• SONAR
  • DUPLICATE command for SONAR (p.2)
2016/05/04 11:14:12
bronsoncox
Anderton
miracledee
Duplicate tool is particularly useful when you arrange samples on the audio track itself (to form a 1 bar rythm) and then duplicate it , add some variation to some samples, then duplicate...add variation & so on. 

 
It sounds like you're describing successive duplications rather than duplicating a clip multiple times with a single command. If that's the case, I don't understand how what you describe is different from bouncing the samples to create a clip, then ctrl+drag to duplicate the clip for modifying, followed by successive ctrl+drag/modify operations. Ctrl+drag takes the same number of keystrokes as Ctrl+B.
 



Keystrokes, yes. Time, not necessarily. (but, I appreciate how you carefully worded that)
 
I can Ctrl+SomeKey repeatedly a lot quicker than I can Ctrl+Drag a new clip into place. Not to mention if you're working on something where grid snap is not enabled (or a clip that needs to extend beyond a grid border), you have to try and massage the new clip to sit flush against the original, without accidentally creating a crossfade. Maybe there is a magnetic/landmark snap setting that can be adapted for that?
 
Versus the behavior of most duplicate functions I've seen that, by default, will duplicate the clip butted up next to the first and so on as you continue to replay the keystroke.
 
Same with Groove Clipping. Turn it into a loop, now I need to make 1 bar repeat 64 times. Grab the edge and hang on for dear life (wait, was that bar 72? crap!). Hopefully, I haven't forgotten any pitch markers that would bork it.
 
 
I still don't understand why the SOP around here seems to be demonizing someone that suggests a feature or workflow that "DAW" has which Sonar does not by passive-aggressively criticizing them for not using 2 or 3 workarounds to accomplish it. They are called workarounds because you are working around the fact that feature does not exist in the software.
 
There's been many times using Sonar I've thought, man, I wish I could just highlight this region and Ctrl+D 11 more times...
 
May the 4th be with you.
2016/05/04 12:21:37
John
We answered the way we did in response to a question. If we were really adverse to a feature request there wouldn't be an entire forum dedicated to it. When a question is posted here its handled as such. Unless there really isn't a possible answer. In that case we will move it to the feature requests forum.
 
 
2016/05/04 12:36:45
pwalpwal
John
We answered the way we did in response to a question. If we were really adverse to a feature request there wouldn't be an entire forum dedicated to it. When a question is posted here its handled as such. Unless there really isn't a possible answer. In that case we will move it to the feature requests forum.
 

it wasn't a question - did you read the op?
2016/05/04 12:48:37
John
The title is. Yes I did read the OP. I actually went to some trouble trying to help the OP out. When something is posted here and there is an answer the forum tries to provide it. 
 
As a user I knew that what the OP wanted to do was doable in Sonar. Perhaps not in the way the OP wanted but very doable. Therefor I answered as I believed the answer to be. 
 
Why people find fault when no fault is intended or done is beyond my understanding. Offering a way to do something is not cause for recriminations.    
2016/05/04 12:53:09
...wicked
Agreed. For the record the Dupe command is great, and makes building up your sections very fast.
 
In SONAR I use the CTRL+drag method. Same amount of keystrokes? Yah maybe until you account for the dragging motion. Plus, most of the time you drift vertically and then you have to spend time lining everything up right. It takes longer, way longer.
 
This really starts to show it's benefit when you build your drums up on separate tracks. making a quick 1 measure hi-hat pattern, then dupe dupe dupe you're done. Same with kick and snare. I've gotten pretty fast with the mouse so it doesn't bother me too much but a key command for this with some options would be super swell.
2016/05/04 13:00:15
pwalpwal
John
The title is. Yes I did read the OP.

no, the title of the thread is a statement, and the op is a feature request, a la "i'd like to do this..." and not "how do i do something like this..." - it's about the workflow rather than the achieved effect
2016/05/04 13:10:18
John
One can choose to see it in anyway they want. If a question mark had been on the title how would have viewed it? 
There is no argument here. There can not be one. I explained why I answered the way I did. I'm sure Craig did the same for much the same reasons. There was never a thought given to the notion that Sonar didn't have a feature. Rather we were trying to give our best knowledge on how to do this. It a matter of perspective.  
2016/05/04 13:20:15
pwalpwal
John
One can choose to see it in anyway they want. If a question mark had been on the title how would have viewed it? 


it wasn't a question - did you read the op?
2016/05/05 02:34:20
miracledee
Based on the ctrl+drag suggestion, I did a little test.
I created a simple 1bar beat in Sonar. Kick, hats, snare on 3 different audio tracks.
Same arrangement done in FLStudio Playlist view.
 
Now I measured the time it took for me to make 7 more copies of the 1bar beat (for a total of an 8bar section).
First Sonar (ctrl+drag) - result : 15seconds
Next FL (ctrl+B) - result : 3seconds.
The difference is considerable.
2016/05/05 10:19:21
Anderton
miracledee
Based on the ctrl+drag suggestion, I did a little test.
I created a simple 1bar beat in Sonar. Kick, hats, snare on 3 different audio tracks.
Same arrangement done in FLStudio Playlist view.
 
Now I measured the time it took for me to make 7 more copies of the 1bar beat (for a total of an 8bar section).
First Sonar (ctrl+drag) - result : 15seconds
Next FL (ctrl+B) - result : 3seconds.
The difference is considerable.



Well of course, that's obvious. But I don't understand the point of a test that doesn't relate at all to what I said, which was "It sounds like you're describing successive duplications rather than duplicating a clip multiple times with a single command. If that's the case..." because you said "duplicate it, add some variation to some samples, then duplicate...add variation & so on."
 
In the context of what you seemed to be describing, with snap on it takes 1200 ms in SONAR to click a clip and drag it to the right so it snaps to the end of the existing clip. To click on the clip and type a keyboard command takes about 800 ms. I verified this by doing a screen movie grab and putting it on the Vegas timeline. So I think what I presented was a reasonable workaround. 400 ms is negligible compared to the time you'll spend creating the variations in between copies.
 
Now make 8 copies of a 1-bar loop by ctrl+B compared to dragging a loop out to 8 measures and let me know which is faster. Different techniques are faster for different contexts.
 
I never said it wouldn't be useful to have an additional keyboard shortcut to duplicate a clip. But at least for now, SONAR doesn't have one. However there are three ways to duplicate clips and they were mentioned in case you're not aware of them. None of us can know what you know or don't know about SONAR, all we can do is make suggestions for ways to accomplish what you want.
 
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