lock clip midi and absolute time

Specifically, I am talking about midi clips  (I set the clip properties on H:M:S:F and absolute time). If I create the changes of tempo, in tempo map, should change the notation, not the absolute position of the midi events, I think.

Thank you very much for the reply. However, I speak English as a Spanish cow. What does it mean, in other words, "bounce the MIDI clip to it self"? 
I've also tried copying the locked clip and pasting it into another project, but absolute time is not saved.
However, the manual says:
 
"If a clip’s position is locked, and you change tempo, what happens to the clip’s position depends on what option the Clip Properties Time Base field is set to: Musical (M:B:T), or Absolute (SMPTE). If the clip is set to the Musical time base, the clip’s M:B:T position stays constant, and its Absolute position shifts. If the clip is set to the Absolute time base, its Absolute position does not move, but its M:B:T position shifts."
 
It's very simple but, it seems to me, does not work. If I change tempo, in any case, M:B:T position no shifts. Only the absolute positions of the events are shifted. Is it a bug in the program?
 Thanks so much for any advice..

Thanks. I have the Italian program and I did not understand. Anyway, I think the 'bounce to clip' command works with audio clips. It seems to me that there is no solution ...

I tried but I did not solve anything ...

Yes, I've tried everything but the result does not change ...
But are you sure it works? The manual does not say that it is necessary bouncing the clip...  

I would guess that this is intended behaviour when dealing with Absolute Time.
 
If you change the tempo you change where the notes appear on the grid. I don't think locking the clip makes any difference in this scenario
 
Change it to M:B:T and try again

I've been experimenting with this and I am getting the same result as OP. Setting the time base for MIDI clips to absolute is not working as I expect it to. An audio clip set to an absolute time base will not change if the tempo is changed. A MIDI clip set to absolute time definitely changes with a change in tempo.
 
OP should post this in problem reports.

I've been reading the effing manual. This is working the way it is supposed to work.
 
  "Note: The length of a clip may also change when you change the tempo—audio clips maintain their absolute (SMPTE) length, while a MIDI clip will follow the value in the Time Base field." 
 
So... before changing the Tempo, you must make a note of the Length of the clip in Properties as well as setting the time base to Absolute. Then after changing the tempo, reset the length to the original duration.
 
edit.... AAARgg! Nevermind. I still can't get this to work right. It does not affect the way I normally work but I can imagine this being a problem for others.
Sorry I could not help
 

I have been working on this for several hours. SONAR is not broken. It is working just as it has since at least V 8.5. A MIDI clip is always going to follow the tempo map (a quarter note is a quarter note regardless of tempo).
 
It may be easier to make this type of edit in another program (I would not know), but this is how to do it in SONAR.
 
First make sure that "selection after single split" is set to "right portion" in Preferences.
 
1. Select the clip(s) you want to work with and set the now time at the first note of the clip. Hit "Tab" which will move the cursor to the next note. Hit "S" which will split the clip with the right portion selected. Tab-S your way to the end of the clip.
2. Select all of the resulting clips. In the Inspector, Cntrl-Click (quick group) the Time Base to "Absolute" and Lock to "Pos Only".
3. Make your tempo change(s).
4. Re-select the clips (it is likely that some will move out of the selection range after the tempo change). Open the PRV and adjust the note durations as needed. Some may need to be adjusted individually.
 
I hope this is helpful. Good luck.

"Tab" moves the now time to the next note (or chord). "S" splits the clip. The object is to split the clip into separate clips for each note (or chord). The resulting clips have only one note (or chord) that can then be locked to absolute (SMPTE) time.
 
If a MIDI clip is set to a "musical" Time Base and the tempo is changed then the clip will retain it's position relative to the beat (if it starts on the downbeat of the second measure before changing the tempo, it will still start on the downbeat of the second measure after the tempo is changed).
 
If a MIDI clip is set to "Absolute" Time Base, then it will start at the same SMPTE time even after the tempo is changed (If the clip starts at 00.00.30.00 before the tempo is changed it will still start at 00.00.30.00 after the tempo is changed).
 
Either way the clip is going to follow the new tempo after it starts. If set to "musical" the clip will line up to the same bars and beats that it did before changing the tempo. If set to "absolute" the notes will be offset from the bar by an equal amount determined by the new tempo.
 
I was thinking that you want your MIDI clip to retain it's original timing even after changing the tempo. The method I described in my previous post is the only way I have found to do that.
 
 

Yes. Fit to time is likely the better answer. I knew there had to be an easier way. I just couldn't think of it.
Doh!!!

Obviously, Fit to Time was the first thing I thought. But it does not work either. Your procedure is valid if the original clip does not contain tempo changes inside (only one metronome value from start to end). But if there are tempo changes in the clip, this process erases them (in my clips tempo map there are hundreds of tempo fluctuations and I want to eliminate the changes in the tempo map without eliminating the actual timing of the clip). Simply, the lock command (absolute time) should lock the notes in their current absolute (H:M:S:F) position (and then if you change tempo map, their timing does not change, only the notation in bars change). According to the online help this is possible and simple, but unfortunately it does not work. Or maybe I do not understand the logic of the program ...?

Thank you for the explanation.
 
It appears that in your process, that the MIDI clip would have to be set to ignore tempo changes.  I am not aware of any process or setting in SONAR that allows that.  Maybe someone else does.
 
Sorry I couldn't help,
-- Ron

Actually the quoted material from the manual is fatally ambiguous. What it says is that the position of the clip should lock to absolute time. Since a clip clearly has a start point, a duration and (determined by the duration and start) an end point, one would assume that the position is most likely the start point. That does not specifically state that the duration of the clip will not change if the tempo changes. So the only thing that you can count on as far as the manual is concerned is that the start point (presumably in HMSF from the project beginning) will not change with tempo changes. It would certainly make logical sense that a locked clip will not change in any way until the lock is removed, but that question is not addressed in the quote, and there is no specific language that would indicate that whatever behavior is to be expected will differ in any way between an audio and a MIDI clip. 

I agree that what is stated in the manual can be confusing. At first, I also interpreted it the way you have. But we were wrong. It says "what happens to the clip’s position depends on what option the Clip Properties Time Base field is set to".  By position they mean the start of the clip. A MIDI clip will always follow the tempo map. I checked X3, X2, X1 and 8.5 and those versions behave the same way as Platinum does today.
 
However, the method I described in posts 18 and 20 works. Step 4 is a little time consuming but you either want to get the job done or you don't. 
 
A 5th step to complete the work is after applying the new tempo re-select all of the locked clips, cntrl-click unlock and then bounce all of the separated clips back into one clip.
 
If you have access to another program that does this more easily then you should use it.
 
Best of luck to you