Hi All,
 
So, I've been having a bit of a time lately trying to dial in a 3 band fully parametric Eq on my live vocal monitor while i'm singing. I've got it generally dialed in and it sounds pretty good, no feedback issues or any obvious problem frequencies. Though, i'm sure it can be tuned in to my voice a little better, but i can't really hear what I need to do while i'm singing. I'ts like my own voice is distracting me or something. Having trouble finding ideal center frequency and bandwidth.
 
The guys in the band are not very "Eq savvy" and wouldn't be of much help.
Is anybody familiar with this and could suggest a few pointers?
 
Thanks

Record yourself singing on that mic and then send back out from your computer to the PA so you can listen back and tweak it as needed.
Or.... wing it, which is what you are doing now.

Center frequency and bandwidth.....?  You're over complicating and over thinking this.
 
Start with everything flat. Adjust from there only as needed.
 
While that sounds like simple advice, yeah, it is. But I also understand that it's just not that easy in a live situation.
 
Chuck's advice is good. If no one else in the band is EQ savvy....  that may be your best option.
 
Then you have to ask the question.... if you're playing gigs in places without having a soundman to run the system from the audience POV..... just how critical is it to have "perfect EQ" on the vocals? Get feedback from the audience. They will often tell you honestly what they think although I doubt if you will get specific feedback such as "you have a 500hz midrange bump "...... so as long as they are happy and not complaining that you sound like you're singing through a telephone connection..... it's all good.
 
If you can hear yourself clearly on stage with no feedback or ringing.... it's good.  Unless you are using the same model speakers for monitors as you are for the FOH, you can not determine what it sounds like out front without being out there.
 
I used to do a solo act with just an acoustic and me singing. I would simply set up the PA and monitors. I would then shut off the monitors and listen to the sound of the guitar and my vocals "in the room". That would give me a fairly good representation of what the mix and EQ sounded like. I would then add my monitors to the stage and get them to where I was comfortable with the levels and no ringing in the system. I could EQ the 2 parts differently. But the FOH was always set first. The rooms I played varied from carpeted to concrete, and large to small.... so each one was different.  But I set the system up following the same procedure each time.
 
Hope this helps. Just don't obsess over this. As long as the audience can hear your vocals, it's generally good.

"If you can hear yourself clearly on stage with no feedback or ringing.... it's good.  Unless you are using the same model speakers for monitors as you are for the FOH, you can not determine what it sounds like out front without being out there."
 
What a concept for small venue gigs...this makes sense to me. As much as I hate what wireless does for my guitar sound, I would use it to run live sound at small venue gigs. I hear you on the not so savvy band mates, either you have the ambition, gumption and finances to take on the additional responsibilities and work load of running sound or you're one of the guys that wants to just show up and play.
 
Rocky

I've played in bands that used FOH sound techs and played in many that did not. You have to figure out how to do it all yourself on those small gigs and still sound good. Lower volume also helps.

Before you can do anything in regards to making your own voice sound good through a foldback speaker, the sound of the foldback speaker needs to be investigated and adjusted if necessary and all before anything else is attempted.
 
I use a high quality reference track to tune FOH speaker systems.  I also use the same reference track to feed and setup foldback speakers .
 
One never really knows how a foldback speaker sounds on a quality music mix.  They tend to vary a bit more so than FOH speakers.  (I have heard some bad ones!)  Although I am hearing better quality foldback sound in general.  Thanks to pretty classy full range foldback monitors that sound killer nowadays.
 
I use two Steely Dan albums as my PA reference material.  The last two digital produced albums only.  'Two Against Nature' and 'Everything Must Go' Both are great.  But there are many great reference mixes to use. (Not all music is good for FOH and monitor alignment)
 
Set the CD mixer channel so there is no EQ anywhere and try sending that mix to the foldback speaker.  You need to stand in front of it now and listen to how it really sounds.  The foldback EQ should be flat at this point too.  The better the foldback speaker the nicer sounding that mix is.  Now the thing to do is to set that foldback EQ now to make up for peaks and troughs in the foldback sound.  Try and carefully use a few sliders on your graphic to improve the sound of that speaker.  Move one slider at a time only and keep the number you need to move down to a minimum as well eg two or three.  If you think there might be a peak somewhere try and figure where and pull that frequency down 3 or 4 dB only at first.  If a slider does not seem to have any effect then try the frequencies either side of it. If you feel there is a deficiency somewhere identify that too and add some slight boost there. Same 3 or 4 dB to start.
 
