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  • Thoughts on Bonham playing technique while recording..... (p.6)
2013/04/29 12:47:54
UbiquitousBubba
Anyway,

I agree with much of what has been said about tuning.  I used to spend a massive amount of time exploring all of the tuning permutations with my kit.  I'd find the sweet spot for each drum.  I have an old Ludwig kit with a Gretsch snare.  Drum heads can make a big difference in the sound.  I personally like the Remo Pinstripes for the toms and the Evans Ambassador for the snare drum batter head.  I like drums that are bright, ring out, and fit melodically with each other.

Several years ago, I got together with some friends to play in a basement.  The bass player had a large drum kit (7 toms) that I loved.  He said he couldn't get it to sound right.  I put new heads on it and spent an afternoon tuning it.  When I was done, he said it sounded like a completely different kit.  He hadn't thought it could sound that good.  I didn't really do anything other than put some responsive heads on there and tune to find the optimum pitch of each drum. 

Hope that helps.
2013/04/29 22:55:16
Jeff Evans
Hey Danny and others here too. I have been busy making music so have not been here for a while. Firstly I am sorry for going off topic a bit. I suppose getting back to it using the right amount of power with cymbals is interesting and I agree that quieter cymbal playing can be an advantage.

But I would like to put into perspective the points I was making re technique effecting drum sounds. The other day I walked past my TV and I saw a serious powerhouse rock band playing. Everybody was really laying into their instruments, drummer included. And I thought you know Danny must think I am mad!  He is so right in that in a case like this none of the stuff I was referring to would have any effect on the drum sound. I agree there for sure. Apart from groove of course I would have sounded the same.

But talking to my son again this morning about it he said 'touch' is the important word here. The stuff I am talking about is when the dynamics of the playing come way down and we are into some very delicate playing and tone control etc. I still stand by what I say, it does all apply especially in a Jazz situation. He even demonstrated the difference between two stick approaches on a ride cymbal and it was cheese and chalk. One sound was louder, fuller, clearer the other was thin whimpy etc. Yet all he did was change his grip and how he was moving his wrist.

(Interesting thing here was how a drum teacher in his high school years gave him the wrong info for maximising the sound. He worked all this out much later studying his degree)

So there it is. Technique does effect the sound but only in certain situations. I think once you start hitting pretty loud and hard Danny is right too in that you cannot be whimpy about things either. You do have play with a certain degree of authority and just smack things hard to get a good sound.

In fact I recorded my son recently playing drums to 4 pop and rock songs I am currently producing for a client and he was smacking them hard. At first I though he might have been too loud but not on playback, they just kick ass and for that situation it is exactly what was needed. He is smart and skilled enough to know when to do what.

Another point about tuning too. Sonor drums do not just have one sweet spot for the toms. That sweet sound works over a much wider range of tunings from quite low to high. But I guess that is what you get when you spend 15K (yes that is what my kit is currently worth now! 10 ply rosewood shells! the 2nd most expensive model Sonor actually make. But they are soooo good you can put any microphone anywhere on that kit and drum sound is just killer and I mean killer)
2013/04/30 07:35:35
The Maillard Reaction


I was shopping in a Sam Ash drum room once and this young counter clerk looks me in the eye and says

"I have a SONOR snare... it is worth over $40k now a days"...  and I was like "uh, I have a REMO Ambassador, coated, that I bought at Guitar Center"




:-)
What is it with SONOR drum guys? Have they all decided to leave the price tags on their kits? :-)
:-)



2013/04/30 07:57:12
Jeff Evans
40K sounds a lot for a snare. I think there might be an extra zero on there. In fact I don't think there is even a Sonor snare at $4K either. I know mine are in the $1.5 to $2K bracket. I have a rosewood snare and a metal snare too. That is amazing.

No we just like our drums a lot Mike. Sonor produced much cheaper lines which are much less expensive these days. But back around 1980 they produced the Bubinga wood series (top of the line) 

https://www.google.com.au/search?q=sonor+bubinga+drums&hl=en&rlz=1G1GGLQ_ENAU266&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=e7B_UZTXFuajiAek8IGwCQ&ved=0CDkQsAQ&biw=1280&bih=905


and the rosewood series.

https://www.google.com.au/search?q=sonor+rosewood+drums&rlz=1G1GGLQ_ENAU266&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=5K5_UcyyIqiOiAf4nIHYAw&ved=0CDwQsAQ&biw=1280&bih=905

These lines are the sort of Rolls Royce of Sonor drums and drums in general.

I am about to start playing mine live again in a new Johnny Cash, Roy Orbison and Elvis tribute show.

But in reference to what Danny was saying when the drums are nice it makes a difference too and these drums are nice.

I have worked with different heads. The pinstripe being one great sounding head on these drums especially in a rock situation. But these days I am just using good ol coated Ambassador heads and they sound very good. The tuning range is wide so the drums can be tuned up for Jazz and down low pretty quick for rock. Just change the snare over and tweak the bass drum down for a full rock tone.  I can get away with just using one kit but cover a range of styles musically. I find the tone control hoops very effective for close live PA work and studio stuff. But take them off and you get a lovely rounded open undamped tom sound which is great for Jazz styles etc..This is something few kits can achieve. A lot of other kits are often setup for one type of sound and it's great but not easily and quickly changed. One of the reasons I got them was their ability to change their sound so quick as I was doing a lot of freelance work at one point and never knew what I was in for until I got there.





2013/04/30 08:11:52
The Maillard Reaction


"I am about to start playing mine live again in a new Johnny Cash, Roy Orbison and Elvis tribute show."




That seems as if it is going to be a lot of fun!!!


:-)
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