Guys,
 
Some good opinions needed please. Couple questions.
Got to bite the bullet and retire my solid M-Audio 1010LT.  PCI slot and need to upgrade the computer with PCI all but obsolete. Any experience with the PCI to PCIex converters or am I beating a dead horse.
 
Was looking otherwise at the 2nd gen Focusrite 18i20 USB 2 hardware and saw Jesse's post on the failed 1st gen.
 
Is there any reason not to go with the Focusrite?  Current sale is $449 new and mostly good reviews.
 
My understanding is that waiting for USB 3 is a waste because it won't deliver incremental better performance even through there are a few specs that look good on paper. There's Thunderbolt and the old Firewire but seems like USB 2 will carry a good load. Just got the jitters getting away from a hard wired card. I know this topic has been beaten up in the past, so asking more about where we are currently that would change recommendations.
 
Thanks,
John

No complaints here. I use the Firewire version of the same interface, but USB vs. FW is the only difference. It's actually been more solid than its predecessor, a MOTU that cost twice as much.

Thanks Bit, and hope you are also out of the current heatwave. Blazing 68 degrees on the coast. Dog days of summer...
 
Firewire so many advantages in speed and stability over USB 2. Unless building a session one track at a time where the advantage seems to wash out, USB can't keep up (even the older Firewire 400 seems to run theoretical rings around USB 2). Last 18i20 is USB 2 with no Firewire port. Don't know how much of a speed hit USB 2 will impose even over the older Firewire standard. Like got a fast computer but the bottleneck in USB 2 causing latency, pops, crackles because it can only go so fast. Argument about USB 2 versus waiting for USB 3 still rages. USB 3 interface in some opinions wiping out Firewire 800. Others claiming there will be no benefit. Analogy was put forth that if you got a package to be delivered, USB 2 is a car. USB 3 is a big truck. No matter how big the vehicle, it will still only deliver the package in the same time frame, so no advantage to be had. This why the industry is not keen on implementing USB 3.
 
Any enlightenment thrown my way is appreciated.
 
John
 

I'm in exactly the same position: Upgrading my venerable studio DAW, currently enjoying great performance with the current PCI audio interface from ECHO (Layla 3G). 
 
The USB2 interfaces from Focusrite are on my radar also, but I wonder about being able to achieve good RTL. I think we have to just bite the bullet and find out.

My only experience with the Focusrite boxes was helping a friend install one of their entry level 2 in 2 out boxes (no midi port). Latency was good, win 10 on an older i3.  I was impressed by the clean, transparent sound quality. Can thus assume that the 18i20 will work well.
 
Hard to abandon my setup with the 1010LT wired with a 2496. Same driver, 10 audio input channels and rock solid. Reality set in when the Fathom synth demo sounded like a popcorn popper. The dev asked me the specs of my 10 year old Vostro and told me that it may have some antique value.
 
Still trying to find some information or recommendations on the PCI to PCIex adapters. They do exist and require a minor metalwork project because the adapter raises the height of the slot. Just don't know what the downside would be. Otherwise, Bit's thumbs up on Focusrite carries a lot of weight. Best option I have seen so far.
 
John

>> Still trying to find some information or recommendations on the PCI to PCIex adapters. 
 
That's an avenue of investigation that did not occur to me. Interesting idea.
 
I've ordered a Scarlett 6i6 from Sweetwater. Small investment in a decent interface which will be handy for portable applications in the future, if it works out. Also has resale value. In the meantime I'll find out what kind of performance i can expect from USB2 on my current DAW. 
(When I upgrade the DAW itself, i figure performance can only improve with the faster CPU, etc.)
 
One thing to note is that, if possible, you should use a dedicated USB2 hub for the audio interface. There's a couple of USB hub enumerators that can help map out which external USB port on the box is connected to each hub controller, USB1 or USB2, or USB3, etc.
 
 

JohnKenn
 
Reality set in when the Fathom synth demo sounded like a popcorn popper. The dev asked me the specs of my 10 year old Vostro and told me that it may have some antique value.

I understand the feeling there.  I picked up Fathom Pro on sale, and it is a beast!  It does seem to be very CPU hungry, and I get the pops if I let the polyphony get too high, regardless of my audio buffer settings.  And I am still running a FireWire audio interface on my desktop.

Fathom is a great synth. I was able to get it working much better on an older generation i5 and 8GB RAM going thru a Presonus Audiobox 22VSL. Not a great fan of the Presonus box though and looking at the Focusrite to replace it.
 
Here are a couple links to the PCIex to PCI adapters. One got a negative review because the old card didn't fit, but this is a given and why a minor adjustment to the case with a hacksaw is necessary. Nothing noted on how well they work. Don't cost that much. Could be worth a try to hang onto what already works well.
 
https://www.neweggbusiness.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIV10D7167649&nm_mc=KNC-GoogleBizMKPL-PC&cm_mmc=KNC-GoogleBizMKPL-PC-_-pla-_-Add-On+Cards-_-9SIV10D7167649&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI3vnGlpfe3AIVibfsCh1dSgd_EAQYBSABEgJYyvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
 
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Startech-com-PEX1PCI1-PCI-Express-to-PCI-Adapter-Card/13216248?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=0&adid=22222222227000296254&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=c&wl3=42534089072&wl4=pla-81190916672&wl5=9033014&wl6=&wl7=&wl8=&wl9=pla&wl10=8175035&wl11=online&wl12=13216248&wl13=&veh=sem
 
Stickman, please update on how the 6i6 works for you.
 
John
 

My iMac machine has got the Focusrite 18i20 as the interface and it is excellent. Jesse's experience with the 1st gen is very rare and unusual for sure. Do not base anything on that. 
 
Latency is pretty reasonable with the 18i20. It has lots of ins and outs and Focusrite Control is also very versatile. Mic Pre quality is excellent BTW so don't let anyone tell you otherwise. 
 
PreSonus are now making USB 3 interfaces and they will have improved latency for sure.  They are taking advantage of the faster speed.  It will be in the order of a fast interface running on thunderbolt on a Mac e.g. Focusrite Clarett can get under 2 mS latency over thunderbolt on my iMac here. 
 
PCI based interfaces are still great and RME are the people to look into for that. I have got around 2mS now with my PCI RME interface in my Win 7 machine. It is way fast. The PCI buss is pretty quick. Plus it gets the interface right away from the USB buss which often has a raft of other stuff running at the same time on the same port.  Also you can never accidentally disconnect a PCI based interface either.  RME PCI (and PCIe) interfaces are dead silent as well and sound as stellar as any of their other models. 

Thank you Jeff. Good points. Only confusion on my part is the claim that USB 3 will have greater bandwidth but have no effect on the speed of transfer as relates to latency, thus why most developers have not jumped to design for USB 3 because of negligible benefit.