etc.

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    AT
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/12 22:04:52 (permalink)
    What were the walls in the other room?  Concrete ;-)  And the new room?  The wainscoating might just supply reflection to go along w/ the rest of the rooms absorption if it is sheetrock. Or plaster.

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    Kev999
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/12 22:50:42 (permalink)
    AT

    What were the walls in the other room?  ...And the new room?
    Both the same: plaster, painted.  Ceilings same too.

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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/12 23:27:06 (permalink)
    mmmmm....I live in an 1850's farmhouse. The room I have my studio in is a bit of a puzzler...we have crown moldings and wainscotting around the room. The wainscoting is about 39" off the ground and that is on top of a about a foot high baseboard...the rest?

    Horse-hair plaster....

    It seems to absorb sound pretty well....

    The space you have will always be exceeded in direct proportion to the amount of stuff you have...Thornton's Postulate.

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    bitflipper
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    Re:is wood finish good for studio acoustics? 2012/10/13 00:57:40 (permalink)
    Yeh, horse-hair is hard to come by these days! 

    Some of you guys have cats. You could just start collecting cat fur and glue that to the walls. Let me know how that works out! Be sure to take some waterfall graphs before and after. I think coughed-up fur-balls might work just as well, if you're having trouble getting enough volume from the couch alone.



    EDIT: apologies to offnote. It's Friday night, if you know what I mean. But the thread was really doomed as soon as Beavis & Butthead made their appearance.
    post edited by bitflipper - 2012/10/13 00:59:45


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