After a little foldback EQ the sound of that mix can be better now.  What you are after is a smooth well balanced frequency response of the whole mix from reasonable lows up through clean and clear mids and on up to nice smooth crisp top end too.  Not too much highs but just subtle amounts as they are in the actual mix of these tracks.
 
For foldback I generally add some extra roll off for lows down the bottom end  (this is important, it eases the low end in the monitor naturally bringing up mids and highs)  and some roll off for tops too after about 7 K or so (and steeply)  just to stop and high freq feedback squeal should it happen.  (be careful not to roll off too soon up high, as the music will sound dull, keep the response in up to say 7 K and then steep it down fast)
 
Now try sending your own voice into that well tuned speaker now and see how it sounds.  If you are sending post EQ then any mixer channel EQ's will effect the sound.  Or try sending the pre send as you normally would.  I have always found once the foldback speaker is tuned a bit then sending in even a pre EQ SM58 most often sounds very nice.  Try adding a hint of reverb to your foldback mix.  Not too long (reverb time) say 2.5 secs or so.  You should be lovin the sound of your voice by now.
 
Anything else after that is all about how you feel about your own voice and if and when you start to hear how your own voice sounds and then you should be really liking it by about now so you get into your ultimate vocal performances.  By then you should not be too worried about how any foldback speaker sounds.  You are immersed in the music of it all. If the foldback is sounding good then it only adds to the experience.

I was going to say what Jeff just did but not in the good detail he provided.  You need to reference the speakers with something you are familiar with first.  Then, for vocal, use your high/lo pass like you may always do and then start checking the mids and high of your voice by seeing how your s's and t's sound.  

Thanks for all the responses. I should have said this is at rehearsal.
 
Many of you hit the nail right on the head... The band is very loud, too loud. Often times, i can not hear myself clearly. Instead of just cranking up more volume, i'm trying to clear away any frequencies that create mud and maybe push some forward to help me cut through, without thinning it out.
 
The room is really small. Iv'e asked the band to turn down a bunch of times, they might be getting tired of hearing it.
I also asked the guitarist to stop playing licks and unnesessary stuff while i'm singing, cluttering up the pocket and burrying the vocal. He plays like one would at a jam with no singer. But anyway, that's a whole other topic...
 
"You have to figure out how to do it all yourself on those small gigs and still sound good."
 
Yep, that's what i'm trying to do.
Thanks again for the comments and suggestions.
 
 

Maybe i shouldv called the thread, 'how to hear yourself in your monitor'

M@ B
Thanks for all the responses. I should have said this is at rehearsal.
 
Many of you hit the nail right on the head... The band is very loud, too loud. Often times, i can not hear myself clearly. Instead of just cranking up more volume, i'm trying to clear away any frequencies that create mud and maybe push some forward to help me cut through, without thinning it out.
 
The room is really small. Iv'e asked the band to turn down a bunch of times, they might be getting tired of hearing it.
I also asked the guitarist to stop playing licks and unnesessary stuff while i'm singing, cluttering up the pocket and burrying the vocal.
 

Sounds like your band mates have a lot of lessons yet to learn. 
 
At this point in my life, I've been there, done that so many times with bands that...well, now, ... unless the pickers have some sense of decorum and respect for each other, and know how to make it sound good without caving in their eardrums, and the courtesy to not "jam" in the middle of a singers verse or practice their drum fills and guitar riffs when the band is discussing something important about the song or even between songs........... well, I have better things to do. That would be the last time I "jammed" with them.
 
Playing with mature professionals is such a pleasure.....playing with amateurs who still have lessons to learn..... not so pleasurable. My main sticking point issue these days when I do jam with others, is the volume issue..... can you make it sound good at a decent volume? Making it loud is easy and very often, volume is used to cover for inability to play.... making it sound good at a lower volume takes a professional.
 
In addition, hearing what you are doing is so much easier at lower volumes.
 
May be it's time for a serious set down talk about a few things.
 
 
I saw a band once, at a battle of the bands..... they were so loud that we had to take everything out of the PA except the lead singer.... the PA was pretty big and had plenty of power. But the stage volume was overwhelming. They were so loud in fact, that half the band was playing the verse and the other half was in the chorus and didn't know it because they couldn't hear what the guy 10 feet away was doing. We asked them to turn down...... nope...that wasn't happening.... They stumbled through their 15 minutes of stage time......not being able to hear, and out front, we tried as best we could to get the singer's vox up on top of the mix.  (Note: our band had one of the biggest PA's around and due to some circumstances.... the second day finals were rained out and had to be moved to another weekend, they needed to rent a large PA and so they rented our PA for the finals 2 weeks later. Our FOH tech ran the board with their sound tech watching and advising)