looking for a work around for recording while using headphones problem

Some people find it hard to sing in tune with headphones.... that is the recommended way to do it. 

Cans let you crank the volume. Using open monitors with a mic in the room can easily create comb filtering in the final mix and is just not a good way to record vocals. 

I would suggest using the headphones and perhaps VVocal or Melodyne to fix the pitchy parts. 

Hi 7 String Guy I have encountered this a few times with some artists. Firstly IK OBi's approach will not work that well. It is a good idea in theory but in practice I am not so sure.

I did explain this once before but I will attempt to do it again. You set up a microphone but put it into a figure 8 pattern. Make sure the side of the mike that is pointing away from you is pointing into a deader part of your studio.

You set up two small speakers on stands either side of the microphone but they need to be at the same height as the microphone and some distance either side of it eg 2 feet but the same distance either side is important. The speakers can be on a 45 degree angle so they are half way between pointing at you and the null points of the mike.

You parallel up the speakers so they are playing the same thing except wire one of them out of phase to the other. You feed out to them just the basics of the track ie some drums, bass and some chordal instrument. Keep the stuff in the speakers minimal. No solos or anything like that.

Record your vocals. Due to the deep null points in the mike and the fact the speakers are out of phase you will get very very very very little backing music on the vocal track. In fact you will be surprised how little and the backing can be reasonably loud when you are doing this too but experiment.

This is the best way to do it by far and it works a treat.

This is also great for recording a group of children too without headphones. Turn the speakers so they are facing the mike null points and put half the children either side of the mike. This is how you get a group of kids to record to a backing track and you don't want any backing track on the children vocal track.

IK Obi


Actually you can record a dynamic mic on a stand and use the monitors instead of headphones. Then record the song again without vocals, leaving the mic the same as before and flip phase on the two tracks leaving you with just vocals. If done right that is.

What an excellent idea!! And then bounce the two flipped phased tracks to a single track?


BTW, maybe the singer ought to stand in the same place whilst re-recording the music again, just to be sure the empty space does not some how affect the outcome of the resulting track?

Hi Bapu I should have clarified things a bit better I am sorry. I have spent endless hours trying things like this rerecording tracks, flipping phase and all sorts of things and really to no avail. It does not work that well. I think what Matt is saying is important and that is that the room needs to be pretty dead for this to work better. If you record the backing tracking a second time around without the vocals then how do you know that sound is going to bounce around the room exactly the same way the second time? You don't really so what you end up with often is making the backing track louder!

My approach works the best simply because there is so little backing track left on the vocals you can simply stop there and you don't have to do anything further! You can pop a downward expander on the vocal track in mixdown so any spill in between vocal phrases is also knocked out as well. While the vocals are present you certainly wont notice the backing because the ratio of vocals to the backing is so high.

It is also good to get the vocalist pretty close to the mike as well when you are doing this to really improve the vocal to backing track balance.

The only problem with my setup is you need the two small speakers up on stands and a mono power amp. I used mike stands to do it and also it is good if the speakers don't have a lot of top end coming out of them as well. If you have got quality speakers there patch an EQ in series with them and limit the top end that way.

I used to have a really hard time singing with headphones. 
It turned out to be a mixing/volume issue.  I stripped out most of the instruments, leaving just enough basic tracks to keep my relative pitch.  Very often i just left a little percussion, keys, and a rhythm guitar.  Then I carefully set the volume, EQ, reverb, etc specifically for THAT vocal mix.  It really helped a lot.
After recording the vocal track, i'd then bring back all the instrumentation that was throwing me off.

It may not work for you, but it could be worth a try.

I always had issue tracking vocal w/ headphones - I'm always flat. In my case, bass doesn't help, it actually seems to make thing worst. That being said, I have a pretty low voice, so this may be less of an issue for anyone with a more "regular" type of voice.

I have to be very careful how much I let in. Dropping the volume and cutting back a bit on the low frequencies seem to help a bit. I sometimes add a guide track, basically just the melody on the piano, as a reference. Still, it's never easy.

When all else fails... Marry a singer and let her do the singing. That's what I'm doing. ;)

I agree with Rain - bass doesn't help.  And that seems insane to me, because I'm a bass player.  But honestly, if I'm going to nail the vocal, I need either guitar or piano.  I don't have an issue singing with cans.  My ability to suck is equal in all mediums.

Unfortunately, I have some video proof of me singing a consistent quarter-tone flat throughout entire songs.  I remember those gigs - I could not hear the guitar well enough.  If nothing else, I've got something educational to show my kids:  "Here boys, this is how you butcher a Lionel Richie ballad."

Jeff Evans


Slugbaby you are correct in what you say about keeping minimal things in the headphones (or speakers in this case) while you are tracking. But I believe the bass is a vital instrument to have present while you track vocals. They say it really helps to pitch against. (it can even be a tad higher than normal too) In your post you have left the bass out or did you forget that. Next time you are tracking vocals try putting in just bass, drums and a chordal instrument, you might be surprised.

Thanks Jeff.  I don't recall if I kept bass in or not.  Really, i think the important point is to minimize the clutter, and get a good frequency mix that doens't deflect how you hear your voice.

Rain
When all else fails... Marry a singer and let her do the singing. That's what I'm doing. ;)
.

I did that too.  Unfortunately she's an opera singer and doesn't appreciate the inflections and tonality required for pop/rock music.  It caused too many arguments and hurt feelings.  Neither of us wants to work together on a musical project again, our opinions are too different and stubborn. 
Good luck with yours!

Rain

Slugbaby

Rain

When all else fails... Marry a singer and let her do the singing. That's what I'm doing. ;)
.

I did that too.  Unfortunately she's an opera singer and doesn't appreciate the inflections and tonality required for pop/rock music.  It caused too many arguments and hurt feelings.  Neither of us wants to work together on a musical project again, our opinions are too different and stubborn. 
Good luck with yours!

She's also an opera singer - coloratura soprano. But she also fronts a metal band and she's equally home singing pop, classic rock or doing the Nina Hagen stuff. It'd be hard to argue - and she'd win, anyway. lol


Glad to read that I'm 
1: not the only one with intonation problems when I use headphones
2: not the only one thinking that bass can lead to all sorts of problems.


As a matter of fact, whenever I work with cans, not necessarily singing, after a while, I sometimes completely "lose" the bass - like, I can't tell what key it's in, as if I suddenly become tone deaf. That's usually when I need to take a break - and maybe put a light low cut on the buss. 

So if I have to sing in tune, bass definitely isn't my reference.

No, you're not the only one with intonation problems with headphones.  I struggled with this for years until I gave up and just started using the monitors and I just deal with the bleed.  the bleed is very minimal anyway.
 
I also don't like bass in my reference track.  Like bit, I tend to cut out everything except piano or guitar and drums - sometimes even just a good solid click track with a heavy "mallet" sound for the beat.

@Jeff Evans It works. http://ronansrecordingsho...dphones-in-the-studio/

Yeah your technique is something I'm going to try the next chance I get :)